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Features Toronto at New York, April 5-7
The wounded Jays head into New York for three games. The Yankees are 6-1 with a +7 run differential as they return for their home opener. The Jays are 3-4 with a -14 differential.

Wes Parsons has been DFA'd and Paolo Espino, who pitched well in spring training, has been recalled. Parsons also did well in spring but usually at the end of games when the opposition was not major league quality. Parsons hasn't done enough to stay on the team.


Davis Schneider is back in the lineup today even though Marcus Stroman, a righthander, is on the mound. This series is unusual in that it goes day game, night game, day game. The Jays are not as bad as they looked in Houston but did the off day help? Maybe this mornings earthquake that was felt in New York will jar the Jays back into form.


Matchups

Friday, April 5, Kikuchi vs Stroman

Saturday, April 6, Gausman vs Schmidt

Sunday, April 7, Francis vs Gil (WARNING: It looks like Angel Hernandez will be the home plate umpire on Sunday)

Posted by Gerry on Friday, April 05 2024 @ 12:28 PM EDT.
Toronto at New York, April 5-7 | 162 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
Gerry - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 12:32 PM EDT (#444016) #
Kevin Kiermaier was originally in todays lineup but was removed with lower back tightness.
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Chuck - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 12:51 PM EDT (#444017) #
The audio quality of the player introductions is on par with the pyrotechnics at the Cubs’ opener.
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greenfrog - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 01:54 PM EDT (#444018) #
The Blue Jays are never going to score again.
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Magpie - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 02:03 PM EDT (#444019) #
Thanks Gerry! Forgot it was an afternoon game.
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99BlueJaysWay - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 02:08 PM EDT (#444021) #
Stroman has gotten the 50/50 calls all day, but Kikuchi can’t get a strike 3 call on a pitch 100% over the plate. Annoying
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Eephus - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 02:19 PM EDT (#444022) #
Meet the new team, same as the old team.
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Eephus - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 02:25 PM EDT (#444023) #
Kikuchi really needed a quick inning like that. He’s battled through some tough spots nicely this afternoon.
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greenfrog - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 02:28 PM EDT (#444024) #
Meet the new team, worse than the old team…?
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Eephus - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 02:36 PM EDT (#444025) #
Good lord, Vladdy. If this guy ever learns just because ‘I can’ hit it doesn’t mean ‘I should try to’….

My optimism on this front is waning fast. He might just be what he is.
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99BlueJaysWay - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 02:56 PM EDT (#444027) #
Way to go Ernie!
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John Northey - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 03:08 PM EDT (#444028) #
Wondering if this ump is a Yankee fan given his 2 strike zones. Pitches clearly outside are balls if a Jay throws it, strikes if a Yankee throws it. Frustrating. Should be interesting to see the umpire scoreboard tomorrow.
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electric carrot - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 03:10 PM EDT (#444029) #
I went to batters box before going to the game score. After reading the comments I was like okay, 7 to 1 Yankees?
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electric carrot - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 03:12 PM EDT (#444030) #
For those reading from home the score at this time is:
Blue Jays 1
Yankees 0
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99BlueJaysWay - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 03:14 PM EDT (#444031) #
Agree John. Nothing makes me more crazy
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99BlueJaysWay - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 03:34 PM EDT (#444033) #
Nice to see the Jays get that call for once today
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greenfrog - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 03:37 PM EDT (#444034) #
When Richards is on, he is very effective.
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99BlueJaysWay - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 03:38 PM EDT (#444035) #
Ump trying to even things out here in the 8th.

Robo umps or a challenge system can’t come soon enough
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Eephus - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 03:53 PM EDT (#444036) #
Some nice alert running from Serven (particularly getting to third). Can’t be easy to come in cold, on a cold day.
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uglyone - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 04:00 PM EDT (#444037) #
thank god for the wild pitches else Vladdy and Bo going up there and hacking at every pitch off a pitcher who couldn't hit the broadside of a barn was making me joker.
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Hodgie - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 04:11 PM EDT (#444038) #
"...who couldn't hit the broadside of a barn was making me joker."

Cesar Romero or more Heath Ledger?

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uglyone - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 04:12 PM EDT (#444039) #
definitely Joaquim.
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mendocino - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 04:15 PM EDT (#444040) #
no love for Jack
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scottt - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 04:16 PM EDT (#444042) #
Stroman never got calls like this outside the plate when he was a Jays.
Back then, he had to throw strikes.

This is distracting the hitters who are chasing pitches outside because they think it will be strike 3.

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Joe - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 04:16 PM EDT (#444043) #
I don't think Vlad swung at anything he shouldn't've this at-bat:

Or, for that matter, Bo:

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uglyone - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 04:21 PM EDT (#444044) #
vlad swinging at #1 there is ridiculous after what Burdi did the previous at bats. he should have been taking all the way and instead he swings at something nowhere close. and then adding in 4 and 10 is salt in the wound. pitch #3 was a slider he should have laid off of as well, given what Burdi had been doing. he yelled at pitch #6 as if he was scared the ump would call it a strike and it was nowhere remotely close, showing his eye was completely off.
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bpoz - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 04:26 PM EDT (#444045) #
Would like to see the Jays win tomorrow because I would like it.
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scottt - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 04:30 PM EDT (#444047) #
No doubt the Yankees pitching isn' t what we're used to.
Loaisiga looks like he's gone for the year.

It's really sweet to see Green pick up a save here.
That was a timely pinch hit by the manager.

Wes Parsons has been DFA. Maybe now they try to grab somebody on waivers?
I guess, that didn't work out as planned or I am missing something?


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Joe - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 04:30 PM EDT (#444048) #
Parsons was DFA'd so they could add Espino, so the 40 is full.
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scottt - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 04:39 PM EDT (#444049) #
Well, I guess it's not bad then.
Having Parsons for 2 games didn't hurt the results.


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scottt - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 04:43 PM EDT (#444050) #
Verdugo has been ordered to wear only 1 chain per game.

"It's been kind of hard, man. Because usually I'm used to wearing like three or four."

Yankees drama is always a bit different.

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Leaside Cowboy - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 05:16 PM EDT (#444051) #
(WARNING: It looks like Angel Hernandez will be the home plate umpire on Sunday)

Angel Hernandez was in fine form behind the plate yesterday for game 1 of the Mets' double-header.

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dalimon5 - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 05:30 PM EDT (#444052) #
I agree with Ugly. Vladdy has looked suspect for YEARS now. I'd have no issue with him if he wasn't "the guy" this core was built around. He just does not execute and capitalize when it counts. Other players in the league tasked with being a key hitter on their team would have pulverized the 89MPH pitch left over the plate to him by Burdi.
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mathesond - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 05:44 PM EDT (#444053) #
Agreed. To the best of my knowledge, no key hitter has ever missed on a pitch like that.
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dalimon5 - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 06:36 PM EDT (#444054) #
He's missing waaaay too much, smart ass.
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Leaside Cowboy - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 07:26 PM EDT (#444055) #
Wild 9th inning in Colorado.  Tampa Bay scores 5 runs to take the lead 7 - 6.  Then, the Rockies hit a walk-off grand slam.
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John Northey - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 10:02 PM EDT (#444056) #
So the Jays have played like crap, been no-hit, 1 hit, outscored 25-36, and seem addicted to playing IKF everyday. Yet they are 2 games out of 1st, with a 500 record, 1 game ahead of Tampa Bay.

Of course, it is super-early but still, given what we've seen for the Jays to be at 500 is a good thing. Everyone was pretty much saying being 5-5 once this 10 game road trip was done would be a good result and they are 1 win away from that now and have zero risk of seeing Garrett Cole during this Yankee trip.
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greenfrog - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 10:14 PM EDT (#444057) #
I don’t love the “flexible” approach, where the front office’s analytics decides which of Kiermaier, Varsho, Schneider, Clement, IKF, Biggio and others will play on any given night — and where they’ll bat in the lineup. Especially since the sunk cost of IKF’s contract (a decidedly non-analytic factor) seems to be playing a role in Atkins’s algorithm.

Maybe it will all work out over time, but I imagine some players would benefit from simply having a set role and playing every day.
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dalimon5 - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 11:23 PM EDT (#444059) #
"Especially since the sunk cost of IKF’s contract (a decidedly non-analytic factor) seems to be playing a role in Atkins’s algorithm."

This is such a major and crippling issue with this front office. It's painfully obvious now as it was with Alan Hansen and Derek Fischer, Brandon Druru, Gio Urshela etc all.
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John Northey - Friday, April 05 2024 @ 11:49 PM EDT (#444060) #
Well greenfrog it seems to me that the Jays do have a set role for everyone - everyday guys are clearly set as Kirk-Vlad-Biggio-Bo-IKF-Varsho-KK-Springer-Turner with Clement the #1 backup. Schneider #2 backup (plays vs LHP), while Vogelbach and Serven get splinters from sitting so long.
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Michael - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 01:26 AM EDT (#444062) #
Most of the Jays hitters have looked pretty bad; however, it is early, and the Jays have been facing good teams on the road. I think it is a little too early to panic, and the early results from guys that maybe there was the most questions about (Turner, Clement, Schneider) have all been trending good.
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Marc Hulet - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 01:45 AM EDT (#444063) #
Sorry but Houston pretty much dominated the Jays but was in turn dominated by NY and Tex. Toronto has been lucky with the 4-4 record.
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John Northey - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 03:15 AM EDT (#444064) #
Not arguing the Jays aren't lucky to have that record given how they have played so far, but that is good news - they played badly and still are 500. The Astros are 2-6 with a runs for/against of 32-33 - I think I prefer the Jays first 8 games, even if a few REALLY sucked and were near unwatchable.

Of course, the Marlins are there to show us how bad it can get - 0-8 so far 29-59 runs for-against with 7 of those 8 games at home. Yikes. Remember, they were tied for worst wild card team last year with the NL champion Arizona Diamondbacks. Then they insulted their GM like the Jays did to AA all those years ago (hired someone to be her boss without considering that she wanted/deserved full control) and she quit. Now their team sucks.

The Dodgers blew over a billion dollars in the winter, got everyone we wanted, but are just 7-3, or 2 games better than the Jays thus far. Now, if they keep playing at that level they'll be very happy, but right now the spread despite how poorly the Jays played is 2 games.
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Leaside Cowboy - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:21 AM EDT (#444066) #
Trevor Story injured his shoulder last night in Boston's game against the Angels. He will undergo an MRI today.
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scottt - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:30 AM EDT (#444067) #
The Jays hitters are bad against breaking ball outside the zone.
A lot of teams have this problem. That's why there's so many left bats in lineups.
The Yankees catcher was setting up off the zone all day.
It's too bad that the Jays left bats aren't that good.

I'd like to see Vogelbach more. They haven't figure out how to give him ABs.
They can pinch hit Schneider for KK and move Varsho over.
They can pinch hit Clement for Biggio.
They won't pinch hit for Turner or Gerrero and they don't seem to want to burn two guys at once.
What happens if Votto gets hot in AAA?

Boston is 6-2. They have 6 left bats in their lineup.
McGuire OPS+ 154
Casas OPS+ 109
Valdez OPS+ 23
Devers OPS+ 115
Duran OPS+ 179
Yoshida OPS+ 84

Also, Tyler O'Neill is healthy and they are facing bad teams.

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greenfrog - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:31 AM EDT (#444068) #
Kikuchi’s outing yesterday is encouraging. The pitching staff could be pretty good this year once everyone is healthy. Hopefully Manoah, Rodriguez, Francis or Tiedemann can be a capable #5 starter.
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John Northey - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 12:58 PM EDT (#444070) #
Yeah, Boston is living on smoke and mirrors if they are counting on Reese McGwire's 154 OPS+, just lost Trevor Story, their pitching staff has a 244 ERA+ thus far - that ain't gonna keep going for long. Tyler O'Neill with a 328 OPS+.

Early season is a crazy time that is for sure. Detroit the best in the AL at 6-1, Milwaukee in the NL at 5-1, tied with the Pirates who are 6-2.

Turner leads the Jays in OPS+ at 179 with Schneider 2nd at 152. Bo at -7, KK at -36 (yikes! 1-18 so far). The offense has a OPS+ of 72, the pitchers an ERA+ of 85. Ugh. Yet the team is 500 somehow. Lets hope they sneak above 500 tonight.
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John Northey - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 01:00 PM EDT (#444071) #
Oh, here is the umpire scorecard from yesterday.
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John Northey - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 01:04 PM EDT (#444072) #
Just gotta add in Ernie Clement post game quote - I missed it as I had to take one of my daughters somewhere at that time (kids always need a ride) but dang, you gotta love Clement!
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greenfrog - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 01:18 PM EDT (#444075) #
Thank you for that ump scorecard, John. Seems like he was showing a pretty significant bias in favour of the Yankees. Does the league take ump underperformance at all seriously, or do they just let it slide because the union effectively protects the umps from any remedial action?
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John Northey - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 01:46 PM EDT (#444076) #
I'm wondering when the umpires union agreement is up - would be a good time to put the pressure on. Roboumps behind the plate, replay on anything, quality of umpires would be a lot less critical then, beyond ability to not eject players/coaches unless absolutely necessary (headhunting situations for example). A quick google check and I found it runs out after this season. Time for the owners to tell the umpires no more Angel Hernandez types ever again. Umpires who fail go down to AAA just like players who flop. Sadly they had agreed to put the robo ump ball-strike thing in place back in 2019 by 2024 but failed to do so. To me we need the 'human element' for players, coaches, but not for officials.
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bpoz - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 03:01 PM EDT (#444077) #
Cleveland pitcher Bieber is having surgery on his elbow. He is a FA at the end of this season.
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92-93 - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 03:56 PM EDT (#444078) #
Good time to check in with Cleveland to see if Ramirez and the team are interested in a trade centred around Tiedemann.

I would love to hear what Cito thinks about the Jays lineup management. Off the record, of course.
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scottt - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 04:11 PM EDT (#444079) #
It says 15 missed calls, 2 more than the average game. Sigh.
It's completely meaningless to credit the ump with calling properly balls that miss by several feet.
There was only 1 low ball called a strike? That doesn't seem right.
I kinda remember Stroman getting lots of calls on balls low and away.

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dalimon5 - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 04:16 PM EDT (#444080) #
I think there's a better chance the Jays can trade for Mike Trout. Tiedeman, Martinez and Horowitz.
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Leaside Cowboy - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 04:37 PM EDT (#444081) #
Cloudy and 10 ° C / 50 ° F tonight in the Bronx.
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greenfrog - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 04:47 PM EDT (#444082) #
Tonight’s lineup against Clarke Schmidt:

Springer RF
VGJ 1B
Bichette SS
Turner 3B
Vogelbach DH
Clement 2B
Varsho LF
Serven C
Kiermaier CF
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Nigel - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 07:23 PM EDT (#444086) #
Both Vladdy and Bo playing hero ball in the first. Huge hacks trying to hit 5 run homers early in the count against pitches nowhere near the plate.
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greenfrog - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 07:30 PM EDT (#444087) #
Leadoff double against Schmidt and Guerrero Jr., Bichette and Turner due up next…zero runs scored. Disappointing.
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greenfrog - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 07:37 PM EDT (#444088) #
Vogelbach took a 3-1 fastball right down the middle, then struck out on a fastball inside well off the plate.
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uglyone - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 07:37 PM EDT (#444089) #
yeah vlad and bo hacking at that crap to put themselves in 0-2 holes is upsetting for sure. of course, the team did tell them to "do some damage" so they're just following instructions.

Clement should be our starting 3B.
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99BlueJaysWay - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 07:38 PM EDT (#444090) #
Gausman 4 seamers clocking in at 89 is…..concerning.

If you’re warmed up properly the cold shouldn’t matter
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greenfrog - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 07:43 PM EDT (#444091) #
Varsho seems to be vulnerable to fastballs up and in, fastballs up and away (he just struck out on one), and pitches low and away. That's a lot of areas for pitchers to attack.
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uglyone - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 07:51 PM EDT (#444092) #
Lineup using 2yr wRC+ (before tonight):

* RF Springer 104
* 1B Guerrero 116
* SS Bichette 119
* DH Turner 118
* LF Schneider 174
* C Jansen 116
* 2B Biggio 104
* 3B Clement 138
* CF Kiermaier 98

* PH Vogelbach 108
* OF Varsho 83
* IF Falefa 82
* C Kirk 91
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Nigel - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 07:56 PM EDT (#444093) #
I’m hopeful that Varsho can outhit IKF. Hopeful but not certain.
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Petey Baseball - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:14 PM EDT (#444094) #
Does Vladdy need to go back to the minors?

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lexomatic - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:16 PM EDT (#444095) #
Oh good the site isn't letting me post on mobile Firefox again.

89 mph 4FB should get a medical checkup for Gausman
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John Northey - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:23 PM EDT (#444096) #
I suspect this is the price of Gausman having a short spring. Dead arm period showing up against the Yankees. Grrr.
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uglyone - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:24 PM EDT (#444097) #
Clement is our best player.
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greenfrog - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:32 PM EDT (#444098) #
wRC+

IKF 83

Varsho 27
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dalimon5 - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:36 PM EDT (#444099) #
Biggio and IKF dropped out of the order as starters. Good.

Next thing to do is move Varsho to bottom of the line up and ... time to move Vladdy down to #6 once Jansen comes back. Terrible approaches and no consistency. Just don't know if he's going to walk 3 times or go chasing and go 0/5
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krose - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:43 PM EDT (#444100) #
A rosy suggestion or tomorrow’s game.
Clement 3B
Springer RF
Turner DH
Schneider 2B
Kirk C
Biggio LF
Bichette SS
Kiermaier CF
Guerrero 1B

Should be good for an ego explosion. 🙄
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Nigel - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:43 PM EDT (#444101) #
Biggio, Schneider and Clement should play 2nd, LF and 3B for a while. Varsho and IKF can sit.
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greenfrog - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:50 PM EDT (#444102) #
Another shocking thing about Vladdy is the power outage. Is he even a 30 HR player anymore?
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krose - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 08:56 PM EDT (#444103) #
Dare I suggest that Guerrero be traded at the deadline. If the Jays are in contention try to get someone who could help this year. If not in contention then get the best available player/prospect.
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dalimon5 - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 09:00 PM EDT (#444104) #
He grew up hitting HRs in batting practice. Had elite best ever eye and patience then somewhere in the majors he started chasing and pressing. He seems to me to be the guy who hits 200 bombs at the HR derby and 25 HR in a season. He's a good player to me on par with guys like Turner and Springer. He's nowhere near his friends like Soto, Devers or Tatis Jr.
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dalimon5 - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 09:03 PM EDT (#444105) #
The Mets would jump on a trade of Alonso and RP for VGJ. Alonso is a free agent one year before Vladdy.
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krose - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 09:04 PM EDT (#444106) #
Agreed dalimon. He hurts the team because he’s not as good as he could be. Was always going to be such with him.
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dalimon5 - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 09:28 PM EDT (#444108) #
I don't think he's hurting the team so much as the way they play him and build everything around him is hurting their chances.
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Nigel - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 09:32 PM EDT (#444109) #
Turner starting against a RHP tough on RH’s isn’t a good idea these days either.
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uglyone - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 09:39 PM EDT (#444110) #
rallycaps
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Gerry - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 10:23 PM EDT (#444111) #
Why not run Biggio for Vogelbach there? I know he is the last man on the bench but this is the last inning.
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uglyone - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 10:24 PM EDT (#444112) #
I think he might want Biggio's bat still.
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uglyone - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 10:25 PM EDT (#444113) #
Davis Schneider can hit righties too.
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Nigel - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 10:27 PM EDT (#444114) #
If the Jays were a meritocracy (which they clearly are not) then playing time choices are starting to get obvious.
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uglyone - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 10:30 PM EDT (#444115) #
regardless of what happens this is actually my favorite offensive game of the season.

steady consistent chipping away inning after inning.

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uglyone - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 10:31 PM EDT (#444116) #
maybe just start schneider and biggio, coach.
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BlueJayWay - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 10:32 PM EDT (#444117) #
Offence finally showed some life at least.
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BlueMonday - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 10:52 PM EDT (#444118) #
Isn’t there a pitcher they coulda pinch run for Vogelbach in the 9th? Marcus Stro… , oh , wait, he’s on the other team.
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John Northey - Saturday, April 06 2024 @ 11:22 PM EDT (#444119) #
I think Kikuchi is the designated pitcher for running. I get why they didn't though. Sucks, but made sense.
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85bluejay - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 09:08 AM EDT (#444121) #
It would be best for everyone if the Jays optioned Varsho to Buffalo to work on his hitting and gain some confidence while using Lukes/Schneider in the outfield - I don't expect the team to do this because of the criticism they received for the trade.
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Joe - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 10:09 AM EDT (#444123) #

Brandon Belt, wRC+

YearThrough first ~30 PASeason
202161159
202222498
202317138

Vladimir Guerrero Jr, wRC+

YearThrough first ~30 PASeason
2021206166
2022265133
2023187118

Bo Bichette, wRC+

YearThrough first ~30 PASeason
202196122
202264130
2023116125

Daulton Varsho, wRC+

YearThrough first ~30 PASeason
202124100
202288107
202316785

My thesis statement: don't believe anything you see in April or September.
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greenfrog - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 10:47 AM EDT (#444124) #
It's hard to predict what Varsho's next few seasons (2024-26) will look like. If he can be a merely competent hitter, he should be very a valuable player. Even with an 85 wRC+ last year, he still had significant overall value. I do find it concerning that his offensive value has declined so much since his time with Arizona. And he currently looks awful at the plate. It seems as if pitchers are in charge and imposing their game on him. But, as Joe points out, the 2024 sample is very small.
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Gerry - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 11:30 AM EDT (#444125) #
The Jays have two hitters in today's lineup with batting averages above .200, Biggio at .250 and Clement at .333.

The Yankees were challenging Clement yesterday with high fastballs, lets see if they continue with that approach today.
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lexomatic - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 11:41 AM EDT (#444126) #
Can't paste on mobile Firefox, but Keegan Matheson has a quote ,on twitter from Mattingly, and clearly his philosophy is the problem with the offense.
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uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 11:42 AM EDT (#444127) #
Messaging change already.

Don Mattingly says “Damage is kind of a scary word”… he wants good swings in good pitches, not just chasing power.

“I don’t really see us as a huge power club. But we do have a chance for, I think, four or five guys hitting 20 or above. That would be good for us.” #BlueJays pic.twitter.com/Q2smlZmxTW

— Keegan Matheson (@KeeganMatheson) April 7, 2024
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scottt - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 11:58 AM EDT (#444129) #
By OPS
1. Schneider .981
2. Turner .936
3. Clement .889
4. Biggio .825
5. Springer .765
6. Vogelbach .697
7. Guerrero .689
8. IKF .533
9. Bichette .467
10. Varsho .405
11. Kirk .392
12. Serven .286
13. KK .269

For me, Bichette, Kirk and KK are the main underperformers at this point.

Losing Gausman will hurt and then some.

Gil who pitches today is pretty good. The Yankees pen isn't that great.
A would be patient and try to get Gil out early. He's coming off TJ and only went 84 pitches in Arizona.

[ Reply to This ]
greenfrog - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 12:17 PM EDT (#444131) #
Varsho is hitting .143/.226/.179 with no home runs or stolen bases and he doesn’t qualify as one of the main underperformers on the team? That’s a weird assessment.
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Gerry - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 12:21 PM EDT (#444132) #
Alek Manoah has pitched one inning for Dunedin. He didn't give up a hit, but he walked four, used 28 pitches, nine were strikes.
[ Reply to This ]
Gerry - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 12:42 PM EDT (#444134) #
Manoah came out for the second inning, started throwing strikes, and was hit around for five runs (so far). He was pulled with two outs and seven runs in.
[ Reply to This ]
mathesond - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 12:44 PM EDT (#444135) #
How are Manoah's broadcasting chops? He might be following the Steve Blass career path.
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dalimon5 - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 01:01 PM EDT (#444136) #
This front office literally has nothing to show as positive besides a stadium renovation. If this is the final year of the Atkins and Shapiro experience it will end on a whimper.

I guess you can say they have a great rotation and have been competitive along with the renovations. Here's a recap of what's gone wrong:

Highest payroll team in history and talent that does not match that level of expenditure.

"Waves of prospects" strategy ended up really being "tons of mediocre players with positional flexibility and years of control."

Generational talent in Vladdy who has become just a good player out of his elite projections.

Two managers that have failed to impress.

Top draft picks trending in the wrong direction and limiting the FO's trade capital and major league contributions.

Major disconnect with fan base when it comes to organization philosophy and stance on things like homophobia. Also a huge level of bull shit when discussing the teams performance and goals.

Probably the biggest issue is what I now consider a failure of this teams analytics department.


Very disappointed to say that struggling through as a fan while watching Alan Hansen and Kendry's Morales man the corners was actually not the low point of this FO's tenure.

Short of pulling an AA move and trading everything for elite stars... I am firm in my 180 degree turn on Shapiro and Atkins. Very strange to say it but these two suits lack what JP Ricciardo had...some honesty both with themselves and the fan base.
[ Reply to This ]
scottt - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 01:20 PM EDT (#444138) #
People have the weirdest complaints. Like the payroll being high is a problem?

Springer, Gausman, Bassitt and Berrios and the only guys signed to large contracts.
They've been very careful with those.

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uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 01:26 PM EDT (#444139) #
It's not a problem, but the payroll being high is literally the only reason the shapiro era isn't an utter disaster.

Re: Manoah - i'm guessing we hear more about "shoulder soreness" now.
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greenfrog - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 01:39 PM EDT (#444140) #
I think the front office was heavily focused on a lot of the right difference-making players on the trade and FA market -- Cole, Seager, Freeman, Ramirez, Ohtani, Yamamoto. They just weren't able to go the extra mile to land any of them. Of course, they deal acquire some good players in Gausman, Springer, Berrios and Bassitt (among others).

Arguably, the main problem under the current front office is an underperforming farm system.
[ Reply to This ]
dalimon5 - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 01:43 PM EDT (#444141) #
"Highest payroll team in history and talent that does not match that level of expenditure."

Scott please widen your browser window to read past the first 5 words...
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Petey Baseball - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 01:48 PM EDT (#444142) #
It looks like Mr. Manoah is going to be a far fetched reclamation project. I would hope now we stop hearing daily podcast style rosterbation from Dan Shulman regarding him. He's not coming back.

Please Dan, not another diatribe on roster stuff. Just please call the game.



[ Reply to This ]
greenfrog - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 01:48 PM EDT (#444143) #
Current batting averages of the first four hitters in the Jays lineup:

.176
.176
.172
.179
[ Reply to This ]
Petey Baseball - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 01:49 PM EDT (#444144) #
Sorry. Not diatribe....I mean...discussion.
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Eephus - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 01:55 PM EDT (#444145) #
Angel up to his usual tricks. Sorry Bowden but that was a no-pitch.
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James W - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 01:57 PM EDT (#444146) #
How does the whole crew miss that? Similarly, how did they butcher the catcher's interference call yesterday.

The pitch wasn't even in the zone, but "LOL Angel"
[ Reply to This ]
Petey Baseball - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:00 PM EDT (#444147) #
Re: Mattingly's comments...I was already tired in week 2 of Spring Training of Schneider's "doing damage" mantra.

[ Reply to This ]
uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:02 PM EDT (#444148) #
agreed - especially since i think it's the absolute worst advice for Vladdy, who should be being told nothing but "PATIENCE PATIENCE PATIENCE".
[ Reply to This ]
bpoz - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:04 PM EDT (#444149) #
L Maroudis is quite good.
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uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:08 PM EDT (#444150) #
Schneider at least is showing some recognition that most of the bats in the order are interchangeable and aside from a few guys at the top the rest should all have to be in a pretty even competition for playing time. Biggio flipping up over Varsho and KK is reasonable and deserved regardless of the sample size. Clement also deserves playing time regardless of the sample size. So it's good to see these moves.

The one exception to this seems to be Varsho, who is being treated as an every day player no matter what still. This is even more annoying because it specifically impacts the playing time of the most interesting potential helpful depth bat - Davis Schneider.

And i'm a guy who still kinda thinks Varsho will hit better - but that doesn't mean that he should be treated differently than most of the rest of the depth bats on the roster.

Also, Falefa is getting too much priority too....but not quite as much as Varsho at least.

[ Reply to This ]
Petey Baseball - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:12 PM EDT (#444151) #
Did Shulman just say Manoah will be at Opening Day tomorrow?

I realize he's on the 40 man roster still, but what must the team be thinking? Gee my man, great that you're here supporting us but considering you've had a total of three competitive major league outings in the last calendar year, refused a demotion causing a major team distraction, and have pitched so badly you're again an unwanted point of conversation..perhaps you'd like to take a hike?
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uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:14 PM EDT (#444152) #
I think I figured out what bugged me about Mattingly's comments today, even though I actually liked what he was saying. It's that they are completely at odds with what Schneider was saying all spring, here a week into the season.

I think this probably speaks to a big problem with the team - nobody knows who's in charge here. It's just an endless series of front office pieces and managers and supervisors and coaches - just a bunch of middle managers with no clear Boss Man with no clear messaging, and every one of them willing and able to pass the buck when it comes time for accountability.
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Petey Baseball - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:25 PM EDT (#444154) #
Well said, ugly. I felt the same way.

They're getting bailed out today by a pitcher who doesn't really know where the ball is going once its thrown.

I've always maintained Vladdy's issues are more swing mechanics than pitch selection.
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uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:33 PM EDT (#444155) #
Angel Hernandez is just so terrible I actually feel bad for the fricken yankees here.
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Eephus - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:46 PM EDT (#444156) #
Well, enjoy the rest of your Sunday everyone.
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dalimon5 - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:48 PM EDT (#444158) #
Yes ugly well said.
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lexomatic - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:49 PM EDT (#444159) #
Well, enjoy the rest of your Sunday everyone.

Angel Hernandez is just so terrible I actually feel bad for the fricken yankees here.
I haven't looked at the gameday yet. how  bad has this inning been for calls?That it's Hernandez, and there've been a ton of walks, and a 2 out grand slam suggests no control from Francis, or more likely, tons of blown calls from the ump.
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99BlueJaysWay - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:50 PM EDT (#444160) #
It’s too bad. That wasn’t a terrible pitch, but after throwing 30+ pitches it didn’t quite have the run of some of his other fastballs. He didn’t do himself any favours completely losing the zone against Judge and Cabrera.
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99BlueJaysWay - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:52 PM EDT (#444161) #
In reply to ugly’s comment re: Manoah’s shoulder, here’s a quote from him after the game:

I don’t care about the numbers,” Manoah said. “I felt really good. Everything was coming out really good. I feel like we were around the zone for the most part. But I think the biggest thing is the body felt good, velo was good, (pitches had) movement. So, just got to continue to feel good and continue to attack."
[ Reply to This ]
lexomatic - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:55 PM EDT (#444162) #
I haven't looked at the gameday yet. how  bad has this inning been for calls?That it's Hernandez, and there've been a ton of walks, and a 2 out grand slam suggests no control from Francis, or more likely, tons of blown calls from the ump.
So it was bad for the Yankees, and Francis lost it. Could be he's mostly a 3 inning pitcher. Scrolling through it seems like there's 1 bad swing by the Jays vs a pitch totally out of the strike zone derailing at bats. Clement had a Varsho AB, Varsho fought for that walk. Did he look okay at least, or was it a lucky result? I find this kind of game so un-fun to watch.


[ Reply to This ]
99BlueJaysWay - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 02:58 PM EDT (#444163) #
Lexo, the calls were fine, Francis just lost the zone to a couple guys, and then couldn’t consistently out his fastball where he wanted to Stanton and Rizzo
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greenfrog - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 03:00 PM EDT (#444164) #
I wish the Jays had just traded prospects for Soto and had done with it. Or signed Snell. I would be fine with an “all in” 2024 followed by a rebuild. The “middle mush” is just so boring to watch.
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Petey Baseball - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 03:01 PM EDT (#444165) #
"I don't care about the numbers."
..etc..etc.

He speaks with the false confidence of a guy coming off Cy Young campaign throwing to amateurs playing oopsie ball.

Glad his arm feels good. I don't expect a bunch of expletives and self loathing, but the hubris to say "yeah I don't care about numbers" after walking the first 4 batters of the game and giving up seven runs in two innings is pretty hilarious.
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uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 03:01 PM EDT (#444166) #
that's great. legit the most encouraging thing I could have heard from him. good stuff.
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Michael - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 03:09 PM EDT (#444167) #
The calls didn't seem terrible to me, but there were a bunch of close pitches that narrowly missed (especially high) that were called strikes. And some outside pitches that were probably right on the edge that were balls. At least from what it looked like on the broadcast box.
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uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 03:09 PM EDT (#444168) #
would really like to see some consistent at bats the rest of this one like we saw last night when they went down. at least get some guys on each inning and cause them some stress.
[ Reply to This ]
uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 03:13 PM EDT (#444169) #
there we go. keep plugging.
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uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 03:17 PM EDT (#444171) #
I love all these walks.

Even if Buck grimaces every time.
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uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 03:22 PM EDT (#444173) #
no results but those are two good at bats from Biggio and Clement. keep plugging.
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scottt - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 03:30 PM EDT (#444174) #
They are not overpaying anyone. All the big contracts have been worth the money.
They even took Guerrero to arbitration.

The main reason for the high payroll is that players don't want to play for Toronto or Canada.
Guys are here only because no other teams were willing to match offers.

Now, let's hope Yariel Rodriguez can be a solid starter.
[ Reply to This ]
uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 03:35 PM EDT (#444175) #
more good at bats. keep em coming.
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bpoz - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 03:41 PM EDT (#444176) #
Vlad and Bo are getting chances to catch up yo NYY.
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uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 04:10 PM EDT (#444177) #
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Leaside Cowboy - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 04:19 PM EDT (#444178) #
The club was no-hit, so the next day they wore the road grey uniforms. The following day, the club managed 1 hit, and since then they switched back to dark blue.
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dalimon5 - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 04:41 PM EDT (#444179) #
Tough to watch. Very tough to watch.
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greenfrog - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 04:54 PM EDT (#444180) #
Jays in last place in the AL East, 4 games back of New York. On April 7.
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uglyone - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 04:55 PM EDT (#444181) #
i'll go against the grain here - i don't mind this series.

sucks that Gausman had his worst start ever but that's not gonna be a thing.
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Nigel - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 05:00 PM EDT (#444182) #
The pitching is actually as much, if not more, of the problem right now.
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christaylor - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 05:41 PM EDT (#444183) #
Totally agree -- a 4-6 road trip to begin the year and a competitive 1-2 (with the issue being pitching) is not great, but well within the realm of reasonable expectations of how this team would start.

The losses to Tampa and Houston were much more painful/concerning in comparison. April is always a bit weird.

[ Reply to This ]
Gerry - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 05:53 PM EDT (#444184) #
It looked to me that Vlad and Bo were starting to find their strokes, so hopefully they come home with a bang.
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vw_fan17 - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 07:12 PM EDT (#444185) #
I decided to erase the post I wrote before the game. But, it's hard to hold back.

As soon as I saw the Stanton swing, I said "there goes the game". And sure enough, even if the mop-up guys hadn't given up any more runs, we would not have overcome 5-1. We don't have any comparable hitters to Judge / Soto and even the odd Stanton bomb at this point. Vlad's getting paid $20M to be a 2 WAR player in arbitration - that's where you're supposed to come out ahead with surplus value.. Pretty sure Belt could have done his job $10-12M. And Bowden Francis hasn't fooled anyone so far.. Before today, he'd contributed -0.3 WAR in 5.1 IP. That's only going to get worse after this game.

At this point, what kind of extension deal would you offer VGJ? What would he get on the open market? Would he even get $200M/10?

Hopefully things turn around, but I'm almost at the point of advocating for cleaning house (including management) and doing a full rebuild.
[ Reply to This ]
dalimon5 - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 07:18 PM EDT (#444186) #
Gerry, what exactly do you see from Vlad to suggest he's finding his swing? He hit an 89MPH mistake from a pitcher. His other at bats I've seen him chasing outside the zone and in the second game where he had an 12 pitch at bat he missed about 3 or 4 mistakes over the plate.
[ Reply to This ]
greenfrog - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 07:39 PM EDT (#444187) #
Speaking of April being weird, two teams in the NL West have a +16 run differential. One of them (LAD) is 8-3. The other (AZ) is 4-6.

The current AL East run differentials are:

NYY +10
Bos +26
Bal +15
TB -9
Tor -17
[ Reply to This ]
Gerry - Sunday, April 07 2024 @ 07:59 PM EDT (#444188) #
I just thought he was getting closer to making good contact. He had been terrible in the last few games but he seemed more in control today.

I just went back and checked through gameday. He had just one swing and miss today, in the first inning. Thats an improvement. Even though several of the at bats didn't result in a hit, he fouled off some pitches and just looked to be closer to making good contact.

Unfortunately he will be facing some top notch pitchers in the home opener series.
[ Reply to This ]
Leaside Cowboy - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 06:54 AM EDT (#444190) #
Today is the 50th anniversary of Hank Aaron's 715th home run.
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Joe - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 07:53 AM EDT (#444191) #
I thought both Vladdy and Bo were looking better the past few games, including Vlad's long PA that ended in a K. Swinging at strikes they can drive, letting pitcher's pitches go by. Their results have started to show that, too, with a couple XBH each last two games. (Bo walked twice yesterday.)

I get why people might be pessimistic, but I'm an eternal optimist — quintuply so when it's less than 5% of the way through the season.

[ Reply to This ]
Glevin - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 09:23 AM EDT (#444192) #
"Totally agree -- a 4-6 road trip to begin the year and a competitive 1-2 (with the issue being pitching) is not great, but well within the realm of reasonable expectations of how this team would start."

Absolutely. It's not a "sky is falling" scenario or anything. 3 road series against 3 very good teams.
[ Reply to This ]
greenfrog - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 09:32 AM EDT (#444193) #
The sky isn't falling, but it was a concerning first 10 games. And the team's opponents were without some key players like Verlander, Cole, LeMahieu, Lowe and others. As Mark Polishuk wrote yesterday on MLBTR, "the slow start is very concerning since it seems like the lineup has gone from 'inconsistent' to 'maybe just bad.'"
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dalimon5 - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 09:50 AM EDT (#444194) #
Yeah, plus it's just crazy that only 2 or 3 players are hitting above the Mendoza line.
[ Reply to This ]
bpoz - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 10:49 AM EDT (#444196) #
I am a very strong believer in SSS.
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99BlueJaysWay - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 11:32 AM EDT (#444198) #
Just to add another data point:

Yesterday Ronel Blanco no-hit Texas over 5 2/3. Texas managed 2 hits in the entire game. I think everyone here would agree that their offence will be good this year. As others have said, April is weird.
[ Reply to This ]
ISLAND BOY - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 11:41 AM EDT (#444199) #
I wonder what the reception for John Schneider will be like at the pregame introductions. He's not the most popular guy in Toronto.
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John Northey - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 11:43 AM EDT (#444200) #
Lets check playoff teams of the Jays after 10 games...
  • 2023: 6-4, Vlad & Chapman both had an 1.100+ OPS, Jansen 161, Kikuchi a 6.75 ERA, Romano blew the save but got the win in game 10.
  • 2022: 6-4, Vlad & Collins were over 1000 OPS, Kirk at 505, Bo 556, Romano had 6 saves already
  • 2020: 4-6, Teoscar was over 1000 OPS, Vlad 588, Pearson started 2.70 ERA, Romano a setup man
  • 2016: 5-5, Donaldson & Bautista over 1100, Martin under 200 OPS, Osuna had 4 saves already, Stroman 2-0 but 4.22 ERA
  • 2015: 5-5, Devon Travis over 1000, Martin 292, Encarnacion 575, Sanchez 0-2 6.23 ERA, Estrada used out of the pen.
  • 1993: 6-4, Carter over 1300 (!), Alomar at 529, Borders still recovering from his WS hangover at 479 (MVP of 92 series), Hentgen 2.13 ERA
  • 1992: 9-1, Winfield, Olerud, Kent, Ward all over 1000, Lee at 516 (someone had to start slow)
  • 1991: 6-4, Pat Tabler at 1400 (yes, that Pat Tabler), Mookie Wilson leading off with a 293 OPS, Denis Boucher looking like a great Canadian with a 2.92 ERA as a starter, Duane Ward going 2 2/3 in relief before blowing a lead in the 9th and losing in the 10th (was Henke injured? checked and he hadn't been used in days)
  • 1989: 5-5 (on the way to a 12-24 start), Gruber & McGriff over 1000, Jimmy Key throwing a complete game shutout on 111 pitches.
  • 1985: 6-4, Len Matuszek with a 1200 OPS (he'd be dumped by mid-season), Damaso Garcia leading off with a 540 OPS, Bill Caudill still the closer with 2 saves.


Note: in 1977 they were 5-5 after 10, 2-8 in '78, 4-6 in '79 - those are the 100 loss seasons.
90-99 loss seasons: 1980 5-5, 2004 3-7, 2019 3-7

So twice the Jays lost 90+ games after a 5-5 start, twice they made the playoffs after a 5-5 start. So nothing to get too worked up about right now. 4-6 has led to a 100 loss season, and to a playoff season.
[ Reply to This ]
ISLAND BOY - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 12:04 PM EDT (#444201) #
The Athletic's all-eclipse team:

1b - Rowdy Tellez-scope
2b - Hector Luna
SS - Alvin Dark
3b - Alex (Total) Liddi [ Totality - they were lacking in 3rd basemen]
OF - Jorge Soler, Moonlight Graham, Skye Bolt
c - Fernando Lunar
p - Sun-Woo Kim, Sonny Gray, Johnny (E) Klippstein, Blue Moon Odom, Pat Light, Ray King
Manager - Bud Black
[ Reply to This ]
greenfrog - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 12:07 PM EDT (#444202) #
Have the Blue Jays ever made the playoffs after posting a -17 run differential (or worse) after ten games?
[ Reply to This ]
mathesond - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 12:58 PM EDT (#444203) #
Has any team ever made the playoffs in the same season that they posted a -17 run differential over any 10 game stretch?
[ Reply to This ]
greenfrog - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 01:04 PM EDT (#444204) #
Glib comments aside, why is W-L record over the first 10 games more meaningful than run differential? I would argue that run differential provides a more accurate gauge of a team's true strength.
[ Reply to This ]
christaylor - Monday, April 08 2024 @ 01:56 PM EDT (#444208) #
The run differential leads to a Pythag of 3-7. And the Jays had two blow-outs where they were clearly saving arms.

Plus, you won't get the team's true strength over any given 10-game stretch. Didn't the 2013 Jays have a winning streak of 10+ games?
[ Reply to This ]
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