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The 2020 MLB draft concludes tonight with rounds two through five. You can watch here or check out the draft tracker here. #BlueJays

Vanderbilt infielder/outfielder Austin Martin was taken by the Toronto Blue Jays with the fifth overall pick of the 2020 draft Wednesday.

Round 2 - 42nd overall. RHP C.J. Van Eyk. Florida State. Bats Right. 6-foot-1, 198 lbs. Born September 15, 1998. Slot Value $1,771,100.

Baseball America Scouting Report - Van Eyk established himself as one of the more polished prep pitchers in the 2017 draft class. He ranked No. 109 on the BA 500 that year and would have been solidly in the top 100 of the class if it weren’t for health questions that stemmed from a forearm injury. Perhaps because of that, Van Eyk made his way to Florida State, where he has been extremely consistent. After starting just five games as a freshman, Van Eyk made a successful transition to a starting role in 2019, when he posted a 3.81 ERA over 99.1 innings and 18 starts, with more than 11 strikeouts per nine innings. He was off to another successful season in 2020, posting a 1.31 ERA over four starts and 20.2 innings with 25 strikeouts and 12 walks. Van Eyk gets things done with a solid three-pitch mix, including a fastball in the 90-95 mph range, a sharp, 78-80 mph downer curveball and an 81-84 mph changeup with sinking action that fools hitters on both sides. All three of those pitches are solid-average or better. Van Eyk can also spin a slider, but the pitch has less depth and less swing-and-miss potential than his curve. Van Eyk’s operation is clean, with a loose, fluid arm that comes from a deliberate windup with very little coil or torque in his lower half, some hooking action in the back and an easy, balanced finish. Everything about the operation screams starter, but Van Eyk’s stuff isn’t quite as explosive as the top-end pitchers in the class, which could make him more of a late first- or second-round pick. Scouting Report - A high school pitcher in Florida who was on the rise in 2017, Van Eyk missed a chunk of his senior year with arm soreness that all but cemented he'd be heading to Florida State instead of signing. After spending his freshman year pitching out of the bullpen, he made a smooth transition to the Seminoles' rotation as a sophomore and is now near the top of a solid crop of college pitchers in the Sunshine State eligible for the 2020 Draft. Van Eyk has a solid three-pitch mix that he knows how to use extremely well. He's been up to 95 mph, usually working in the 93-94 mph range, with his fastball and commands it well to both sides of the plate. He really knows how to spin his curveball, a breaking ball with almost 12-to-6 action that has really good late downward bite. He throws it in the upper-70s more often than not, but can add and subtract as needed. His changeup is his third pitch, and would be more effective if it had more sink, but he does throw it with good arm speed to fool hitters. The Florida State ace is capable of being a complete pitcher because of his willingness to pitch in with his fastball, his ability to throw his breaking ball at any point in the count and his feel for mixing his pitches to keep hitters off-balance, though issues with his command persisted over his first four starts in 2020. His potential as a starter still should have him in consideration in the top two rounds of the Draft. Video

Twitter Reaction

@FutureBlueJays Blue Jays select Florida St RHP CJ Van Eyk with their 2nd round pick.Reports say he has a good three pitch mix, although his CH could use more downward movement. Had some command issues. Has a starter’s profile.

@bnicholsonsmith With their second-round pick, the #BlueJays select a college pitcher, right-hander CJ Van Eyk. In four starts at Florida State this year, he posted a 1.31 ERA with 25 Ks compared to 12 walks.

@KendallRogers CJ Van Eyk put together one of the better performances I’ve seen in a super regional at LSU last year. The @FSUBaseball righty flashes plus with the CB/CH and the FB can get up to 94-95. Love this choice by the @BlueJays

@mason_mcrae Wow. Fantastic addition for Toronto, Van Eyk’s got three plus pitches at his best, sitting in the mid-90’s with some of the best starter stuff in the draft. He’s 42nd on my board and goes 42nd in the draft. Some lower half concerns and I’d have preferred two other Florida arms.

@mason_mcrae Meet Blue Jays Second Round Pick, CJ Van Eyk. Right away you'll notice his plus-CB and feel for two breaking Balls. Amazing Pick by Shane Farrell & co, once again proving how tuned the organization is as a whole.

@lauraarmy #BlueJays use their second-round pick on RHP CJ Van Eyk from Florida State University. The 42nd selection overall, Van Eyk was ranked by MLB Pipeline as the No. 39 prospect in the class, 5th on Keith Law's list of best remaining players.

@brettpn CJ Van Eyk is off the board to the @BlueJays in the second round. 4-pitch mix with two above average off-speed pitches and a low-effort, athletic delivery project him as a long-term starter despite control issues.

@jgoldstrass Yesterday, the #BlueJays drafted Austin Martin, bringing him into the same org. as college teammate Philip Clarke. Today, they draft CJ Van Eyk, reuniting him in the same org. with high school teammate PK Morris and college teammate Cobi Johnson.

@DavidSalituro #BlueJays 2nd-round pick CJ Van Eyk only pitched 4 games in the abbreviated '20 college season, but didn't surrender more than a run in any of them. He had 11.1 K/9, only gave up 1 hit in 6 innings against FAU on Feb. 28.

@Alek_Manoah47 Yoooo this man is nasty!! Let’s get it bro bro @cjvaneyk17

@big_nate5 Let’s gooooo! Congrats @cjvaneyk17! Welcome to the @BlueJays

Round 3 - 77th overall. RHP Trent Palmer. Jacksonville University (FL). Bats Right. 6-foot-1, 230 lbs. Born April 2, 1999. Slot Value $805,600.

Baseball America Scouting Report - Palmer’s first year as a full-time starter with Jacksonville got off to a great start as the righthander struck out 41 batters and walked just five over 27.2 innings in his first four starts. He was getting plenty of scouting attention for his early season performance after running his fastball up to 97 mph last summer in the Cape Cod League. On the Cape, Palmer appeared in seven games as a reliever and posted a 1.45 ERA in 18.2 innings with 21 strikeouts and eight walks. Palmer threw much better strikes this spring than he previously did as a reliever with Jacksonville in 2018 and 2019, and scouts think of him firmly as a top 200 prospect because of his improvement. This spring his fastball sat mostly in the 92-95 mph range, touching 96, and he’s mixed in two above-average secondaries in a slider and a changeup. His slider is a firm breaking ball in the 84-87 mph range. At 6-foot-1, 230 pounds, Palmer will need to maintain his body moving forward, but he’s shown a repeatable delivery that should give him every opportunity to start. Scouting Report - Jacksonville University has produced a lot of Draft talent over the past several years, including back-to-back third-round picks Michael Baumann (2017) and Austin Hays (2016), both with the Baltimore Orioles. While Palmer obviously hasn't been as scouted as any of his Dolphins predecessors, his arm strength and strong start to his spring, not to mention a successful turn as a reliever last summer on Cape, has his name popping up in the same area of the Draft. While not a prototype for a starting pitcher size-wise (6-foot-1, 230 pounds), some scouts do feel he has the chance to stick in a rotation because of his ability to maintain velocity and have a three- or four-pitch mix. He throws his fastball in the 91-96 mph range with good sink and he backs it up with a pair of solid secondary offerings. His changeup is a splitter thrown with good arm speed and downward action in the 82-84 mph range, and he throws a 79-83 mph slider with sweeping action, but with some depth. He can toss in a slower curveball in the low 70s, but it's definitely a fourth pitch. Command has been an issue at times for Palmer and he has more experience out of the pen than in a rotation, leading many scouts to want to make him a reliever at the next level. If teams saw enough of his very strong opening to 2020 (1.30 ERA, 41/5 K/BB ratio in four starts) to believe he has the chance to start, he could join Baumann and Hays in the top three rounds. Video

Twitter Reaction

@DavidSalituro Get to know Trent Palmer: 8.2 K/9 last season, 50th in the nation, 1.30 ERA in 27.2 innings. Struck out 13 in his last start against Illinois State, giving up only 3 hits in 9 innings.

@jeffMLBdraft Trent Palmer could have jumped a lot based on his early-season performance walk rate under 2 per nine K rate over 13.

@JoeHealyBA I wrote last week about how the Atlantic Sun has earned a reputation as a pitchers' league, and it proved it again with the selection of @JUBaseball's Trent Palmer 77th overall. Big, hard-throwing righty.

@TylerJennings24 Trent Palmer to Toronto. Excelled in his first year of starting full time this year. Touched 97 on the Cape last year, good slider and change-up too.

@NickAshbourne The Blue Jays grab RHP Trent Palmer with the 77th pick. Ranks 76th on Keith Law's top 100 and 114th on MLB Pipeline's top 200.

@BaseballCloudUS The @BlueJays with a great pick taking @JUBaseball pitcher Trent Palmer 77th overall. He threw gas topping out at 98mph and spun his Slider up to 2900rpm this season and was poised for a great year before it getting cut short. #JUPhinsUp

Andrew Gibson @1010XLAG Scouting report on @BlueJays RHP Trent Palmer from @JUBaseball head coach @chayes11_JU - 91-97 from a 3/4 arm slot - A same plane slider with late break - Split change that looks like a fastball until the last 5-6 ft. of delivery. "It's pretty special"

Round 4 - 106th overall. RHP Nick Frasso. Loyola Marymount. Bats Right. 6-foot-5, 200 lbs. Born October 18, 1998 . Slot Value $549,000

Baseball America Scouting Report - Frasso impressed with four scoreless innings in his lone start for USA Baseball’s Collegiate National Team last summer. He entered this spring considered a potential first-round pick, but he failed to get through five innings in either of his first two starts before being shut down with forearm tightness. Frasso is one of the most athletic pitchers in the 2020 draft class. He was a high school basketball standout capable of throwing down emphatic dunks, and he still has a basketball build at 6-foot-5, 200 pounds with room to fill out. Frasso still has a relatively fresh arm due to his two-sport background. His 92-95 mph fastball plays up with both a high spin rate and plus extension, and his high-spin slider gives him a second potential plus offering, although it is inconsistent. His changeup is rudimentary but flashes average potential. Frasso locates his fastball to both sides of the plate and fills up the strike zone. He projects as a plus strike thrower overall. Frasso checks a lot of analytical boxes with his spin rates and extension, while traditional scouts love his athleticism and projection. He is in second-to-third-round consideration on talent, but concerns about the health of his arm may drop him lower. Scouting Report - Coming out of Palos Verdes Peninsula High School in Southern California, Frasso was a tall and gangly basketball player and pitcher with a ton of upside, but who had difficulty making the transition from one sport to the next, which kept his velocity down for much of the spring. He looked like the type of pitching prospect who needed college, and that's proven to be true. Focusing on baseball at Loyola Marymount, he's started catching up to his upside over his first two years, though an elbow injury suffered before the shutdown put his Draft stock a bit more in question. Frasso pitched mostly in relief as a sophomore so he could have more of a regular impact, and ended up saving 10 games. But he began his junior year as a starter, with the chance to work on his three-pitch mix. The velocity is now there consistently when healthy, and the 6-foot-5 right-hander is up to 97 mph with his fastball. He's lived off his four-seamer up in the zone almost entirely during his college career and it misses a ton of bats, as it has tremendous life. He has a sweeping 74-76 mph curve that can be effective at times as he tunnels it off of his fastball and shows some glimpses of an 80-82 mph changeup. Very thin with a herky jerky delivery, Frasso is athletic enough to repeat it consistently and throw a good amount of strikes, even if he's not a pinpoint command guy. Had he been able to prove he could start, he would have likely made a jump up Draft boards. The injury clouded things further, though he was reportedly throwing and working his way back when the season stopped. Pro teams could still send him out as a starter, knowing that he's very effective out of the bullpen as well. Video

Twitter Reaction

@bnicholsonsmith Decades ago, Dave Stieb & Tim Raines both went 106th overall. This year, the Blue Jays use their fourth-round selection on Nick Frasso, a right-handed pitcher from Loyola Marymount

@mason_mcrae Under-the-Radar pick from the Jays here in Nick Frasso. He played for the collegiate team this summer and only pitched twice this year but he's deceptive and gets awkward swings on his stuff. Likely a high-leverage reliever opposed to starter, but he's got an above average CB.

@affranco10 Blue Jays' Nick Frasso is pretty raw for a college arm but he's a gifted athlete with a mid-90's FB. Like him as a developmental flyer

@BlueJays fourth-round draft pick @nickfrasso is a FREAK athlete. Here's a video of the former @FirebirdsCCBL right-hander putting on a dunk clinic during a rain delay this past summer. @MLBNetwork @karlravechespn @Official_CCBL Video here

Round 5 - 136th overall. OF Zach Britton. Louisville. Bats Left, Throws Right . 6-foot-1, 200 lbs. Born September 9, 1998. Slot Value $410,100.

Baseball America Scouting Report - A 6-foot-1, 200-pound outfielder who was one of just three Louisville players to start all 17 games during the 2020 season, Britton has a fairly loud lefthanded bat. A career .280/.395/.455 hitter in 110 games with the Cardinals, Britton has a pretty lefthanded swing with good bat speed and some impressive exit velocity numbers. His hitting ability is the best tool in his box, and before play shut down for the 2020 season, Britton led all Division I hitters with 11 doubles. His power has been more doubles than over-the-fence in his time in the ACC, though he did hit five home runs in 28 games with a wood bat last summer in the Cape Cod League. It’s possible with a few swing adjustments Britton could be geared for more home run juice. Defensively, Britton fits best in left field, where he’s a fringy runner with an arm that ranges from a 45- to 50-grade tool. He’s caught in the past but has been behind catchers at Louisville and during his time in the Cape and scouts don’t think he’s a good receiver behind the plate. Britton’s value comes from his bat, and his power potential from the left side puts him somewhere in the 5-7 round range.

Twitter Reaction

@bnicholsonsmith With their fifth and final draft pick of the 2020 draft, the #BlueJays chose OF Zach Britton from Louisville. Cue the Orioles jokes now...

2020 MLB Draft - Day 2 | 120 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
John Northey - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 05:23 PM EDT (#387420) #
Nice - Jays get a guy who the MLB broadcasters say was climbing before COVID hit, thus could've been a 1st rounder. Just what I wanted to see. A starter. Lets hope.
hypobole - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 05:24 PM EDT (#387421) #
Van Eyk ranked #38 ESPN, #42 FG.
Shoeless Joe - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 05:31 PM EDT (#387422) #
I’m not really that excited, doesn’t have explosive stuff and his command isn’t great.
tercet - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 05:36 PM EDT (#387423) #
Watched a few clips of him on Youtube, he didn't look special at all, perhaps we will go underslot on him and load up on some HS players in 3-5?
John Northey - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 05:40 PM EDT (#387424) #
Boy must suck to be an O's fan about now - the ML team sucks and the draft is going poorly - doing over picks each time - 1st round 10th ranked picked with #2 choice, 1st supplemental 30th choice, took a guy ranked #37, 2nd 39th choice took a 74th ranked guy. Ugh. Net drop of 8+7+35 = 50 slots. Yikes. They are going cheap it seems to me.

Jays meanwhile have 1st round - 5th pick, 2nd rank, 2nd round 42nd pick 39th rank. Nice so far and the early picks are the most vital. As you get lower the spread means less.

Yankees: 28th pick, 27th ranked
Red Sox: 17th pick, 139th rank (yay!)
Tampa: 24th pick, 14th rank; 37th pick, 40th rank.

So the O's and Red Sox are punting this draft it seems, while the Yankees and Rays are being their usual smart selves. Unless the O's and Sox know something no one else does of course.
Shoeless Joe - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 05:45 PM EDT (#387425) #
I really liked Hudson Haskin for Baltimore as a prospect and thought he was a good fit for the Jays in RD3. He didn’t rank highly on the mocks because he doesn’t have a pretty swing but he’s been a productive hitter and can play an above average CF.
John Northey - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 05:48 PM EDT (#387426) #
The White Sox took #12 ranked high school pitcher Jared Kelley which catches me as a wasted pick for them - a guy ranked that high must have told everyone he was going to college to have dropped to day 2. In the old days (last year) he'd have probably dropped to the 11th round so you don't lose slot money if he doesn't sign but the White Sox must be hoping he really was bluffing. In which case they get a great deal.

Cole Wilcox is now the highest ranked player (#23) a 4 year program done 2 years RH pitcher who has a bit of leverage but not lots. Weird he'd still be on the board mid-way through the 2nd round. The rest are ranked 30th or lower. Should be interesting to see what the Jays do with picks 3/4/5 as their first 2 are nice to have gotten.
John Northey - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 05:56 PM EDT (#387427) #
Rangers just took an unranked player in the 2nd round. Odd. Must be saving cash for something. They took a lower ranked guy than their pick in round 1. Wonder if teams are trying to go under budget this draft, even though the draft is already cheaper than normal. Wouldn't shock me. Glad the Jays so far don't appear to be.
Shoeless Joe - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 06:04 PM EDT (#387428) #
Jeff Passan says that Cole Wilcox wants 3 million to sign, hes likely not going to get drafted.
John Northey - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 06:07 PM EDT (#387429) #
Funny - $3 mil ain't gonna happen at this point for anyone. You had to be a day 1 guy to get that. Someone who is punting other picks might take him knowing they have space if they sign the cheap guys for nothing, but that is a stretch. Sounds like Wilcox is getting poor advise if he is pushing for that much. Next year will be a smaller base for picks too.
Shoeless Joe - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 06:10 PM EDT (#387430) #
Wilcox turned down 1st round money two years ago, and he still has three more years of college eligibility as a draft eligible sophmore and the NCAA giving the baseball guys an extra year.
#2JBrumfield - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 07:26 PM EDT (#387431) #
A couple of Canadian outfielders are heading to the Golden State.

Burlington, Ontario native Owen Caissie went 45th overall to San Diego and Richmond Hill, Ontario native David Calabrese was taken with the 82nd pick by the Los Angeles Angels.
#2JBrumfield - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 07:53 PM EDT (#387432) #
Another Canadian outfielder is taken as Ottawa's Jordan Nwogu goes to the Chicago Cubs with the 88th pick.
#2JBrumfield - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 08:03 PM EDT (#387433) #
According to TSN's Scott Mitchell, Toronto-born Trei Cruz—son of former Blue Jay Jose Cruz Jr.—was selected by Detroit in the third round, 73rd overall.
scottt - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 08:19 PM EDT (#387434) #
Father Okey works at Michigan as a research scientist in the department of Naval Architecture and Marine Engineering, while wife, Dr. Uche George-Nwogu is an assistant professor in the department of family medicine at the Michigan Medical School. Lived in Ottawa for 20 years but moved to Michigan in June.
scottt - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 08:27 PM EDT (#387435) #
Didn't go underslot. Actually, it looks like we're following Keith Law's rankings pretty closely.

Not sure about the pitchers. Guys with good off-speed stuff but with control issues.
Time will tell.

rtcaino - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 08:36 PM EDT (#387436) #
"Actually, it looks like we're following Keith Law's rankings pretty closely."

Maybe the FO is trying to bury the hatchet and trying to get him on our side going forward
John Northey - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 09:17 PM EDT (#387437) #
Strange draft for Boston - 2 unranked players, their first round pick used on a guy ranked 139th, only their 2nd round looks good - pick #89 on a guy ranked #42. Looks like they are trying to save money this draft which would be incredibly stupid on their parts so maybe their scouts have ranked guys drastically differently from how everyone else sees them.

Baltimore through 4 rounds now has underdrafted every single time. 7 slots lower than rank for their second pick was the closest to drafting the level they had they have done so far. Helps the Jays so I'm good with that. Their last 3 were over 20 slots lower in rank than their draft position. Must be trying to save money is all I can figure. But given it is the draft this is penny pinching ala Harold Ballard with the Leafs in the 80's where it saves money today but costs it later when you don't have the horses to win.

Tampa and the Yankees are drafting close to slot but also going outside at times. Given both of their reps I'd trust their scouts over the O's and Red Sox 10 times out of 10.
scottt - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 09:18 PM EDT (#387438) #
Frasso is not an under slot either.
Big guy with 2 good pitches.

rtcaino - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 09:29 PM EDT (#387439) #
The dunk by Frasso, linked in the tweet above, is quite impressive. That dude was UP.
John Northey - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 09:29 PM EDT (#387440) #
Jays ranks with 1 pick to go...
Pick - Rank - Who
5-2-Austin Marin SS RH
42-39 - CJ Van Eyk RHP
77-114 - Trent Palmer RHP
106-98 - Nick Frasso RHP

Yep, all but one were drafted later than their rank suggest they should've been. Net of +3+3-37+8. Just the one oddity there. Appears to mainly have been used in the pen in college but was shifting to starting this year so might have been a riser had the full year happened. Might be a case of the Jays scouts seeing him and saying he is the real deal as a starter thus worth grabbing.

Many, many top 100's left on the board, mostly high schoolers who have tons of leverage and probably won't sign. So the Jays have lots of choices here.
Forkball - Thursday, June 11 2020 @ 09:59 PM EDT (#387441) #
5th rounder is throwing me off. I’m only used to seeing the Jays benefit from Zach Britton not playing.
uglyone - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 12:26 AM EDT (#387442) #
Thumbs way up on the top 3 picks. The last 2 pretty meh but whatever.
hypobole - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 01:09 AM EDT (#387443) #
/I see mixed opinions here on Van Eyk, but found this:

"ESPN college baseball analyst Kyle Peterson says Van Eyk could be the steal of the draft."
uglyone - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 01:17 AM EDT (#387444) #
John Northey - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 03:32 AM EDT (#387445) #
Hypobole - that is what I love to see after a draft, that the Jays got someone who is seen as a potential steal. Heck, out of the 5 they got at least 2 who could look great later on then. I'm always hopeful though...
Gerry - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 07:37 AM EDT (#387446) #
I don't know much about Frasso but I am always intrigued by an athletic guy. Someone like that has several ways to make it and correct his flaws.
scottt - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 08:25 AM EDT (#387447) #
Britton is a left bat. We got Martin because Baltimore decided to grab the best left bat.
We'll see.

Glevin - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 09:44 AM EDT (#387448) #
Keith Law on Van Eyk - "CJ Van Eyk here for the Blue Jays - looked like a high first-rounder in the preseason this spring." Law had him #23 overall on his board.

After first 2 rounds, very unlikely any one player makes it to the majors so it's more of a crapshoot.

I'd have new Jays top-10 prospects something like this

10-Van Eyk/Kay

It's a very good system with around 4-6 top-100 prospects and Moreno and Kirk not all that far away.
hypobole - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 10:33 AM EDT (#387449) #
Nothing to do with the Jays (I hope), but does the 3 round rule where an unsigned pick gets transferred to next year still apply with this draft?
Shoeless Joe - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 10:48 AM EDT (#387450) #
I didn't like the Van Eyk or Palmer picks, as I just don't see the upside. They have average stuff, with below average control and Palmer has a worse body than Jesse Litch. I like the Nick Frasso pick as he has some upside as a big bodied athlete, but needs to tone down his delivery. Zack Britton might have the ability to hit with his strong numbers in the Cape, but his numbers in the ACC didn't jump off the statsheet.

Generally this draft for me is all about Martin as a future core piece and a few players who might develop as back-end starters or relievers. I generally do not think the Jays drafted that well after the first round with a bigger focus on college numbers than in years past, under Saunders I think the team balanced analytics and traditional scouting much better.
Shoeless Joe - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 11:26 AM EDT (#387452) #
Experts' favorite Draft pick for all 30 teams

Nick Frasso, RHP, Loyola Marymount (4th round)

After landing Austin Martin, the second-ranked player in the class, with the No. 5 overall pick, the Blue Jays shifted their focus to pitching early on Day 2, selecting college hurlers in Rounds 2-4. Frasso, a 6-foot-5 right-hander who is still coming into his own on the mound after playing both baseball and basketball in high school, is exactly the type of pitching prospect Toronto loves to develop, standing out for his athleticism, live arm and untapped potential.
greenfrog - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 11:34 AM EDT (#387453) #
Longenhagen doesn’t seem all that impressed with the Jays’ round 2-5 picks. From today’s Fangraphs Odds and Ends article commenting on each team‘s draft: “Toronto went mono-college after drafting Austin Martin, a sign he’s overslot at five.”
hypobole - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 12:06 PM EDT (#387454) #
Longenhagen was very low on Britton and Palmer on his draft board. Frasso he had at 132 vs his selection at 106.
But he had Van Eyk at 42 (with a 40+ FV), which is exactly where the Jays took him.
bpoz - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 12:35 PM EDT (#387456) #
I hope Martin becomes a star. He will take 60% of the budget. The others may become useful which would be a big plus. Nobody is going to remember much of the hype. Good entertainment for 2 nights.
Mylegacy - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 01:04 PM EDT (#387457) #
More on the Kyle Peterson quote about Van Eyk.

“I think this guy could be the steal of the draft,” ESPN analyst Kyle Peterson said. “It surprised me that Van Eyk was not higher on some lists. I would have had him somewhere towards the back end of the first round. I think Van Eyk is a guy that’s a starter in the big leagues for a long time.”

Peterson acknowledged that he has had control problems at time but he likes Van Eyk’s ability to throw four pitches (he added the slider in the offseason).
Glevin - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 01:14 PM EDT (#387458) #
Drafts are often discussed in an off way. "I liked their first round and second round but not their 3-5 rounds so I'll give them a C". The reality is that the first round is much more important that all other rounds and that after the first 2 rounds the odds of any player making the majors are very slim. Look at the draft from a decade ago for example. There were 10 all-stars selected in the first round and supplemental round (50 total picks) and 2 for all rounds after (50 rounds). Or look at the Jays top drafted prospects. Pearson, 1st round, Groshans, 1st round, SWR 2nd round, Manoah 1st round, Kay 1st round, etc..
John Northey - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 04:07 PM EDT (#387459) #
For a quick and dirty fun thing...
Every 10 year study...
2010: top pick who signed: Noah Syndergaard (38th pick, 1s) 15.7 WAR (Kris Bryant was 11th round and DNS sadly)
2000: Dustin McGowan (1s 33rd) 1.6 WAR (ugh, bad draft)
1990: Steve Karsay (1 22nd) 11.2 WAR (traded for Rickey Henderson)
1980: none made the majors, Jays had the 2nd overall pick. Yikes! Kelly Gruber Went later in round 1 (16.4 WAR), Darryl Strawberry went #1 overall. Danny Tartabull was a 3rd rounder, Doug Drabek 4th - clearly not a well scouted year by the Jays.

I've done the top 5 rounds many times for the Jays...
1st: Roy Halladay (the best) - 20+'s are Green, Carpenter, Vernon Wells, Moseby, Rios, Stewart, and Hill.
2nd: David Wells (50+) (only one over 15 WAR, only Derek Bell also cracked 10, Bo Bichette is 8th highest WAR for 2nd rounders for the Jays already)
3rd: John Olerud (50+) (Jimmy Key in the 40's, 4 guys in the 10's)
4th: Casey Janssen the best, none over 10 WAR
5th: Dave Stieb (50+), Pat Hentgen, Michael Young, Mike Timlin the gang with 19+ WAR, no others over 4. So it is a WOW or 'oh crap' round.

So a HOF level talent (50+ WAR) in each of the first 4 rounds except the 4th historically for the Jays. But none since Halladay in 1995. Over 43 drafts. 73 picks in the first round thanks to compensation picks.

So will the Jays break that streak of poor 4th rounders with Nick Frasso - unlikely, but we can dream. The last 4th rounder to make it for the Jays was Sam Dyson who has 5.6 WAR and is a solid middle man still at age 32.
bpoz - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 05:37 PM EDT (#387460) #
To win a WS Gillick had to load up with big trades D Cone and expensive FAs Winfield, Molitor, Morris, D Stewart. Ricky Henderson was a 3 month rental for S Karsay. The important thing is that we already had WAMCO (missing M). The pen was deadly, rotation was Key, Todd Stott, Guzman before they had to add Morris and Cone.

So we had the core in place but aging in the 90s. Guzman, Hentgen and Timlin kept the pitching kind of strong. A Gonzales, Green and Delgado were a good but needed maybe 2 more. I think Interbrew was cheap and Ash had to do as he was told. I would have more faith in my opinion if I knew that after 1993 our payroll drastically dropped. Say 35%, then cheap. Getting old and over the hill is expected or should be expected Carter for example. Olerud had a lot left in the tank (core piece) but was traded for R Person. To save money I suppose.

It looks like this FO is willing to spend some money on expensive FAs(Ryu) in hopes of winning enough so that the bottom line looks acceptable. I don't know if they can plan a payroll to go deep into the Playoffs. An exciting pennant run and playoff success is very profitable.

We will know in the next 5 years.
SK in NJ - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 05:37 PM EDT (#387461) #
After drafting Martin, I really didn't care who they got in rounds 2-5. It would be nice if they got a steal, but as long as Martin is signed, then that's all that really matters.
scottt - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 07:09 PM EDT (#387462) #
There is usually a fast drop between the talent at the top and the rest of the draft.
When you draft around 20th, the top prospect left there is far from a sure thing, so the chances of striking gold in the rest of the draft are pretty good.

Also, if you like a guy who is ranked in the 3rd or 5th round, you can safely wait to pick him up later and gamble on "the best available player" in the first round. That's what happened with Bichette and Biggio. It's very unusual that Boston took a low ranked guy in the first round.

scottt - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 07:16 PM EDT (#387463) #
Drabek didn't sign in 1980, but the Jays could have taken him in the first round.
I have no idea how well ranked he was back then.

It looks like the Jays were still new at this drafting thing.

John Northey - Friday, June 12 2020 @ 09:13 PM EDT (#387465) #
Yeah, the Gillick years were nightmares for drafting. He passed up on Dwight Gooden in 1982 to draft Augie Schmidt, in 1983 Matt Stark over Roger Clemens - imagine an alternate universe in which both of those guys were taken instead. A Jays rotation in '84 and beyond of Gooden/Clemens/Stieb/Key - it could've easily happened.

Shoeless Joe - Saturday, June 13 2020 @ 11:47 AM EDT (#387469) #
It will be interesting if Toronto reputation as a development organization and the fact they pay their minor leaguers more might help with the undrafted free agent market.
Mylegacy - Saturday, June 13 2020 @ 05:02 PM EDT (#387470) #
Over at The Athletic Jim Bowen has a Winners/Losers Draft article.

He's very high on the Jays draft, not just the Martin pick.

He says, "The rest of Toronto's draft was just as dominating."

"Van Eyk profiles as a polished middle-of-rotation type starter who should be quick the the big leagues."

Palmer, "...has an overpowering upper-90's heavy sinking fastball with two potential plus secondary pitches in his changeup and slider."

Frasso, "He may take a while to develop but there is a lot to work with."

Britton, "...had a .446 OBP and a Division I-leading 11 doubles...he's got a sweet left-handed swing with gag-to-gap power. if the doubles power...translates to home run power, he could end up as a long-term answer in left field."

On the Jay's draft, "All in all, this was a special draft for the Jays."

It is refreshing to hear good things about the Jay's Draft. So often after a draft we hear things like, "Player X was the Jay's best pick, for a fat guy he doesn't sweat much!"

If baseball is ever played again, dare we hope?
scottt - Saturday, June 13 2020 @ 10:11 PM EDT (#387471) #
Yeah, when you try to tank for only one year, it's important to make it count.
Baltimore, Detroit, KC, etc, will end up  with several top 5 draft picks.
It's also important because there was a new draft director.

rtcaino - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 12:34 PM EDT (#387478) #
"They have average stuff, with below average control and Palmer has a worse body than Jesse Litch."

Its always when guys kinda like me can make it though!
ISLAND BOY - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 01:32 PM EDT (#387480) #
There'a a good article at Sportsnet about Jordan Groshans. Man, I've watched and followed the Jays since their inception and, with the newly-drafted Austin Martin,( providing he signs ) this is the best group of young players and prospects I have seen in a while. I'm really excited about the team's future.

On a related note, what is the future of MLB ? What is wrong with MLB owners ? They should just plan to break even or lose a little money this year in hopes of having some semblance of a season given the difficult circumstances. This acrimony with the player's union does not bode well for the next CBA talks. My nightmare scenario is a good, young Jay's team leading the division and then having the season shut down like what happened to the Expos years ago.
scottt - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 03:57 PM EDT (#387482) #
The owners don't want to lose money.
It's probably not that bad for the Jays, but NYY and Boston will both lose around 180M worth of ticket sales. I'm really not sure where Rogers is sitting here, they mostly need baseball before the NHL restarts.

The players union is out of touch here though.
The economy is in the dump.
Revenues will be down next year as well.
I don't think we'll see those 300M contracts.
Heck, I'd try to get Mookie on a 1 year 40M deal. You never know.
When you only plan to make a little money, you can end up losing a lot.

The Expos were at the end of the roll in 94.
After 2021, the Jays will still have their core for another 5+ years.
The only thing that could empty the prospect pipeline would be massive trades.
I don't really see that.

John Northey - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 04:07 PM EDT (#387483) #
I see it as the owners being out of touch - they signed deals with the players to pay $x for a season. Yeah, no one saw this coming until March but when they negotiated with the players then they knew this was the likely outcome. Yet they still signed it thinking that they could push for more later, totally ignoring the past decades of player/owner battles. Yeah, Clark has been a pushover to this point but that was a silly risk to take.

Bottom line is - an agreement was signed that owners could set the season to however many games they felt was possible paying a pro-rated salary to players based on 162 games vs however many would be played. 14 teams in the playoffs. If they want something else they should've pushed then for it, not now at the last minute.

Now we'll see the owners hem and haw for a week or so before finally releasing a 50 game schedule (roughly) even though players already said 'just do it'. This is in order to have a fighting chance in arbitration/court later which is inevitable. The players agreed to however many games could be scheduled, the owners want no more than 50, so it is a run out the clock situation. The smart financial move now for the owners is to get players to agree to a deferred payment plan for salaries where the players get 100% but some is paid in a year or later so owners can get the cash flow right. That would've been a much easier sell, but now will be a lot harder. 16 team playoffs both this year and next to recover some revenue, all-star game after the post-season this year. Instead by pushing to pay just 30-40% of the salaries they will now get beaten in court and need to pay nearly 50%, they won't get the expanded playoffs this year and next, no post-season all-star game. All things that would've added a lot to their bottom line. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

I fear for the 2022 season now. Just as the Jays players should be coming into their own we will probably lose a full year as owners push for a hard salary cap when the soft one now is almost the same as a hard one. Sigh.
Gerry - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 05:03 PM EDT (#387485) #
Undrafted free agents can sign with teams today. The first player I have seen the Jays signing is Harrison Ray, a 2B from Vanderbilt who was ranked at #441 on BA's top 500. That would make him approx. a 15th round pick.
rtcaino - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 05:15 PM EDT (#387486) #
"1980: none made the majors, Jays had the 2nd overall pick. Yikes! Kelly Gruber Went later in round 1 (16.4 WAR), Darryl Strawberry went #1 overall. Danny Tartabull was a 3rd rounder, Doug Drabek 4th - clearly not a well scouted year by the Jays."

This has probably been pointed out, but I just took a look at the 1980 draft and noticed; Terry Francona, Billy Beane, and John Gibbons were taken in succession in the first round with picks 22, 23, and 24.

I would have to imagine that they have the most combined coaching and executive experience of any three consecutive picks in baseball history.
scottt - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 05:20 PM EDT (#387487) #
It's not at the last minute.
The number of positive cases are actually growing in many baseball states like Florida who hit a record 2000 today.
Trump has shut down any national oversight, so the governors do whatever they want.

It's more complicated than just announcing a schedule.
The Blue haven't announced where they will be playing, for example.
The players haven't agreed to any social distancing measures.
When is the trade deadline?

The March Agreement does include a 14 team playoff schedule, that was the only thing the players agreed to during negotiations.
A deferring payments would mean nothing, most owners have huge loans already, the players don't care about that. 
Even the poor teams have very rich owners, so an appeal isn't going to keep me up at night.

I don't see the owners asking for a salary cap.
It's the players complaining now, not the owners, but it's the owners who will be facing losses, not the players.
I see the players asking for higher luxury tax thresholds and probably removing all penalties for signing free agents.
I don't even think they'll touch service time, but they could redefine is so a shorter partial year counts as a full year.
They'll agree to expanded playoffs as long as the players get a decent cut.

There are a lot of players like Machado, Cole, Harper, Trout, etc. who have nothing to game by a strike and  everything to lose, already being under contract for the duration of the next CBA.
Was that like that in 94? I think that will play a role.

scottt - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 05:22 PM EDT (#387488) #
The money after the 10th round used to be 125K. Now all they get is 20K.
Mylegacy - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 05:23 PM EDT (#387489) #
Gerry - New Baseball News - you are saving our lives!
scottt - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 05:24 PM EDT (#387490) #
That doesn't look like a lot of talent for pick 22 to 24.
Gerry - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 08:24 PM EDT (#387491) #
The Jays have also signed Mack Mueller, a senior outfielder from Baylor.
clark - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 08:41 PM EDT (#387492) #
Harrison Ray didn’t do much hitting in college. Defensive versatility and speed are all he seems to have to recommend him. Makes me wonder if somehow his signing is linked to Austin Martin, both being from Vanderbilt. I say sign every last player from that program if it helps get Martin to sign.
Gerry - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 08:43 PM EDT (#387493) #
Another signing, Zac Cook, a senior from UT Arlington.

Seniors like Muller and Cook have finished school and have to get a job or go play baseball, so its an easier decision for them. A junior could go back to school so they have a big decision to make. The same applies to high schoolers but some of them might not want to go to college.

Even for those who sign how much baseball will they get? The Jays are likely to have a camp of some sort but Florida is a COVID hotspot right now so if you sign you don't know whats going to happen for you.

If you are a junior in university do you sign and hope you get to play? If you stay in school will you play? Is your college in a COVID free area so it would be better to stay? Its a complicated decision for lots of players this June.
scottt - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 08:55 PM EDT (#387494) #
If you're a senior, you get the 20K even if you don't play this year.
Still better than nothing.

Gerry - Sunday, June 14 2020 @ 11:02 PM EDT (#387495) #
Do you get the $20k, or do you get whatever the team offers you?
hypobole - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 03:14 AM EDT (#387496) #
I imagine the first few signs at least will get the full amount , since there's 29 other teams that could sign them.
ayjackson - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 09:39 AM EDT (#387497) #
I think every collegiate athlete was granted an extra year of eligibility. Doesn't guarantee them a spot on the team though...and if they graduated, that could be a problem.
scottt - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 09:43 AM EDT (#387499) #
I presume that anyone in the 6th to 20th round would at least get the 20K, but it could be as little as 1K.
scottt - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 09:45 AM EDT (#387500) #
I'm not sure what that means. Wouldn't they become free agents otherwise?
And to attract interest, they probably need to play somewhere, like an independent league or something.

Mike Green - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 10:17 AM EDT (#387501) #
The draft did inspire a much-needed pleasant look at the future.  In my case, the year is 2023.  There is always a lot of uncertainty in projecting 3 years out, and this year it is greater because of lost development due to the cancellation of all or most games. That said, here is my list of the club's players for 2023 in order of importance with salary or arb status in brackets. 


Pearson (pre-arb)
Manoah (pre-arb)
SWR (pre-arb)

Kay (A1)
Borucki (A2)
Ryu (20M)

Luciano (pre-arb)
Kloffenstein (pre-arb)
Zeuch (A1)
Van Eyck (pre-arb)
Thornton (A2)

Hatch/Murray/Murphy/Diaz/Palmer/Frasso (pre-arb), Waguespack/SRF (A1)

Position Players

Bichette (A1)
VGJ (A2)
Biggio (A1)

Martin (pre-arb)
Gurriel Jr. (5.8)
Jansen (A2)
Groshans (pre-arb)
Moreno (pre-arb)
Kirk (pre-arb)

Grichuk (10.3)
McGuire (A1)
Hiraldo (pre-arb)
Lopez (pre-arb)
Espinal (pre-arb)
Teoscar (A3)
Tellez (A2)

It's easy to identify the medium-term needs of the organization.  They need a couple of more position players, a centerfielder (who ideally would bat left or switch-hit) and a left-handed corner OF bat.  They may or may not need more pitching depending on how development and injuries go.

Incidentally, when I put in Lourdes Gurriel Jr.'s numbers into a Play Index, the #1 comp I got was Cecil Fielder.  Would it shock me if Gurriel Jr. hit 45 homers in 2023?  No, not really.  And I'm not his biggest fan. 

Paul D - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 10:54 AM EDT (#387502) #
Could a team sign an undrafted player, say a college reliever, for $20K, but also put him on the major league roster for the upcoming season, thereby starting his arbitration, FA, clock, and getting him paid at the ML minimum?
greenfrog - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 11:18 AM EDT (#387503) #
In his MLB Pipeline article on the six teams with the best 2020 drafts, Jim Callis gave the Jays an honourable mention:

“Honorable mentions

The Blue Jays had the best Draft that didn't feature any extra picks, highlighted by Martin (the Draft's best pure hitter) falling into their laps at No. 5 and Florida State right-hander C.J. Van Eyk (who has a promising fastball/curveball combo and enticing pitch metrics) getting to them in the second round. Among clubs without a full complement of five choices, the Phillies did the best by snagging the top high school pitcher (Mick Abel, out of Jesuit High in Portland, Ore.) at No. 15 and one of the most athletic collegians (Arkansas shortstop Casey Martin) in the third round.“

greenfrog - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 11:20 AM EDT (#387504) #
Mike Green, no Orelvis Martinez in the 2023 hypothetical?
Mike Green - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 12:00 PM EDT (#387506) #
Orelvis Martinez didn't make my list because I don't think he'll be ready by 2023.  I debated about whether Hiraldo would be ready.  I think that there is a fairly reasonable chance that he is, but you could argue the other side easily.  Martinez is a year younger and a year behind in the development ladder.
Shoeless Joe - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 12:10 PM EDT (#387507) #

With Martin on the board the Jays really have as many position players as they need moving forward, and the talent acquisition stage moves to roster construction. The infield and catching depth is more than adequate and at some point they need to figure out if they think some of these players can shift to the outfield or find trade partners to get those outfielders. I will assume Vladdy, Hiraldo, and Martinez are all limited to the infield. The questions which need answered are:

  • Can Martin play CF?
  • Can Groshans play RF?
  • Will Gurriel look as comfortable in RF as in LF?
  • Can Biggio actually play the OF?
  • When are Hiraldo and Martinez ready?
  • Does a trade like Danny Jansen or Biggio for Brandon Marsh make sense?
  • Will the team sign George Spring/Mookie Betts to play CF/RF?

Shoeless Joe - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 12:17 PM EDT (#387508) #
If no roster changes and also leaving out the more fringe prospects I can see the starters in 2023 as the following:

LF: Biggio (28)
CF: Martin (24)
RF: Gurriel (29)
3B: Groshans (23)
SS: Bichette (25)
2B: Hiraldo (22)
1B: Vladdy (24)
DH: Kirk (24)
C: Jansen (28)

UTIL: Espinal (28)
1B: Tellez (28)
OF: Grichuk (31)
OF: Fisher (
C: McGuire

rtcaino - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 12:22 PM EDT (#387509) #
"The players union is out of touch here though"
"I see it as the owners being out of touch"

This is one spot where the MLB CBA doesn't help get play resumed.

NHL, NBA, and NFL salary cap figures are all dependant on revenue. Which incentivizes players to get back playing to fatten the goose.

That said, European Soccer has no such salary cap and they appear to have come to an agreement easier, across several different leagues.
greenfrog - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 12:48 PM EDT (#387510) #
I think the answer will always be no to a prime-age top-tier free agent like Betts or Springer. Too much risk for the cost. But other good players could be targeted in free agency in the coming years.
uglyone - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 02:09 PM EDT (#387511) #
if they sign Betts I take back everything i ever said about them.
tercet - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 02:32 PM EDT (#387512) #
Joe, I wouldn't try to guess the lineups too far in advance, its too hard to predict. Also if Gurriel is on our 25man roster, let alone our 3 hole hitter, we are still tanking. He is not good at baseball.
Shoeless Joe - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 02:41 PM EDT (#387513) #
Free agent outfield upgrade options:

2020-2021: Mookie Betts (28), George Springer (31), Joc Pederson (29)
2021-2022: Michael Conforto (29), Kyle Schwarber (29)
2022-2023: Andrew Benintendi (28), Aaron Judge (31), Byron Buxton (29), Joey Gallo (29)
2023-2024: Cody Bellinger (28), Ian Happ (29), Max Kepler (31)

I think Michael Conforto would be a great fit in RF in the 2022 off-season, if the team felt none of the infielders work as outfielders.

ISLAND BOY - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 02:46 PM EDT (#387514) #
" He is not good at baseball."

I disagree with that statement. Socrates Brito was not good at baseball.
scottt - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 05:19 PM EDT (#387515) #
Callis' grading isn't very helpful.

It's mostly more about where they drafted then who they drafted.

1. Detroit
2. Miami
3. Rockies
4. Orioles
5. Padres
6. Indians

And the Jays falling to 7 because they didn't have a supplemental first round pick. Meh.

The Rockies landed Veen, a high upside high school outfielder, Romo, who profiles as a defensive catcher and McMahon who could be a starter or a reliever.

KC got Lacy, the best pitcher in the draft, Loftin a solid shortstop, Ben Hernandez, a high schooler with an impressive changeup and Gentry a promising outfielder.  That's worse how?

I'm quite happy with what the Jays did here compare to what they could possibly do.

scottt - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 06:19 PM EDT (#387516) #
Schwarber might look more like a DH, especially if they use them in both leagues.
John Northey - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 07:19 PM EDT (#387517) #
With a tiny draft like this one (5 rounds) draft position pretty much decides who won/lost right away, with odd exceptions like the Jays getting that top talent at #5.

For comparison... 10 years ago - 2010. (long enough to know who made it, not so long as to be a totally different situation)

1) Nationals: Bryce Harper who is actually 3rd in WAR so far at 31.8. So far 8 of their draftees made it, but the only one doing anything of note beyond Harper is Robbie Ray (8.8 WAR) the rest are 1.0 or less with Harper the only one to get 200+ games in.

2) Pirates: Jameson Taillon (8.2 WAR). 7 others made it, none with 1 WAR.

3) Orioles: Manny Machado made it a great one for them (36.7 WAR so far) but the other 4 who have made it have 2.7 WAR total between them (1 was not signed by them, but by someone else later on)

4) Royals: Christian Colon was the 4th overall pick but his 1.5 WAR puts him 3rd on the Royals list from that draft with 2 guys over 10 - Whit Merrifield and Jon Gray (13th round did not sign - Colorado got him 3 years later in the first round).

5) Cleveland: Drew Pomeranz has 10.8 WAR. DNS Cody Allen (8.4 was 16th round), rest are 2.6 or less WAR 12 reached, but only 3 signed with Cleveland that draft so they did a good job finding future ML'ers but lousy job signing them.

11) Jays: the infamous Deck McGuire draft with Chris Sale (45 WAR so far) 2 picks later. But overall some good stuff with Aaron Sanchez, Noah Syndergaard both in this draft. Plus 11th rounder DNS Kris Bryant - sigh. Sam Dyson also over 5 WAR, as is Chad Green (another DNS round 37) - 12 reached, but 2 didn't sign with the Jays. Definitely a 'what if' draft - imagine instead of Deck if they took Sale, and if they opened up the pocketbook enough to get Bryant into the fold, and if they didn't trade away Noah. Ah well.

Christian Yelich was also a first rounder that year (pick 23). 2nd had Andrelton Simmons (36.3 WAR), 3rd J.T. Realmuto, 4th James Paxton (Mariners getting him), and Eddie Rosario (10 WAR), the 5th round has no one with 3+ WAR yet.

So that gives us all an idea about how hard it is to get quality. Just 4 guys with 10+ WAR from the 2-5th rounds. Jacob deGrom was a 9th rounder for the Mets (35.5 WAR) so quality does exist after 1-5 but it gets harder and harder to get it the further down you go. What people say about who won/lost the draft today is fun to read but is close to meaningless. Who signs and who develops is what matters.
Mike Green - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 07:51 PM EDT (#387519) #
Keith Law said in his American League recap that the Blue Jays had a helluva draft. At this point, I highly doubt that he has any bad feeling about Toronto even if his departure from here was unceremonious with Ricciardi being gratuitously nasty.
Paul D - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 07:53 PM EDT (#387520) #
Despite looking like a DH, the numbers suggest that Schwarber is a good defensive outfielder
bpoz - Monday, June 15 2020 @ 10:50 PM EDT (#387521) #
Just evaluate George Bell.A bit weak defensively but very strong offensively. He can only move down defensively to DH.

Dickey Joe Thon is a SS drafted in 2010 5th round. Kris Bryant 3B 2010 18th round. Thon could be moved down defensively a lot more than Bryant. Who had the better hit tool? FOs have to use the evaluation scale where 80 is elite. The philosophy could be that if he hits we will find a place for him.
pubster - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 10:52 AM EDT (#387524) #
"the infamous Deck McGuire draft"

They did end up drafting Sanchez and Syndergaard. So it wasn't too bad.

McGuire had a high floor. He was going to be a back of the rotation starter FOR SURE.
pubster - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 10:56 AM EDT (#387525) #
"Socrates Brito was not good at baseball."

Brito's career batting average in the minors is .291.

Last year he slashed .282/.328/.510/.838 in AAA Buffalo.

Believe it or not but Brito is incredible at baseball!
greenfrog - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 11:09 AM EDT (#387526) #
In the recent Sportsnet video on Martin, his Vanderbilt coach guesses that his best defensive home (or homes) in the majors will likely be somewhere in “the triangle” — SS, 2B, or CF.
Shoeless Joe - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 11:20 AM EDT (#387527) #
My 2020 Shadow Draft:

1. Austin Martin
2. Alex Santos
3. David Calabrese
4. Kala'I Rosario
5. Mason Hickman

My 2019 Shadow Draft:

1. Carroll Corbin
2. Jimmy Lewis
3. Will Robertson
4. Tanner Morris
5. Mason Hickman

If you use Sickels shadow rules of copying international draft signings my shadow farm system looks like:

01. Austin Martin
02. Corbin Carrol
03. Jimmy Lewis
04. Alex Santos
05. Estivan Machado
06. Riklevin De Castro
07. Will Robertson
08. Tanner Morris
09. David Calabrese
10. Kala'I Rosario
Glevin - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 01:59 PM EDT (#387528) #
"In the recent Sportsnet video on Martin, his Vanderbilt coach guesses that his best defensive home (or homes) in the majors will likely be somewhere in “the triangle” — SS, 2B, or CF."

I think the Jays will have a lot of other options up the middle (Bichette, Groshans, Martinez, Jimenez, etc...) but CF is pretty wide open so could see him move quickly there if things go well.
PeterG - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 02:12 PM EDT (#387529) #
"Also if Gurriel is on our 25man roster, let alone our 3 hole hitter, we are still tanking. He is not good at baseball."

the above is a ludicrous statement.Gurriel had an OPS of .869 and was an above average outfielder once moved there. He had many OF assists due to a strong and accurate arm and covered enough ground to be a usable CF if necessary.
bpoz - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 02:47 PM EDT (#387530) #
Gurriel has only 563 ML ABs. I think he is still adjusting. Now check out his power numbers for 2019. 314 ABs the 20 Hr becomes 40 Hr if you believe 2X ABs = 2X Hr. For me that is awesome. For someone else maybe they think not.

Defensively he did not play "all" his games in the OF so again some time to adjust and get comfortable is reasonable to me.
John Northey - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 03:37 PM EDT (#387531) #
This is an interesting team long term now, best hope for a great long term teams since the 90's when we saw in 1995: Shannon Stewart (21), Shawn Green (22), Alex Gonzalez (22), Carlos Delgado (23), Chris Carpenter (20 in minors), Sandy Martinez (24 year old catcher, top 100 prospect). Drafted Roy Halladay in the first round that year. Boy did the future look bright as the old guard was slowly leaving. Sadly we had a horrible GM who let Roberto Alomar leave as a free agent (misreading the market thinking prices would go down after the 94 strike), and trading John Olerud while keeping Joe Carter (35) (for $6.5 mil a year plus $1 mil signing bonus - Alomar signed for about the same amount with Baltimore). Ugh. Future choices made by Ash would be equally bad.

So yes, get excited about the kids and lets hope that the current GM and team are smarter than Ash was. That they cut ties with old guys instead of dumping young ones, and resign the best players instead of the weakest just due to marketing.

Vlad (22), Bo (23), Biggio (26), Gurriel (27), hot prospects like Connine (22), Luciano (21), Pearson (24), and draft pick Austin Martin (21). Easy to draw some parallels but also easy to see this crew not doing what that one did (a few near MVP's, multiple Cy's, many All-Star Games, at least one made the HOF - Delgado might someday).
85bluejay - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 03:40 PM EDT (#387532) #
If a team decides to stop paying minor league players, can a player take that as a constructive dismissal and declare free agency?
Mylegacy - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 05:52 PM EDT (#387533) #

That's a very, very interesting option. If I was Boras I'd tell MLB that either you pay my clients or I will be taking my 5 - 7 - 23 (however many) clients he has in the minors to sue for free agency through constructive dismissal.

If nothing else it'll give us something other than Covid to obsess over!
greenfrog - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 06:58 PM EDT (#387534) #
Thanks, Mike. That makes sense. It may well be that Orelvis isn't ready for the majors by 2023. For what it's worth, in his March 10 ranking of Jays prospects, Eric Longenhagen lists Orelvis's ETA as 2023. But the lost games of 2020 probably make that timeline less likely (to the extent it was realistic to begin with).
scottt - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 07:13 PM EDT (#387535) #
With Martin, Boras has now 18 clients in the minors, but Grant Green is a free agent.

He offered to pay his minor league clients out of his firm's pockets, but that is against the rule--which he probably knew.

greenfrog - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 08:36 PM EDT (#387536) #
Post-draft, Bleacher Report thinks the Jays have the #7 farm system in baseball. The Rays are #1 on the list.
John Northey - Tuesday, June 16 2020 @ 10:17 PM EDT (#387537) #
Via Jim Callis - 5th-rder Zach Britton signs with @BlueJays for $97,500 (slot 136 = $410,100) so the Jays have a bit mroe cash for the top pic - $312,600. Useful I'm sure.

Wonder what the other 4 will sign for in the end? And if they will of course.
scottt - Wednesday, June 17 2020 @ 10:42 AM EDT (#387542) #
It's a bit of a funny number. I'm inclined to think he's getting the other $2.500 in some fashion.
Glevin - Wednesday, June 17 2020 @ 12:50 PM EDT (#387544) #
"Via Jim Callis - 5th-rder Zach Britton signs with @BlueJays for $97,500 (slot 136 = $410,100) so the Jays have a bit mroe cash for the top pic - $312,600. Useful I'm sure."

I'm sure to pay Martin overslot. Everyone else should be around slot so it makes sense to be going there.
uglyone - Wednesday, June 17 2020 @ 02:12 PM EDT (#387545) # has my favorite top-10 list yet:

Post-Draft Blue Jays Prospect List

1. Austin Martin, CF
2. Nate Pearson, RHP
3. Simone Woods Richardson, RHP
4. Jordan Groshans, 3B
5. Orelvis Martinez, SS
6. Alek Manoah, RHP
7. Adam Kloffenstein, RHP
8. Alejandro Kirk, C
9. Miguel Hiraldo, 3B
10. Eric Pardinho, RHP

— Mason 📊 (@mason_mcrae) June 17, 2020

My only quibble is that for me Moreno is easily in there somewhere, and not at the bottom either. Not sure which of the others I kick out though.
scottt - Wednesday, June 17 2020 @ 02:27 PM EDT (#387546) #
Yeah. Insert Moreno in the 7 spot and let everybody else slide down and push Pardinho out.

Now, that looks pretty good.

greenfrog - Wednesday, June 17 2020 @ 02:39 PM EDT (#387547) #
The biggest surprise for me is where SWR’s sister Simone is ranked. I had no idea she was that accomplished.
Shoeless Joe - Wednesday, June 17 2020 @ 03:13 PM EDT (#387550) #
With basically a lost minor league season the arm injury to Pardinho should matter less to prospect lists. This might also apply to yosver zulueta who is probably the biggest wildcard in entire farm system.
greenfrog - Thursday, June 18 2020 @ 08:56 AM EDT (#387555) #
BA has posted its take on each team’s draft. The commentary on the Jays’ draft includes the following:

- The team “got the steal of the draft” in Martin at #5. On its own this selection made the draft a success for Toronto. Some scouts think Martin was the best player in the 2020 class

- The Jays “continued to get solid value” in rounds 2-5

- Van Eyk “does a lot of things well” and projects as a starter

- Palmer and Frasso “have exciting upside if they can maintain their frames (Palmer) and stay healthy (Frasso)”

- Britton is a good hitter but doesn’t have much defensive value

- Despite getting Martin (a #2 value) at #5, the team didn’t choose any low-value players to save money
scottt - Thursday, June 18 2020 @ 09:05 AM EDT (#387557) #
They did save quite a bit on Britton though.
There's always value for a left bat who can rake.
We got Panik and Shaw for this year.
Britton is more a potential replacement for Tellez down the line. 

scottt - Thursday, June 18 2020 @ 09:08 AM EDT (#387558) #
I'm guessing the Rays already had the #1 farm system before the draft, the Jays were probably down to around #12-15.
Shoeless Joe - Thursday, June 18 2020 @ 10:08 AM EDT (#387561) #
Of the last dozen pitchers coming out of the ACC in Rounds 1 or 2, only Bryce Jarvis and Kyle Funkhouser have worse career walk rates that CJ Van Eyk. That will have to tick up if he wants to start in the bigs.
Glevin - Thursday, June 18 2020 @ 12:49 PM EDT (#387564) #
" has my favorite top-10 list yet:
Post-Draft Blue Jays Prospect List

1. Austin Martin, CF
2. Nate Pearson, RHP
3. Simone Woods Richardson, RHP
4. Jordan Groshans, 3B
5. Orelvis Martinez, SS
6. Alek Manoah, RHP
7. Adam Kloffenstein, RHP
8. Alejandro Kirk, C
9. Miguel Hiraldo, 3B
10. Eric Pardinho, RHP

Pearson is probably a top-10 prospect in baseball. Don't see how Martin is ahead of him. Also, too high on Kloffenstein and especially Pardinho I think. Moreno should be there easily as well.
greenfrog - Thursday, June 18 2020 @ 01:03 PM EDT (#387565) #
My top three would be Pearson, Groshans, Martin. Martin is an excellent prospect, but unlike the other two, he has yet to perform at a high level as a professional ballplayer.
scottt - Thursday, June 18 2020 @ 03:06 PM EDT (#387574) #
It's the difference between a college player and a high school player.
Groshans is not even 1 year younger than Martin.
Who do you think will reach first?

Gerry - Thursday, June 18 2020 @ 07:43 PM EDT (#387583) #
Jays have a deal with #2 pick CJ Van Eyk.
Gerry - Thursday, June 18 2020 @ 07:50 PM EDT (#387584) #
So the Jays have signed 2, 3 and 5. Van Eyk, Palmer and Britton.
John Northey - Thursday, June 18 2020 @ 09:01 PM EDT (#387585) #
Yep... via

Van Eyk: $1.8 mil (slot: $1,771,100 +5%=$1,859,655)
Palmer: $850k (slot: $805,600 +5%=$845,800)

Both a bit over slot, but less than 5% (max allowed) so saving a bit of cash for Martin, not a lot though. Just 2 picks left to sign

Reminder: Britton was $97,500 vs slot $410,100 +5%=$430,605

So net breathing room for Martin = $333,105 + $59,655 - $40,200 = $352,560

Martin: slot: $6.18 million +5% = $6,489,000
Frasso: slot: $549k +5% = $576,450

I suspect Martin is waiting until all 4 other picks are signed so he knows the maximum the Jays could pay and then will demand it.
scottt - Saturday, June 20 2020 @ 10:46 AM EDT (#387610) #
How is Van Eyk pronounced anyway?
Van-EEk? Van-Hike? Van-Ehk?

hypobole - Saturday, June 20 2020 @ 11:54 AM EDT (#387611) #
Farrell called him Van-Ike, as in Hike.
bpoz - Saturday, June 20 2020 @ 11:57 AM EDT (#387612) #
very big bonus for Van Eyk. Hopefully that means something positive.
hypobole - Saturday, June 20 2020 @ 02:10 PM EDT (#387613) #
It's Palmer's overslot bonus that surprised me. Hopefully the Jays nutritionists have more success with him than they've had with Vladdy thus far.
scottt - Saturday, June 20 2020 @ 03:40 PM EDT (#387614) #
It's not a big deal for a pitcher.
Consider Sabathia, he's lots like 100 pounds since he last pitched.

uglyone - Tuesday, June 30 2020 @ 12:24 AM EDT (#387759) #
"Pearson is probably a top-10 prospect in baseball. Don't see how Martin is ahead of him."

Taking TINSTAAPP into consideration I can see it.
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