Anyone going to SABR tomorrow? Me Grimlock will be there. Look for the big metal dinobot.

Oh yeah, good win tonight.

Nice to see you posting grimlock, and I wish i could see your shiny metal a*& in action, but it is not to be. Definately a good game with some clutch pitching tonight. The Jays should be proud, and lay a beating on the sox tomorrow for good measure.

On a side note, I was wondering if anyone could answer this rule related question. When Shea got hit in the first inning, He had started to swing, as he jumped out of the way, his bat broke the plane of the plate. Is it ruled a HBP even if he swung(making strike three) while getting out of the way?
Does the umpire have to decide whether or not the batters swing was related to trying to get away from the pitch?

One of the announcers — I think I was listening to the radio on the HBP — said that if it had been ruled a strike, there would have been no HBP.

Great game by the bullpen. One of those wins that make you feel more relief than jubilation, but it's a good feeling all the same.

I have to say too, on Bush, he looked shaky and hittable from the very beginning. On the solo shot by Everett, Bush threw him four or five pitches belt-high, down the middle, one after the other. You could just see Everett lining him up. My daughter will attest to the fact that I was yelling at the TV at the time, warning Bush he was gonna get nailed if he didn't get the ball down... and he did, because he didn't.

I was glad, of course, to see him go five for the win, and just as glad that Gibbons yanked him out of there immediately after that.

Certainly if the pitch is ruled a strike, then there is no HBP, but is there a rule stating that if the bat crosses the plate, during the act of avoiding the pitch, is that considered a strike?

Didn't the ball hit him before he finished the swing?

"Great game by the bullpen. One of those wins that make you feel more relief than jubilation, but it's a good feeling all the same."

Exactly.

Not wanting to be the voice of desent on the question of relief or jubilation, but for me it was jubilation more than relief.

Funny eh, relief and jubilation can be so sujective.

Honestly though, obviously a slam dunk victory is always nice, but if this team is really going to be successful it has to know how to win the squeakers too. Tonight I think the fans and team could sense there would be little or no more scoring after the 6th inning.

The Jays gutted this win out. I and my fellow posters in the chat suite were most jubilant tracking the performance in the late stages of the game.

There was the sweet smell of a close win in the air. Very satisfying.

I agree with Lefty in the matter of jubilation. I mean the Jays did just win two straight against the top team.

You can say what you want about our wild card chances. But this is a young team, and they are playing meaningful baseball in the month of August. That is what gives me a sense of jubilation. Especially given this past season from hell.

But Lefty, the run differential!! What about the run differential!! WHO CARES ABOUT THE RUN DIFFERENTIAL!?! And yes, the chat was certainly filled with jubilation after the final strike was recorded. It was great seeing 6 or 7 guys simultaneously type WOO HOO or various other synonyms for AWESOME WIN!

Oh yeah. It was a great chat tonight for a great game. I think everyone had a good time and I expect more of you to show up next time. ;)

BPro had an article yesterday where they showed the Adjusted Equiv Runs Scored and Adjusted Equiv Runs Allowed and the Jays actually were 4th best... in the DIVISION.

I don't know enought about the calculations to really make much of it, just thought it was interesting in comparison to the raw totals.

If a batter swings on a ball that hits him it's a strike (don't you guys play video games anymore?). Same thing would apply for a check swing if the umpire thought he went (which technically would be a swing).

A strike that hits a batter is a strike. That happened in a Little League game I umpired one time and boy the coach went off on that.

but is it a strike if the bat goes around while the batter is trying to avoid getting hit? Does the umpire have discretion, or is it just a strike?

I don't believe that's a strike. If a batter has the bat on his shoulder the entire time but turns his body so the bat is pointing towards second base in order to avoid a pitch it wouldn't be a strike.

There isn't a plane to break to determine whether it's a swing or not - that's simply the umpire's decision.

that was my understanding also, however I can't find any rule that covers it. Must be one of those unwritten dealies.

One of the definitions of a strike (in fact, the very first) is that it is a legal pitch that "is struck at by the batter and missed". I think the common (and logical) interpretation of this provision, and certainly the interpretation impressed upon me when I was umpiring, is that the batter make an attempt to strike at the pitch. A batter clearing out of the way of a brushback pitch isn't really making a strike at the pitch, even if the bat travels through the strike zone.

Like Pistol, I once had to call a strike on a pitch that hit a batter, which resulted in a rather extended argument from the manager. To compound matters, it hit the batter right in the helmet, when the batter for some reason ducked his head right over the middle of the plate, in an age group where the strike zone extended all the way to the shoulders.