I voted Glavine-300 wins.  Here are the active strikeout leaders.  Maddux and Schilling have just made it.  Smoltz and Mussina have a chance in the next 3 years. Here is the list of active wins leaders.  Maddux made it to 300 with room to spare.  Randy Johnson has an outside shot at it.  After that, nobody.

If Roy Halladay or Roy Oswalt has a great career, they'll probably end up with between 250 and 275 wins.  To get 300 wins now, you have to be either utterly dominant from age 22 like Roger Clemens or else very, very good and remarkably healthy like Glavine. 

Well, I voted Hoffman for the pure and simple kitschy reason that nobody's ever done it before ...500 saves! Forget "impressive," that's downright insane.

No love for the thievery of Kenny L, huh?

I had to look at the list you linked to, Mike, of active leading winners. So of the current top 32 winningest active pitchers, only Kevin Millwood and Livan Hernandez, who each have 123 wins, are 32 or younger (both are 31)? Colon and Hampton are 33 and injury-plagued; Radke is 33 and retiring. Pettitte and Pedro -- speaking of possible retirement and injury issues -- are both 34.

For the record, Hernandez is listed as 58 days younger than Millwood, though again, that number is somewhat suspect.

But you know what? I've been hearing about the death of the 300-game winner since I was in grade school, and that was before Seaver and Carlton and Niekro and Sutton, much less Clemens and Maddux. I bet there are two or three guys active right now who will win 300 (who aren't there already or on the cusp like Glavine) ... but who will they be? That's the question for J.P. and Theo and those guys to grapple with.

Trevor Hoffman for me.  500 saves is the same as 50 a year for 10 years, or 25 for 20. Given closers don't keep their jobs for that long normally it becomes very, very hard to do.

Rivera will probably make it, Wagner needs 186 and he is 35 next season, Danys Baez is the highest for someone who will be 30 or younger next year at 111. 

K-Rod is the next closer after Wagner with a realistic shot at 500.  It isn't easy.

For his career, Hoffman has pitched 885 innings with a 149 ERA+. Over that same time, Glavine has pitched 3032 innings with an ERA+ of approximately 128. I'm more impressed with Glavine, but others may prefer bigger leverage indexes.

Speaking of the former Atlanta co-ace... Maddux & Glavine, Toronto '07!

Sure, it could happen that someone now pitching would win 300 games.  Jeremy Bonderman and Felix Hernandez are off to nice starts.  But, I don't think that anyone between age 25 and 35 will do it. 

Well, I voted Hoffman for the pure and simple kitschy reason that nobody's ever done it before ...500 saves! Forget "impressive," that's downright insane.

I can't get too excited about saves.  It seems to be to be a very contrived stat and is subject to managerial whims.  I'm not at all sure that Hoffman's impressive save stats makes him any better than the other top relievers of his era.  Is he any better than Eckersley, Gagne, Wagner, Rivera, K-Rod, Nathan, Ryan etc

Is he any better than ...

Measured how? For one game? Give me Eck or Mo, sure. For one season? All the guys you mentioned are right there. But over a career -- and that's what this stat is, a career stat -- he is essentially unmatchable as a closer.

If I counted right, he is working on a current streak of 11 healthy seasons with at least 30 saves (he missed 2003 but for a couple of token appearances) ... Eck's best run was six, Rivera's five ... or, if you add those together, 11, just like Hoffman. Don't get me wrong, I'd take Rivera over anyone, any time, but the career saves stat is valuable as a heuristic for the entirety of the career and Hoffman's mark is nonpareil at this point.

I agree with your general point Mick, but the "healthy seasons" distinction is about the goofiest thing I've ever heard - you're penalizing Rivera for being healthy enough to log 46 innings and 28 saves in 2002, while crediting Hoffman for being injured enough to pitch only 9 innings in 2003.

It's a sure sign we've slipped into bizarro world when you find me defending a Yankee from statistical abuse...

True, Jonny, and I thought about that as I wrote it, but went ahead anyway. Goofy stats are stats, too, dammit!