Batter's Box Interactive Magazine - 2021 Center Field Options

2021 Center Field Options

So for 2021 what are the Jays CF options? First of a series (hopefully - depends on time). 2020 saw it being Randal Grichuk 48 games, Teoscar Hernandez 7, Davis 5, Biggio 3, Alford 2 (funny, just 5 times 2 guys in a single game played there). What to do for 2021?

Lets start with guys here...

Randal Grichuk: At 28 he had one of his best years - 114 OPS+, 0.6 fWAR, 0.1 bWAR (ugh), 3.5 fRuns offense, -3.1 defense, 0.1 base running. -11.8 UZR/150 in CF, -3.0 lifetime. In LF/RF lifetime he is a positive defender, not wow, but solid. Time to move him out of CF if possible.
Teoscar Hernandez: His offense is well known, 12.8 fRuns on offense but negative on defense (mostly RF). In a shocker his CF defense in 2020 was solid - +17.7 UZR/150 but I trust his lifetime -9.9 more than this 55 inning sample. If he is in CF then something has gone very wrong or it should be deep into extra innings.
Jonathan Davis: was a positive with the bat somehow, and a negative with the glove somehow this year. I trust his 61 wRC lifetime over the 123 in 34 PA this year. Lifetime figures on defense are 4.6 UZR/150 in CF (275 innings), 27.4 in RF (46 innings), -21.1 in LF (57 Innings). Great 5th OF, lousy starter with that 61 wRC no matter how nice that glove is.
Cavan Biggio: Offense is solid but like Hernandez this isn't his position. In his brief 23 innings his UZR/150 was -0.1 in CF. Overall for the OF his UZR is -23.8 lifetime (196 innings). I suspect if left there he'd do better but isn't a real solution imo.

Alford was let go mid-summer so no point digging into him.

Minor leaguers: a bit tougher as there are few stats this year for Jay minor leaguers (a few played in indy leagues which can be hit or miss for finding stats). I'll list who was at each of the top 3 levels in 2019, then other prospects who might make it in 2021. Ages are the age they will be on July 1st, 2021

AAA: Roemon Fields (age 30, 254/324/321 in 2019), Davis, Alford, Hernandez (all addressed above), Sócrates Brito (a corner OF really), Pompey & Ben Revere (both no longer here)
AA: Forrest Wall (age 25, 268/351/422 in 2019 overall, was in summer camp), Josh Palacios (Age 25, 266/371/416 used in all 3 OF slots), Santiago Espinal (super-utility), plus under 5 games each for Vinny Capra, Gunnar Heidt, and Patrick Kivlehan (at summer camp - a AAAA guy).
A+: Chavez Young (age 23, 247/315/354, meh), Cal Stevenson (traded to Houston as part of deal for Fisher), Reggie Pruitt (age 24, 265/343/363 48 SB - was the regular in A ball), plus Davis, Pompey, and Hunter Steinmetz (age 24, 621 OPS in A/A+).
Others: Austin Martin - Age 22, #5 overall draft pick, Jays first in 2020 - 377/507/660 in NCAA in 2020 over 16 games. 368/474/532 career in NCAA 665 PA. Could be in CF/3B/2B/SS - who knows? Was at Summer Camp.

None of these guys jump out at me as likely to be in CF on opening day. Wall has a chance, but remote, and more remote is Martin. Rest I'd say are no chance.

Other options... starting with free agents

George Springer: Entering age 31 season, great offense (146 wRC+ this year, 134 lifetime), but not so great defense (-4.0 UZR/150 this year over 338 innings, +1.8 lifetime over 2248 innings). In RF his lifetime figure is +2.9 in over 4000 innings. Just 3 innings in LF. So he should be decent in CF on defense, but that offense would be sweet.
Jackie Bradley Jr.: Entering age 31 season, 119 wRC last year, 88 lifetime - so his offense is not likely to be impressive. But defense... 5.5 UZR/150 last year, 6.3 UZR lifetime. Nice and a LOT better than we are used to here.
Joc Pederson: Entering age 29 season, more of a LF lately, but figured can't hurt to check. 116 OPS+ lifetime, just 84 last year after 2 years in the 120's. wRC 118 lifetime vs 88 last year. -3.6 UZR/150 lifetime in CF (3149 innings) vs 9.1 in LF and 6.2 in RF. Type of guy who like Grichuk is pushed too far in CF I'd think. An option if a corner OF is traded but I'd hope not for CF.
Starling Marte: Age 32 season, 109 wRC this year, 100 lifetime, -0.9 UZR/150 2020, -1.1 lifetime. A meh option imo. A guy who doesn't hurt you or help you much.
Others are like Pederson - not really CF's anymore, but once were or were tried there - Yoenis Céspedes, Yasiel Puig, Michael Brantley. Jays are nuts if they go for them as none would help the defense in CF - might as well put Hernandez there if you are doing that.

So for free agents there are options, but only Springer and Bradley are worth looking at imo. After that you get corner guys who can cover in a pinch like Hernandez and Grichuk.

Trade options: the hardest part - because who knows who is available and not? Listing the guys who played in CF as regulars this year.

Some we can write off immediately: Mike Trout, Aaron Hicks, (signed long term); Victor Robles, Kyle Lewis, Ian Happ, Cody Bellinger, Luis Robert, Ramon Laureano, Trent Grisham (very early in career so most would demand a kings ransom);
Avisail Garcia - Brewers - entering age 30 season, 81 wRC+ 2020, 102 lifetime, 8.8 UZR/150 2020, -4.7 lifetime, 13.2 LF/-0.6 RF lifetime, Owed $10.75 mil 2021, $12 mil or $2 mil buyout 2022. A guy scouting would be needed on - is his offense as bad as it was in 2020, or is it closer to the 112 he did in 2019, 138 in 2017? His fielding is it bad as it was in CF pre-2020, or is he the good fielder he was in 2020? Certainly an interesting potential target - Milwaukee is a poor team so they will be wanting to cut salary most likely.
Kevin Kiermaier: unlikely as he is a Ray under contract for 2 + buyout, but they are a very, very cheap team. Entering age 31 season, 93 wRC+ in 2020, 97 lifetime, 30.7 UZR/150 in 2020 (wow), 15.8 lifetime. His contract is for $11/$12/$13 or $2.5 buyout. Given his age and contract (possibly the highest on the Rays, him or Snell depending how you cut it) I could see the Rays trading him but wanting a ton in exchange.

Ugh. Not much there. Doubt we'll see a trade. Listed Kiermaier more due to Rays being super-cheap and the lack of other options - in any trade with Tampa I'd be making sure I still had my arms and legs as any deal with them will cost you at least one of those. There are others with lower inning totals in CF in 2020 but that is what the comments section here is for - lets see other players and what you each think it would take to get them. If a guy is pre-arb though I'd figure the cost would be sky high if he is any good.

If the Jays want to upgrade in CF I think Springer is the only real choice with Bradley a weak backup. If the Rays do decide to cut payroll then chase Kiermaier but be careful. Otherwise sticking with what is here is probably (sadly) the best option, hoping Wall is ready or Martin is ready mid-season.

Posted by John Northey on Thursday, October 08 2020 @ 02:53 PM EDT.

2021 Center Field Options | 34 comments | Create New Account

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tercet - Sunday, October 11 2020 @ 02:24 AM EDT (#391589) #

Interesting article about former Jays draftee Clinton Hollon who the Jays released in 2016.
https://www.wkyt.com/2020/09/10/woodford-countys-clinton-hollon-pitching-his-way-past-addiction/
Cliffs - He got released by the Jays for Percocet abuse in 2016. Over the last few years he has had multiple arrests due to heroin, meth and crack abuse. He also pitched in August (hitting 95mph) in some Kentucky showcase games and hopes to join the minors again next year.

bpoz - Sunday, October 11 2020 @ 07:46 AM EDT (#391590) #

Any CF they get has to hit well. That seems to be the Jays position player policy IMO. But in 2019 T Hernandez and Fisher had trouble catching balls hit to them fairly consistently. I mean Grichuk and Gurriel were catching those kinds of fly balls regularly. The result was that J Davis came in for Hernandez/Fisher to protect a lead late in the game. That was also late in the season when Bichette was up and ignited the team.

In 2020 Hernandez turned the corner after the fielding/throwing error he made about midway through the season. So he was a great hitter and good enough fielder. IMO going forward his ability to track and catch the ball should improve. The hitting however seemed much too good so I wonder if he can do that consistently. We have his arb years to find out.

The impact player could be C Morton. He qualifies IMO.

bpoz - Sunday, October 11 2020 @ 09:54 AM EDT (#391592) #

Sorry. Don't go after Morton if it costs a draft pick due to him being QO'd.

John Northey - Sunday, October 11 2020 @ 06:57 PM EDT (#391603) #

For CF we can wish for a Devon White type to be made available - fantastic defense but has a few holes in their swing that the Jays can hope to more or less fix. Sadly stats are limited for Devo as it was so long ago. Checking BR (as fielding stats for the 90's don't match up to modern ones) I get dWAR for Devo of 2.8 in 1989, 0.3 1990, then he is traded here and goes 2.2-3.9-2.1 over the 3 playoff years. By age 32 he went negative here then was traded and had 3 positive years in Miami before going negative for the final 3 years of his career.

I think the closest is Harrison Bader. He was amazing in 2019 for St Louis on defense (21.8 UZR/150 in CF after a 20.1 the year before, 5.2 this year) - 1.5 dWAR from BR, 0.2 this year BR. He is entering his age 27 season, and under team control for 3 more years. 111 OPS+ in 2020, but just 93 lifetime - actually similar profile to Devo - low walks, high K's (over 100 in a full season), a bit of power (12 HR each of his 2 full seasons) and a bit of speed (double digit stolen bases both full seasons). Doubt they'd trade him for a reasonable price, but one never knows. If I was the Jays I'd kick the tires there and see what they want. He should be a solid defender at the least for the next 3 years which is exactly what the Jays could use in CF. Cards are weak for their #2 catcher, regular LF (Tyler O'Neill) had a 68 OPS+ (like Bader is a great fielder it looks like).

rpriske - Tuesday, October 13 2020 @ 09:14 AM EDT (#391632) #

I came to the same conclusion as you. They should go after George Springer, hard.

That and a starting pitcher should be top priorities.

John Northey - Tuesday, October 13 2020 @ 10:18 AM EDT (#391634) #

Agreed. 3B is an issue, but not a pressing one vs CF/starting pitching. Worst case for 3B is Shaw being there - a meh option but one that can work until a kid is ready to step in. For CF the kids aren't ready/talented enough for it with the possible exception of Martin but we just don't know with him and he might be the solution at 3B. Lindor is a nice idea, but very expensive (prospects and dollars) and requires shifting other guys around thus perhaps making another hole somewhere. I see the pen as a potential issue as this year was a ton of bandaids which held together for 60 games but to count on it over 162 might be asking too much. Remember none of our relievers this year had 26 IP (25 2/3's for Bass and Yamaguchi led) 6 guys had 20+, another 4 10-19. In 2019 Elvis Luciano had more than anyone did this year.

For fun I looked back to the Osuna/Giles trade. Osuna is out for 2021 with Tommy John so the trade is over now for the 2 key parts. Osuna as an Astro: 51-6 Sv-BlSv 186 ERA+ in 92 IP $6.5 mil 2019 plus a portion of $10 mil this year. Giles as a Jay: 38-1 Sv-BlSv 159 ERA+ over 76 1/3 IP for $6.3 mil 2019 plus a portion of $9.6 mil this year. So if it was just a one for one challenge trade it didn't work out too badly for the Jays I'd say. Osuna had 13 more saves but blew 5 more while being paid more. But the Jays also got two prospects - David Paulino (7 games 330 ERA+, not on 40 man) and Hector Perez (1 2/3 IP this year, 2 runs allowed still on 40 man). Not bad for dealing a toxic asset at the time.

scottt - Tuesday, October 13 2020 @ 01:43 PM EDT (#391638) #

Morton will not get a QO. He would take it with joy. He lives in Tampa and they have an option for less than a QO.

scottt - Tuesday, October 13 2020 @ 02:01 PM EDT (#391639) #

Paulino was released. He seemed to have character issues. Didn't care to work during fielding drills.
Perez has 2 more years to show he can be a reliever.

They have a lot of guys for the pen. The real issue with the pen is the number of innings thrown which goes back to having better starting pitching.

Ryu is closer to 5 innings per game than 6 or 7. He also needs frequent extra rest.
Roark and Anderson were supposed to be inning eaters. They can probably get 24 to 27 outs if you don't mind getting blown out of the game.

Heck if you want guys to go through the rotation only once, you have have to pitch them every 3 days and that just gets you about 4 to 8 outs.

John Northey - Tuesday, October 13 2020 @ 06:06 PM EDT (#391645) #

scottt - agreed. The idea of just once through the order is nuts imo. You'd end up with pitchers rotating in and out of AAA non-stop and would need bigger rosters as well. The Jays just got through the 60 game season doing pretty much that. On a 3 day, once through, rotation you'd need a minimum of 9 pitchers dedicated to it plus spares for extra innings, for when a guy failed to finish his 3 innings (because someone got on, thus every game). In truth you'd need 4 a day realistically = 12 pitchers plus with the new 13 man pitching staff limit you'd have only 1 guy to fill in for extras/someone didn't get through 1 inning, whatever. That'd be a disaster with less than a 15 man staff and you'd probably need 17-20 for it to work over 162.

scottt - Wednesday, October 14 2020 @ 10:04 AM EDT (#391654) #

Let's assume they took advantage of the short season/bigger roster and that they'll try to have 5+ real starters next year.

I listened to Dante Bichette yesterday.
He said Vladdy has a weight problem and that he was losing weight and getting better as the season progressed.
He also said that Grichuk is a second half guy who had a really good chance of having a great year in a full season.
I'm less convinced about that, but the front office might be thinking along those lines.

bpoz - Wednesday, October 14 2020 @ 12:03 PM EDT (#391656) #

Assume. 60,100 and 162 game season.

The 2020 pitching strategy gets repeated for 60 games. 2 STs was a problem getting ready for the season. Fast exit for Gaviglio and slow exit for Font.

For 100 games with only 1 ST the positives would be less injuries I think. All the teams figured out the same pitcher usage strategy. Guys like G Cole NYY would expect/insist on getting a regular turn in the rotation and going 7/8 innings whenever they have it in them. Our kids can do a 6 man rotation and also mixing and matching the combos. Montoyo/Walker/Atkins will figure this out. I assume.

162 games is like before covid. Only Ryu is a #1. The performance of the others will establish something regarding categories.

scottt - Wednesday, October 14 2020 @ 02:59 PM EDT (#391659) #

Shoemaker commented about Toronto's chances of signing free agents.

He said that many players are concerned about having to cross the border at the best of times.
He also said that with a government enforcing a 14 days quarantine, people have to think carefully about not being to see their family for extended periods.

Mike Green - Wednesday, October 14 2020 @ 03:54 PM EDT (#391660) #

According to Statcast, Bradley Jr. has been 38 runs better than Springer with the glove over the period 2017-20 (roughly 3 and 1/2 years). Springer is 6 months older and, in my view, will not age well in centerfield. Of course, his bat is good enough that he should be a fine corner outfielder for a long time.

Bradley Jr. has been worth about 3 wins/year from 2015-20 and I think that he's probably good for 2-2.5 in 2021 and 2022. A good defensive centerfielder is particularly important for this club, with starting pitching that will be dependent on pretty good defence to hold its own and stay in games.

scottt - Thursday, October 15 2020 @ 10:09 AM EDT (#391665) #

Bradley is just one year younger than Pillar. They both came up the same year. Pillar as few more PAs because Bradley is a platoon guy who will sit against tough lefties.

Over his career Bradley has been worth more than 4 bWAR only once.
The last 2 full year he was worth 2.2 and 1.9 WAR.

Also, Bradley has been playing in an extreme environment. He has an OPS of .780 at home and .687 on the road.

I think Davis can be just as good defensively and has more upside.

Springer has been worth 27 WAR, Bradley 17 and Pillar 16.
One is an All-Star, the other is a platoon regular.
Springer will get a QO worth between 18 and 19M and will cost a draft pick.
Springer was making 21M this year and Bradley 11M.
That is fair valuation based on arbitration. Pillar got a little over 4M on the free market.

It's always difficult to project center fielders. Most of the league use younger guys in the middle and move aging players over time. Austin Martin could play center for the Jays, but nobody knows if he's even been practicing there.
Dasan Brown hasn't played above rookie ball. Chavez Young needs to put some decent numbers in AAA first.

Mike Green - Thursday, October 15 2020 @ 10:51 AM EDT (#391666) #

I like Davis too. All the more reason to try to sign Bradley and spend money on pitching. As I said, I don't think Springer is a centerfielder next year or the year after that, and you're going to have sign him for four or five.

If you're doing the WAR comparison, I'd use 2015-20 (Bradley wasn't ready in 2013-14). Springer has between worth 25 WAR (both bWAR and fWAR) while Bradley has been worth 16 WAR (15 fWAR and 17bWAR). Springer has 3222 PAs during that time, while Bradley has 2751 (Bradley had 318 PAs in Pawtucket in 2015 until he was up for good). So yes, Springer is a better player (obviously) but the difference between the two isn't reflected in the difference in contract value. It is especially so given the Blue Jays needs as a right-hand hitting club with below average defence and starting pitching that needs all the help it can get.

Chuck - Thursday, October 15 2020 @ 01:48 PM EDT (#391668) #

I have not paid close enough attention to know if the organization has signalled the need for a "real" CF. Do we know for sure that this has been deemed a requirement?

Such a decision would mean then deciding who of the existing starters would get squeezed out.

scottt - Thursday, October 15 2020 @ 02:38 PM EDT (#391669) #

I really don't see enough difference between Bradley and Pillar to justify dumping one to sign the other.
If they wanted great defense and below average offense in CF they could have extended Pillar a year at a time and he would still be here.

Does Springer has 5 year of defense over what Grichuk provides? I'll bet yes on that.
Springer has an OPS of .834 against righties and .899 against lefties.
Grichuk is .773/787. Springer has been better against right handed pitchers than Grichuk against lefties.
There is no point in added a mediocre left bat.

Springer over Grichuk adds 4 or 5 wins next year. That would make an impact.

They still need a pitcher who can eat innings and win games though.

Mike Green - Thursday, October 15 2020 @ 02:53 PM EDT (#391670) #

The difference between Bradley Jr. and Pillar over the last 4 years has been 32 runs per Statcast. Pillar has been -14 per DRS from 2018-20 and - 0.4 per UZR. Pillar was a great defender from 2015-17.

The organization has not signalled that it wants to make a change in centerfield. Not that they would- they have 3 outfielders who they think are useful and there's no point talking about it from their perspective unless they have a deal in place. There is a time for silence and this would be one of them.

Mike Green - Thursday, October 15 2020 @ 02:56 PM EDT (#391671) #

Here's the link to the Statcast data, by the way.

cascando - Thursday, October 15 2020 @ 05:57 PM EDT (#391672) #

Thanks for this article, John Northey.

I value CF defense enough that I would rather have a weak hitter there instead of a Grichuk or even Hernandez type of bat that can't really field the position. I suppose Grichuk is at least competent, but they can do much better, IMO. If Bradley's defence still holds up, then I think he would be a good target.

Harrison Bader is probably the best name I've seen thrown out there, but no idea if the Cardinals would move him. I suppose if they believe Dylan Carlson is ready, they might for the right package. More likely they'll try to get someone to take the last year of Fowler's contract and keep both young players. They do have some OF depth though, so maybe it's possible.

If there is no clear upgrade and they bring back the same cast of characters as this year, I think you have to give the job to Davis.

John Northey - Thursday, October 15 2020 @ 06:46 PM EDT (#391673) #

cascando - that makes sense - the 3 OF now plus Davis works, might want a decent AAAA level guy around too (can probably stash him in Buffalo assuming regular play). Forest Wall and other kids might be good for 4th/5th options too. A top notch CF lands under the 'very nice to have' but a guy with a great glove and good bat isn't out there (they exist, just not for sale at a reasonable price).

scottt - Saturday, October 17 2020 @ 05:34 PM EDT (#391691) #

The organization signed Russell Martin while still having a decent catcher under contract, so I'm sure Rodgers will do what the front office wants, as long as the bill isn't too high.
The Jays have mismanaged CF since the day they gave a large contract to Vernon Wells.
The outfield in Cleveland has been cobbled together for a long time too.

Long term, it would make sense to send Austin Martin to center since he struggled at shortstop and third base in college. They signed Grichuk to play RF, now Hernandez is going to get MVP votes while playing in RF while Grichuk is playing at replacement level in CF. Maybe Grichuk hits a bit more next year, but his defense is only going to get worse.

Biggio is a decent second basement but he's not a good fielder anywhere else.
Bichette's experience a second base was 16 games in A ball, 9 in AA and 1 in AAA.

So CF is the obvious position to make improvement.

Incidentally, Cards fans have been watching Arozarena and are wondering why he was traded.
It's because they got a top 50 prospect in Liberatore back and because they have a high outfield prospect who isn't ready yet. That might work out, or not. The current Cards outfield isn't great.

John Northey - Saturday, October 17 2020 @ 10:32 PM EDT (#391692) #

One more CF to mix in...Tyler O'Neill - another site had an article on it, but the core is he was a top prospect in CF but the Cards have put him in LF and seem to have CF locked in with Harrison Bader (111 OPS+ last year, but just a 0.8 WAR overall). O'Neill had just a 68 OPS+ which is useless in LF (lifetime 90 OPS+, but lifetime 267/339/554 in AAA over 996 PA). He defense in CF is confusing at FG as they have 2 years of data listed with UZR's of 54.3 and 17.9 but -1.3 overall in CF (which makes zero sense). LF is a 10.4 and RF is 29.5 lifetime. So he is a very good fielder with power (via AAA) but hasn't shown his bat in the majors and is entering his age 26 season. He is pre-arbitration still so no pressure on St L to trade him but really, he doesn't fit their team at the moment.

bpoz - Sunday, October 18 2020 @ 11:57 AM EDT (#391703) #

Hal Steinbrenner (NYY) said that the team incurred significant financial losses in 2020. No fans. So it is possible that they will be quiet this off season.

scottt - Sunday, October 18 2020 @ 12:10 PM EDT (#391704) #

Fangraphs has Pillar being worth 12 fWAR and Bradey 15.
That's 3 WAR over 7 years.

To Springer they attribute 26+ WAR.

hypobole - Sunday, October 18 2020 @ 02:35 PM EDT (#391708) #

scottt, the Pillar vs Bradley question we are discussing isn't who's had the better career, it's who would solve the Jays CF problem next year. Bradley is still excellent in CF, +6 OAA in 2019, +7 in 2020. Pillar -2 in 2019, -1 in 2020.

DRS has Pillar +52 2015-2017, -14 2018-2020 as a CF. So overall he's been excellent in CF, just not anymore.

scottt - Monday, October 19 2020 @ 04:41 PM EDT (#391743) #

I'm sticking to my guns, don't sign a free agent CF unless he's a plus bat.
A hitting CF might need to move to a corner, but a glove first CF will turn into a 4th outfielder.

The Jays completed the IFA last Wednesday by signing a bunch of Dominican pitchers and one from Cuba.

The 2020 class will open January 15 2021. The Jays are rumored to be signing a CF, Venezuelan Yhoangel Aponte.
Also, bat first Dominican SS Manuel Beltre, expecting to cost 2-3M, Venezuelan SS Martin Gimenez and Dominican C Jonathan Peguero.

Petey Baseball - Thursday, October 22 2020 @ 09:10 AM EDT (#391801) #

I continue to believe the only realistic way the Jays add significant upgrades (JBJ, for example, is a marginal upgrade at best) is through trade, which has been the case for basically their entire existence (with a few exceptions). With that comes the risk of overpaying in terms of the return, sometimes significantly overpaying on paper. Which is why I still think a trade for Lindor, Arenado, or players of that ilk (high salary, but high ceiling) is how the F.O. will operate.

Let's face it, it would be a complete coup if the Jays convinced Springer or another top five Free agent to come to Toronto. They got pretty lucky with Ryu.

Mike Green - Thursday, October 22 2020 @ 09:35 AM EDT (#391802) #

One of the consequences of a JBJ acquisition is that it would allow the club to trade one of Grichuk and Teoscar presumably for pitching- two moves required for significant benefit.

John Northey - Thursday, October 22 2020 @ 03:12 PM EDT (#391804) #

The 'Jays can't sign top free agents' thing is long dead imo. First big signing was probably Jack Morris before the 1992 season when he had just been the hero of game 7 the year before, the next day they signed Dave Winfield. The next winter it was Paul Molitor and Dave Stewart. December 1996 they signed the guy every sane GM wanted - Roger Clemens. A few days earlier they signed Benito Santiago who was a top catcher at the time. 2005/6 offseason they signed B.J. Ryan and AJ Burnett to a lot of fanfare. The following winter they signed Frank Thomas. Lots of years of nothing, but those were pretty big ones. Really, the Jays are no worse off than 90% of ML teams - NY Yankees and Dodgers each have tons of history, St Louis has a great rep of being a good place for players, Florida & Texas have super-low taxes. Otherwise the Jays are pretty even with everyone else. In the end it is $$$ that decides most of it, not a border. And nowadays with the virus and the toxic politics down there I figure many players would look to Canada as a safe place to raise their family vs most of the USA - at least that is what part of my pitch to any player would be.

Mike Green - Thursday, October 22 2020 @ 05:05 PM EDT (#391805) #

The only Blue Jay finalist for a Gold Glove is Lourdes Gurriel Jr. Does there have to be one from each club? The closest this year was probably Biggio (as a second baseman), but really none of them were significantly above average.

scottt - Thursday, October 22 2020 @ 07:30 PM EDT (#391806) #

It's the other way around. The Gold Glove are attributed based only on defensive metrics. Gurriel was in the top 3 by SABR defensive index. The White Sox have both catchers!

No Kiermaier, no JBJ, no Lindor.

Actually Lindor had also a bad year offensively and is looking for a crazy contract.

Last year, Springer finished 4th with 5.3 and JBJ finished behind Teoscar (-1.7) with a crazy (-6.6).
Gurriel didn't have enough innings to qualify but Jansen finished second at catcher.

I guess the final numbers won't be available until after the winners are announced.

Last year Simmons was first at SS, Adames was second, Semien 3rd and Lindor 4th. Lindor won due to voting.

Also Grichuk was at -1.5 in RF.

scottt - Thursday, October 22 2020 @ 07:43 PM EDT (#391807) #

You can't trade for 1 year of Lindor and extending him would cost more than what he'd get in free agency.
Maybe 10 year, 340M?

The Jays are in a good position to overpay. Rogers just released some pretty good financial numbers.
Profits down 512M compared to 593M last year. Beat analyst estimates.
Wireless overage fees are down 50M and they loss 90M in roaming fees compared to last year.
I don't understand why people pay those huge travel phone bills, but they do.
Rogers Media revenue were actually up 1%.

LeMahieu, Bauer, Springer are the type of impact guys who would make a difference.
I bet LeMahieu will sign for less than what's due to Arenado.

Jevant - Friday, November 06 2020 @ 02:32 PM EST (#392062) #

Tyler O`Neill is a logical name to talk about from a trade perspective for sure, in my books. STL has never seemed particularly high on him. I`m not sure, however, that the bat is enough better than Grichuk (or the defence) to justify surrendering the assets. But I`d be investigating for sure.

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