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Road trip! And then the All-Star Break.


I was thinking about the Blue Jays offense, and you'll be impressed to know that this did not make me rush out and consume a number of very strong drinks. As has been said many times, I have the strength of ten men (I then like to quip that those ten men are the Seven Dwarfs and the Three Stooges, but never mind.)

Surely we saw this coming, to some extent. The idea behind the offseason changes was to improve the defense, recognizing that in the process the team would lose a bit of offense along the way. No one expected Kiermaier and Varsho to match the production of Hernandez and Gurriel.

This still isn't quite what we expected. Last year, Toronto had the second best offense in the AL, behind the Yankees. This year, they're eighth (just ahead of the Yankees.) AL offense is up this year, from 4.22 runs per game to 4.52 - but the Jays have fallen from 4.78 runs per game to 4.46, and it's not all Kiermaier and Varsho replacing Gurriel and Hernandez.

Vladimir Guerrero gets much of the attention around here, and takes most of the heat when things don't go as everyone hopes. Guerrero hasn't been bad this season. People shouldn't say things like that, because it's flat out wrong. (I might even point out that once upon a time the Blue Jays won a World Series with about this level of production from their first baseman.) But no one expects Guerrero to be merely okay, to be a solid complementary bat in a lineup of his betters. I trust we've all come to realize that a significant amount of his 2021 production owed a lot to his unique affinity for  couple of ballparks that the team hasn't played in since. (I did make a point of telling all of you!) But even so - Guerrero's work this year is still not what this team needs from him, expects from him, and it's not what Guerrero expects from himself either. He's obviously been frustrated, and his frustration has at moments spilled over into other parts of his game. And what has to be really, really frustrating - for Guerrero and the team - is that it shouldn't be happening. It simply shouldn't He's hitting more balls hard than he's ever hit before. He's hitting more line drives than ever before. He's hitting fewer ground balls than ever before. He's striking out less often than ever before. This shouldn't be happening. But it is. This game will make you crazy.

The other big issue with this year's offense is behind the plate. In 2022, Alejandro Kirk turned in the best offensive season by a Blue Jays catcher in franchise history. And as wonderful as that was - Danny Jansen actually hit better than Kirk last year. This year - not so much. In fact, Kirk and Jansen have fallen off much more than Guerrero has. Now no one really expected the two catchers to be the heart of the offense, and maybe it was a bad idea to be counting on them to do it again. But still - Blue Jays catchers have made 336 Plate Appearances so far this season - not quite as many as the first basemen (368), but enough to make the wrong kind of difference.

In the process of preparing those paragraphs, I took the trouble - what else was I going to do on an off-day - to copy and paste all the Jays hitting records since 1977 into a spreadsheet, so I could compare Guerrero to all the other first basemen in franchise history, Kirk to the catchers. I'm a lazy sod, I started out just using OPS+. This, after all, is precisely what catch-all great statistics were made for - silly comparisons of large groups of seasons. Certainly not any kind of serious analysis. So in historical terms, Vlad's 2023 is middle of the pack for Jays first basemen. Somewhere in between a typical John Olerud season and a typical Lyle Overbay season.

I had lots of fun playing with the spreadsheet. I'm sure no one needs me to tell them that Josh Donaldson had the best offensive season by any Jays third baseman (2016, even ahead of his MVP year) and Jose Bautista the best by any right fielder (2011, edging out his 2010 season.) George Bell (1987) in left field is another no-brainer (Bell's own 1986 is next, though Gurriel's 57 games in 2020 ranks almost as high, albeit with some kind of asterisk.) Edwin Encarnacion has the best (2012) and third best (2015) seasons by a DH, with Molitor's 1993 in between. And Roberto Alomar's 1993 season comes out quite decisively ahead of Marcus Semien's 2021 - that 70 point advantage in OnBase more than makes up for a 40 point deficit in Slugging.

But centre field gave me pause. Lloyd Moseby (1983) and George Springer (2022) lead the way with an OPS+ of 134 - but in 2003, Vernon Wells a) had an OPS+ of 132, which is awfully close, and b) had 130 more Plate Appearances than either Moseby or Springer. And if I start making some kind of appropriate adjustment for Plate Appearances, things get muddied elsewhere on the diamond. Carlos Delgado's 2000 season just barely inches ahead of Olerud's 1993 season at first base. I'm not sold on that at all. Delgado's raw numbers that year were obviously much more impressive than Olerud's in 1993, but the offensive context was very, very different. But hey - Delgado has lots of other seasons in the team's top 15 at the position, and Olerud doesn't have any. Maybe it should be Carlos.

The good news, I suppose, is that Bo Bichette is putting together the best offensive season ever by a Blue Jays shortstop. At this point he's just competing with himself, as he already has the top two before this season even started. But what I think we really ought to consider, in light of the team's current troubles, are the worst seasons ever at each position by a regular.

Ready? Abandon all hope, etc. etc.

Catcher - Danny Jansen, 2019 (.207/.279.360 OPS+ 70). You may also want to hoot at Rod Barajas for 2009 (he was about as bad as Jansen, and batted 80 times more often.)

First Base - Lyle Overbay, 2007 (.240/.315/.391 OPS+ 85). You may prefer Willie Upshaw's final Toronto season - his numbers are almost frighteningly identical to Overbay's, over 100 more Plate Appearances.

Second Base - Aaron Hill, 2011 (.225/.270/.313 OPS+ 58) No one else is really close, and just two years earlier Hill had what was at the time the best ever season by a Jays second baseman not named Alomar.

Third Base - Danny Ainge, 1981 (.187/.258/.228 OPS+ 38) Kelly Gruber's 1992 was the worst by an actual baseball player.

Shortstop - Alfredo Griffin, 1984 (.241/.248/.298 OPS+ 48) Like Bichette at the top of the list for the position, Alfredo is mostly competing with himself down here.

Left Field - Alvis Woods, 1981 (.247/.291/.309) Distinctly worse than Reed Johnson's work during the Season From Hell.
 
Centre Field - Otis Nixon, 1997 (.252/.343/.304 OPS+ 72). We'll definitely take votes for Rick Bosetti in 1979, who was almost as bad as Nixon and came to the plate almost 200 more times.

Right Field - Bob Bailor, 1979 (.229/.297/.287 OPS+ 59) The other contenders are Lloyd Moseby in his rookie year, and Jose Bautista in his final year. But Bailor has them beat, easily.

Designated Hitter - Joe Carter, 1997 (.234/.284/.399 OPS+ 77) He even drove in 102 runs! Man, Carter's final year here was so awful that I think it's left a permanent scar on the psyches of everyone who lived through it, causing everyone who witnessed it to forget that Joe was a pretty good player when he got here. But then he got old. And bad.

Well, enough of this foolery. On with the business....

The White Sox came to Toronto, back in May, in the midst of a losing streak that would eventually reach ten.

Mon 24 Apr: Chicago 2 Toronto 5 - Andrew Vaughn's third inning double staked the White Sox to a 2-0 lead. They would not score another run until they were back on American soil. Their lead didn't last very long, either. The Jays came up to bat and immediately jumped on Lance Lynn for four runs, the big blast being Cavan Biggios' three run homer. Chris Bassitt worked into the seventh, allowing just three hits; Pop, Mayza, and Romano finished up.

Tue 25 Apr: Chicago 0 Toronto 7 - Jose Berrios held the White Sox to four singles over seven innings. Nate Pearson, making his season debut, and Bass finished the shutout. Danny Jansen hit a pair of homers to account for much of the scoring.

Wed 26 Apr: Chicago 0 at Toronto 8 - It was Yusei Kikuchi's turn to blank the White Sox, which he did for 5.2 innings while fanning eight. Bo Bichette had three hits, one of them a homer, drove in three and scored two.

Curiously, the Jays have the same three starters in the same sequence lined up for this series

Matchups

Tue 4 July - Bassitt (8-5, 4.06) vs Giolito (6-5, 3.53)
Wed 5 July - Berrios (8-6, 3.74) vs Lynn (5-8, 6.47)
Thu 6 July - Kikuchi (7-3, 4.08) vs Cease (3-3, 4.10)
Toronto at Chicago, July 4-6 | 128 comments | Create New Account
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Gerry - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 11:08 AM EDT (#431031) #
Ryu is pitching for the FCL Jays today, one inning, two doubles, two strikeouts.
Gerry - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 11:28 AM EDT (#431033) #
Second inning, another double with three outs, no runs.
Gerry - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 11:43 AM EDT (#431034) #
Third inning, 3 K's and a single.
mathesond - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 11:51 AM EDT (#431035) #
Sounds like he'll be ready for AA next :)
mathesond - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 11:58 AM EDT (#431036) #
I get a kick out of seeing Rick Bosetti's name every so often. Very young me thought he was just about the greatest outfielder around, as every time I went to a game at the Ex it seemed he'd make a catch while crashing into the CF wall. Of course, very young me thought John Mayberry was the best slugger going, as I remember him hitting 3 hr in a game vs. Toronto, and then the following season he was magically a Blue Jay (he even showed up at one of my tyke league games in Etobicoke).

Eventually Bosetti and Mayberry were replaced by Moseby and Upshaw, and though I had aged enough to not have any illusions as to where they ranked vis a vis their peers, the '83 team was so much fun to watch, even to a 13 year old who had just discovered Def Leppard and U2.
Gerry - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 11:59 AM EDT (#431037) #
Ryu is done after three innings. Four hits, no walks, five K's.
bpoz - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 12:31 PM EDT (#431038) #
If/hope the rehabs of Manoah and Ryu are finished and successful by the end of July because that will impact the trade deadline thinking. As well M White and Pop are progressing. Also nice work yesterday from Danner, Zulueta and Burnett.
Nigel - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 01:23 PM EDT (#431039) #
In my mind's eye, I remember Bosetti as being a good defensive OFer - is that just one of the ways in which my memory is failing me these days? He couldn't hit a beach ball with a paddle - I'm 100% sure of my memory on that front.
Magpie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 02:53 PM EDT (#431040) #
I remember Bosetti as being a good defensive OFer

Me too. Not good enough to carry his bat, but pretty good. Threw out lots of baserunners. Of course, on that team, there was no shortage of opportunities.
Magpie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 03:01 PM EDT (#431041) #
Mike Trout to the IL with a hamate fracture. He's going to be out for a while. What do the Angels do now?
soupman - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 03:03 PM EDT (#431042) #
VGJ had 2 sac hits in 2021 - his big year. Joe carter had 14 sacrifices in 1992 including a bunt.

As much as i'm convinced that the kid has a banged up wrist which is why the power is only on the pull side at the moment, the approach has always been hit-first. As much as the RISP issues are luck, i think some of it is still due to a bad approach.

RBIs are largely a product of opportunity, sure...but, if VGJ is a superior hitter to Joe Carter in basically every way...why does Carter seem to have been a better run producer?

lexomatic - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 03:39 PM EDT (#431043) #
Angels keep going until they hit a slide. Have real talk with Ohtani, and see what's available in trade. Maybe they take less back because odds are so much lower than earlier. But they've been okay with the worst version of Trout. Who knows.
I expect them to play out the season unless there's a bad losing streak.
Chuck - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 03:47 PM EDT (#431044) #
why does Carter seem to have been a better run producer?

By run producer you mean RBI accumulator. He certainly didn't score a ton of runs thanks to his low OBPs. His secret at driving in runs: stay healthy and in the lineup most every day, have a jillion men on base when you bat, refuse to take a walk in those situations, don't strike out an obscene amount.

To his credit, his overall OPS was 771 but it rose to 806 with men in scoring position.

Magpie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 03:47 PM EDT (#431045) #
why does Carter seem to have been a better run producer?

He doesn't, surely.

Carter certainly drove in lots of runs - he came up in the 1980s, he was taught that RBIs were the true measure of a hitter's greatness, he believed it, and he sold out the rest of his game to drive in as many as he could. And he used up an enormous number of outs in the process, and didn't get on base very often to give his teammates a chance to drive him in.
Chuck - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 04:01 PM EDT (#431046) #
taught that RBIs were the true measure of a hitter's greatness

While Buck has come around to spouting some of the newer metrics, almost never with conviction, his heart still lies with "run production", which is his euphemism for RBI -- the ultimate test of character and manliness.

soupman - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 04:03 PM EDT (#431047) #
those teams won more games. so, it's nice the Jays can win 12-1 then get swept because while only scoring 1 run that isn't off a homer, but i'd rather them win a couple more games because hitters have situational approaches. it seems to me that lineup handedness was and is not the problem with this franchise's ability to win games. the 'clean up' hitter wasn't expected to get on base, but to make contact with RISP and "clean up" the bases. just like the royals won a series with a team analytics people thought was terrible, the Jays have an analytics' daydream that we've now seen in trailer, movie, and sequel all fail to live up to the hype. are the players not trying/performing? or is there a management issue?
hypobole - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 04:11 PM EDT (#431048) #
Part of it was their swings and part of Vlads issues are analytics. Carter had more of an uppercut swing geared for fly balls. Vlads swing is flatter, geared for line drives. Pretty sure the book on Vlad is to keep the ball down with men on base to get him to roll over.

Carter took 5800 AB's to ground into 82 DP's. Vlad has 81 GDP's in 2244 AB's. Carter ran better, but that's still a huge difference.
Nigel - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 04:34 PM EDT (#431049) #
Situational hitting has been an issue for the team not just Vladdy. An article from Fangraphs a few years ago outlined that the league wide success % of scoring runners from 3rd and less than two out was between 50-55%. If memory serves me, the article was done at the peak of the strikeout bonanza and the number was closer to the low end of 50% back then. I haven't seen the league wide numbers for 2023 year to date but I'd guess it was closer to the middle of that range. According to Baseball Reference, the Jays this year are sitting at 47% in about 160 ABs. Not a huge differential, but they are probably running about 5% below the league average and its probably cost them something like 5-8 runs scored against league average on the year and a few more against the best teams. Throwing pennies from a boat eventually costs you a dollar.
Magpie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 04:37 PM EDT (#431050) #
I think everybody's problem with Guerrero this season is that he's hitting like a solid complementary bat, rather than the star of the offense. Why, he's playing like Joe Carter!

Here are some numbers to peruse - I haven't done a Data Table in ages! - it's just the performance of the Jays hitters at every position last season, and this season. As it turns out, three spots on the diamond have fallen, and fallen hard. I mentioned the catchers, where Kirk and Jansen have fallen further than any other spot in the lineup. And we were expecting something like this - maybe not this drastic - in left field. But look as well at second base. Merrifield has provided exactly the same level of production as the 2022 second basemen, but Biggio and Espinal have been a major drag.

        BAVG   OBP   SLG    OPS            BAVG   OBP   SLG    OPS
                                           
as C   2022   .286  .360  .463   .824      2023  .241  .307  .384   .691
as 1B   2022   .268  .334  .462   .796      2023  .274  .353  .434   .787
as 2B   2022   .272  .333  .398   .731      2023  .236  .311  .320   .631
as 3B   2022   .224  .322  .416   .738      2023  .254  .326  .442   .768
as SS   2022   .292  .335  .469   .804      2023  .316  .347  .511   .858
as LF   2022   .293  .341  .412   .753      2023  .238  .299  .381   .681
as CF   2022   .248  .308  .415   .723      2023  .264  .326  .401   .728
as RF   2022   .249  .297  .445   .742      2023  .276  .332  .445   .777
as DH   2022   .251  .334  .425   .758      2023  .244  .343  .420   .763
Only one position has been significantly better this year, and that's shortstop.
Mike Green - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 04:59 PM EDT (#431051) #
Rick Bosetti. His Wikipedia page tells me that he was born in Redding, California and after his MLB career, he returned to Redding. He played for the Redding Colt 45s (!), ran a business and got into politics. He was mayor of Redding for some time and then ran unsuccessfully for the state assembly against a Republican. But, he too is a Republican.

Fine fielder and poor hitter. In his best year (1978), his glove and bat balanced each other out. Don't ask about the other years.
Mike Green - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 05:15 PM EDT (#431052) #
The offence/run prevention argument is an important one. Base runs indicates that the Blue Jay offense would be expected to score 4.77 runs per game and give up 4.60 runs per game, given the component elements of run creation. Both figures are considerably higher than actual runs scored and allowed. Neither the Blue Jays nor their opponents have been bunching hits as much as usual.

In the context of a good defence and a favorable home park (92 per BBRef) for the pitchers, it's indicative that the pitching has been more of a problem than the offense.
Mike Green - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 05:24 PM EDT (#431053) #
I believe that this is the first time this year that Schneider has run out a batting order with the three LHBs- Belt, Varsho and Kiermaier in the 3, 6, and 9 slots. It makes eminent sense, as it significantly discourages use of LH relievers by the opponents because of the 3 batter rule (two of whom will always be RH).
Gerry - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 06:30 PM EDT (#431056) #
Alek Manoah will start Friday against Detroit. Thats a surprise.

On the positive side its Detroit.

Negative...he has only had two starts in the minors.
Nigel - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 06:34 PM EDT (#431057) #
That's the pungent odor of desperation.
John Northey - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 06:48 PM EDT (#431058) #
Guess the Jays want to know if they are in 'oh crap' or 'heck yeah' territory pre-ASB. Ryu having a good rehab start today helps a bit as a backup. I fully expect a 6 man rotation post-ASB or by August at the latest. Leaving a 7 man pen which will be a bit tougher to work with (Romano-Swanson-Garcia-Mayza-Richards-Pearson-White I'd guess with Cimber, Pop, Francis, Jackson, Thornton, Hatch all in AAA or on the IL even if the phantom IL for Cimber) The big question in the pen will be when Green is ready - do you send down Pearson or do you DFA White?
uglyone - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 06:58 PM EDT (#431059) #
yeah that's hasty
hypobole - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:04 PM EDT (#431060) #
It does seem premature, but why desperate?

Obviously not ideal to be using 2 pitchers instead of one, but the combined Richards/Francis line of 18.1 IP, 5 Runs has been rather excellent in their 3 combo starts.

Mike Green - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:15 PM EDT (#431061) #
Why desperate?  It seems likely that the organization (I'm guessing primarily Walker, but really it could be a number of people) did not have confidence in Richards/Francis to be effective for much longer.  They had Richards throw 3 innings on June 28, then 1.1 innings on July 1 and an inning on July 2.   It seems to me that the club had their mind made up that if Manoah had a serviceable start in double A, they were going to call him up notwithstanding his disastrously poor performance and obvious issues with timing and command. 

Personally, I think that this is going to blow up.  I would love to be wrong, but if I were in charge and it did, I would clean house.  I think that the organization has totally misread the extent of Manoah's issues. 
Nigel - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:15 PM EDT (#431062) #
I agree that the combo starter has actually been working just fine - so why rush him back? Where on earth do they go with this if he gets bombed on Friday? What could they possibly have learned in those two starts? Maybe its not desparate but I can't think of a good reason to do it this way. It just feels like the kind of thing that GMs on thin ice do.
bpoz - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:24 PM EDT (#431063) #
Congratulations to whoever suggested that Manoah would pitch for the Jays in his next start.
Magpie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:25 PM EDT (#431064) #
It just feels like the kind of thing that GMs on thin ice do.

That's one way to look at it - to me it reeks of confidence. (Possibly over-confidence, we shall surely see.) Confidence in their judgement of the situation, confidence in what the last month - not just the two minor league starts - have achieved, and confidence in one's own job security. Precisely because it's so easy and obvious to see how this could all blow up badly. And if it does, there will be hell to pay.
Magpie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:28 PM EDT (#431065) #
whoever suggested that Manoah would pitch for the Jays in his next start.

It was John Northey. I pooh-poohed that crazy idea...
greenfrog - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:30 PM EDT (#431066) #
It does seem premature. But I feel agnostic about this move. I don’t know what his underlying issues were, so I can’t say whether he has likely resolved them or not. The Blue Jays are the ultimately “consult everyone” front office, so I’m sure they’ve talked to many people about the pros and cons of doing this. And they have recent experience with another pitcher (Kikuchi) experiencing and then overcoming significant adversity on the mound.
Nigel - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:35 PM EDT (#431067) #
Ha - in relation to a business decision that was made by someone outside our office last week we discussed that supreme confidence and desperation could look the same from the outside. Maybe you're right and they are confident in the success of their strategy. I hope you're right but I'm with Mike - I think Manoah has some issues that can't be fixed with a click of the red shoes.
Magpie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:37 PM EDT (#431068) #
There's a part of me that's quite impressed. The easy, obvious, safe thing to do would be to move Manoah up to AAA next, and then you've got the All-Star Break and another couple of weeks. The confidence in their own judgement that says, "nah, no need" - I like that. I think confidence in one's own judgement, and commitment to it, is a hallmark of successful organizations.

Of course, your judgement had better be pretty sharp.
Nigel - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:40 PM EDT (#431069) #
It took them a full season and offseason to do something with Kikutchi:)

I'm less impressed - they didn't have a single alternative other than tandem starting with one of their best relievers.
greenfrog - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:52 PM EDT (#431070) #
Every pitcher is different. It may be that the coaches and sports psychologist(s) recommended that Manoah "get back on the horse" rather than spend a few more weeks away from the majors and his teammates. Again, this is all speculation.

On a positive note, to the extent that the two players are comparable, Kikuchi's struggles in the majors throughout 2022 didn't prevent him from regrouping in the off-season and coming back strong this year.
Magpie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:55 PM EDT (#431071) #
Atkins has received an extension through the end of 2026, so this isn't a GM trying to save his job. Not that we should sneer at that, after how 2015 turned out. The prospect of an imminent hanging can either focus the mind (Anthopoulos, 2015) or move you to just roll over and die (Ricciardi, 2009).
Magpie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 07:58 PM EDT (#431072) #
they didn't have a single alternative other than tandem starting with one of their best relievers.

But because of how the schedule shakes out, they only actually needed one of those tandem starts in the next three weeks, and surely doing it that way would have been the easy and obvious thing to do.
Nigel - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 08:02 PM EDT (#431073) #
I'm not arguing the impossibility that they are the smartest person in the room and that they know better. I hope that they do. Nor am I of the view that Manoah is washed - there's too much history of success to believe that there isn't a route back. I just think his problems were pretty significant and widespread.

He might have an extension but I wouldn't give him better than 50/50 odds of surviving if they miss the playoffs completely this year. The outcry for a scalp will be huge and it clearly wasn't the manager.
Magpie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 08:03 PM EDT (#431074) #
In other news, the Padres have DFA'd Nelson Cruz. On the one hand, he's 42 years old, and can't play in the field. On the other hand, he is a RH bat, and there might still be something there. The overall numbers this year don't look like much - as it was, he was really good in April, utterly awful (5-39) in May, and just fine in June.
greenfrog - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 08:07 PM EDT (#431075) #
The prospect of an imminent hanging can either focus the mind (Anthopoulos, 2015) or move you to just roll over and die (Ricciardi, 2009)

I believe it was Samuel Johnson who said that. Or Randy Johnson. Definitely one of those two.
Magpie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 08:11 PM EDT (#431076) #
I believe it was Samuel Johnson who said that.

You're right! I couldn't remember, and I also couldn't remember the actual line, which was "When a man knows he is to be hanged in a fortnight, it concentrates his mind wonderfully."
hypobole - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 08:13 PM EDT (#431077) #
Has anyone considered maybe it was Manoah who insisted he's ready?
Mike Green - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 08:23 PM EDT (#431078) #
I would have more confidence in the judgment of the org on this point if they sent Manoah down 3 starts before everyone else was sure that he needed to go down rather than 3 starts after.  After a terrible start to the season, he walked 11 and struck out 4 in 2 starts totalling 8.2 innings on May 9 and 15.  They gave him 4 more starts after that. 

Speaking of accountability, I wasn't impressed with what Bo Bichette said after the Canada Day game where his bad baserunning error led to a final out at home plate in a 1 run game.  He said that he didn't see the sign to stop, and honestly, I don't believe it.  He's run through stop signs (as has VGJ) a number of times.  His half-stop was an indication that he was the one making the decision.  Which isn't the end of the world, but then he needs to look up earlier to see whether Verdugo had fielded the ball cleanly.  Bottom line: he made a mistake.  It's not the first one he has made this year, but with all that, he's having a great year.  it would be better though if he owned his mistakes. 


  


Mike Green - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 08:25 PM EDT (#431079) #
Oh, I am sure that Manoah insisted he was ready.  And that is worth precisely zero in the calculus about whether he should come back. 
soupman - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 09:25 PM EDT (#431081) #
Maybe he could teach the boys a thing or two about eating clen and trening hard. I think he just needs to get back on the cycle himself for a few weeks and might solve some of the issues he’s had so far this year.
soupman - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 09:29 PM EDT (#431082) #
Rivera, imo, makes too many bad reads and didn’t really give a clear stop sign. So Bo hesitated because it wasn’t clear what the sign was and by the time he realised it was a stop he’s already gone too far and instead of being dead at third he hoped the throw was off line. I blame Rivera and ideally you don’t throw a guy under the bus and say something like « our lines got crossed » but it might say something about where the group mentality is at. Bo was one of vocal players last year when things weren’t working as well iirc.
greenfrog - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 10:19 PM EDT (#431083) #
Some good PAs by Jays hitters tonight. But the struggles with RISP continue. Among other tough PAs, Varsho and Springer both came up empty with a runner on third and less than two out.

Add Roberts to the list of “opposing team’s best masher” who has beaten up on the Jays this year.

Kasi - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 10:21 PM EDT (#431084) #
That’s the jays for you. Get two on and top of the order up and Springer and Bo fail to deliver. I think the bottom of the lineup has done a decent job at getting runners on base but Springer through Chapman have just not been good enough. When your top hitters are just average well you’re going to stink.
Leaside Cowboy - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 10:23 PM EDT (#431085) #
Vladimir!
greenfrog - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 10:26 PM EDT (#431086) #
Beauty eh. And don’t forget about the table-setting walk by Belt (MVP).
Magpie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 10:33 PM EDT (#431087) #
I think the bottom of the lineup has done a decent job at getting runners on base

Not tonight they haven't, Merrifield excepted.
Four Seamer - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 10:37 PM EDT (#431088) #
Man, Springer is one gaffe-prone defender in right.
Petey Baseball - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 10:37 PM EDT (#431089) #
It's time to get Alejandro Kirk going at the plate. It looks like he's intentionally trying to hit the ball in the air and it's costing him hits.

That's four HR in seven games (with one taken back by Duran in the Boston series) so it should be five, really. The Sox and Tigers may want to adjust the scouting reports, looks like Vlad is finally getting hot.
Leaside Cowboy - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 10:40 PM EDT (#431090) #
First, let's see how Ross Atkins handles the draft, which starts with signing all the players to contracts.

pick / slot value:

# 20 - $3,746,000
# 89 - $771,500
#121 - $547,100
#157 - $385,000

* * *

Swanson picks up his team-mate Springer.
Hodgie - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 11:24 PM EDT (#431091) #
In its sum Guerrero's season has been underwhelming but delivering in the clutch has not been one of his problems. Coming into the game his wRC+ was 157 in high-leverage situations and 141 with RISP. Those numbers will be going up after tonight's heroics.
John Northey - Tuesday, July 04 2023 @ 11:39 PM EDT (#431093) #
For the draft it really is near impossible to judge accurately until a few years have passed. I suspect the Jays have a 2 pronged approach this year - if someone drops to #20 who they have high up (top 10) then they blow the wad on him and go cheap everywhere else. If things go as expected (more or less) they get guys appropriate for each slot, then do a few big swings after the 10th round just in case they get lucky (ala Rowdy Tellez a few years back).

As to the Manoah situation - I suspect a big part is knowing him and his confidence level and how Detroit should be easy pickings for him (scoring under 4 runs per game). He seems to be getting back to Mr. Confidence which is critical for him and he seems to have regained that for now. Will it hold up? Hard to say, but I can see pushing him pre-break to know one way or the other. I suspect they'll have a few guys ready to come in should he flop.
Kasi - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 12:59 AM EDT (#431096) #
Vlad is hitting better lately but Bo is pretty cold right now. We need someone else to step up.
scottt - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 06:59 AM EDT (#431097) #
I really don't like the starter management.

Richards/Francis was working really well as a tandem.
Breaking that freed Richards to be part of the 3 losses against Boston.

I would have liked to see Ryu get a shot before Manoah.
Francis would have been 5 in innings against Detroit.
Best scenario Manoah is OK and that proves nothing going forward as it's a weak lineup with few left bats.
Worst scenario he losses a must-win game.

In either case, if Ryu does well, does he displace a Manoah who's doing OK?
Is this a path towards releasing Ryu who could do well for a contender while the Jays stick with a struggling Manoah?

ISLAND BOY - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 08:34 AM EDT (#431098) #
I'm really confused by the Manoah call-up. In an interview, John Schneider says that they didn't focus on Manoah's results but rather the process and minor tweaks that were getting him back to where he was last year. Well, he had 10 strikeouts in 5 innings against AA hitters, but also 3 hits and 3 walks. It would seem more logical to test him next against AAA hitters ( although people joke Detroit is largely AAA hitters) for a few games and build his confidence. I'll be rooting for him Friday night and hoping for the best, though.
Chuck - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 09:37 AM EDT (#431100) #
John Schneider says that they didn't focus on Manoah's results

It's hard to know how much input Schneider had into making the decision to bring Manoah back so soon. My entirely uninformed guess is that decisions were made at higher pay grades and that Schneider is just playing the good soldier, spouting the company line.

92-93 - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 10:53 AM EDT (#431102) #
The team needs to know how badly they need another SP for the 2nd half, or whether they can rely on Manoah and Ryu to fill the 5th spot and cover for any potential downtime that may arise. They would have less of a handle on the situation if they brought back Manoah after the break and gave him only 2 looks before the deadline.

Breaking up your lefties 3-6-9 makes sense when you prefer your LHs face a RHP over your bench RHs facing a LHP. Kiermaier has been bad (.586 OPS) since peaking on May 19th, and Varsho has been mediocre all season. Espinal is a career .301/.359/.401 vs. LHP in 310 PA. Taking a flier on Nelson Cruz when you have Clement on the bench seems like a no-brainer so you aren't inclined to bat Varsho ahead of Merrifield and Kirk/Jansen. Cruz is supposedly a great clubhouse guy.
uglyone - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 11:44 AM EDT (#431109) #
last 30 days

* Springer 111pa, 124wrc+
* Bichette 106pa, 105wrc+
* Belt 58pa, 136wrc+
* Guerrero 108pa, 111wrc+
* Jansen 49pa, 114wrc+
* Varsho 91pa, 90wrc+
* Merrifield 96pa, 82wrc+
* Chapman 97pa, 78wrc+
* Kiermaier 57pa, 73wrc+

* Espinal 48pa, 112wrc+
* Biggio 44pa, 109wrc+
* Kirk 50pa, 46wrc+


uglyone - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 12:11 PM EDT (#431111) #
Season:

* Springer 363pa, 107wrc+
* Bichette 378pa, 134wrc+
* Belt 219pa, 129wrc+
* Guerrero 361pa, 124wrc+
* Chapman 348pa, 120wrc+
* Merrifield 308pa, 100wrc+
* Kiermaier 226pa, 112wrc+
* Jansen 181pa, 93wrc+
* Varsho 335pa, 85wrc+

* Kirk 215pa, 86wrc+
* Biggio 141pa, 79wrc+
* Espinal 128pa, 75wrc+
uglyone - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 12:13 PM EDT (#431112) #
Past 1 Calendar Year

* Springer 640pa, 116wrc+
* Bichette 719pa, 143wrc+
* Guerrero 724pa, 124wrc+
* Chapman 676pa, 128wrc+
* Belt 348pa, 114wrc+
* Jansen 367pa, 115wrc+
* Varsho 634pa, 100wrc+
* Merrifield 513pa, 108wrc+
* Kiermaier 244pa, 112wrc+

* Kirk 501pa, 92wrc+
* Espinal 313pa, 80wrc+
* Biggio 309pa, 71wrc+
Leaside Cowboy - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 01:25 PM EDT (#431115) #
Lance Lynn (36 years old - listed 270 lbs.) takes on the Blue Jays tonight.

ERA 6½ - WHIP 1½ - 116 K - 96 innings pitched.
scottt - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 01:26 PM EDT (#431117) #
The results for Manoah are 1-7 with a 6.3 ERA.
When Ricky Romero fell apart, he still managed 9-14 with a 5.77 ERA.

The process is basically to demote a starter if he has options and to move him to the pen, if he doesn't have any.

By "process", the management seems to mean something completely different, like what is going through Manoah's mind while on the mound, but they don't have any information about that.


Maybe they mean something else that is measurable, like going on a diet and losing 30lbs like Ryu has done, but I can't tell. 

It does seem to me that there is not room on the team for both Manoah and Ryu.
Ryu doesn't have options, so are they considering trading or releasing him?

Magpie - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 01:32 PM EDT (#431118) #
When Ricky Romero fell apart, he still managed 9-14 with a 5.77 ERA.

Only because he actually got off to a pretty good (8-1) start. But when it starts to fall apart, it really falls apart. Over his last 17 starts that year, he went 1-13, 7.35. In those 85.2 IP, he allowed 116 Hits and 59 BB.
Leaside Cowboy - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 01:50 PM EDT (#431120) #
Ricky Romero is a role model for Leaside Cowboy.

L-C agrees with John Northey about the starters pitching in a 6-man rotation.
Michael - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 03:50 PM EDT (#431122) #
Ryu can stay on the IL until/unless they want him in the Majors. It could be they want to give Manoah the chance as people are saying before trade deadline/Ryu healthy so if he doesn't make it they can demote him until September or beyond and/or move him to bullpen for end of year.
hypobole - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 04:11 PM EDT (#431123) #
Remember Chase Anderson? Got him for Chad Spandenburg in one of our Brewers trades. 33 IP, 7.22 ERA in 2020.

That prompted Phillies in 2021 to give him 48 IP, 6.75 ERA.
Last year with Cinci 24 IP, 6.38 ERA.
Now with the Rockies. Almost 50 IP, 6.89 ERA.

He's the new Edwin Jackson. The guy to have when you don't
have anybody else.
Nigel - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 04:21 PM EDT (#431124) #
Oh man, as a charter member of the Edwin Jackson fan club (its a small and exclusive club) that's a low blow at Edwin. The man won over 100 games and it was only in the last couple of years that he played that Edwin got to the Chase Anderson level of performance. Prior to that, he had 8-10 years of league averageish or (better) performance and one or two years of genuinely good performance. His W-L record really doesn't do him justice due to the quality of the teams he generally played on.
Mike Green - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 04:22 PM EDT (#431125) #
Remember Chase Anderson? Got him for Chad Spandenburg in one of our Brewers trades.

Chad for Chase?  Doomed from the start.  If his name was Sparky or Valentino or Pickles or something, there would have been a chance. 
greenfrog - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 04:34 PM EDT (#431127) #
I know we all have short attention spans these days, but his name is actually Chad Spanberger. He was a probably-miss prospect who had a 163 wRC+ in A ball in 2018. It’s been downhill for him since then.
uglyone - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 04:48 PM EDT (#431128) #
No 22yr old in single A is a can't miss prospect!
greenfrog - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 04:55 PM EDT (#431129) #
Gurriel Jr. posted a 34 wRC+ in A+ ball at age 23. He was streaky even then!
hypobole - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 05:25 PM EDT (#431130) #
Nigel, there's a post in the 2012/2013 off-season where I advocated signing Edwin Jackson. Cubs signed him for 4 yrs and released him after 2 1/2.

What I referenced was Montoyo in 2019 being grilled as to why Jackson and his 11+ ERA was going start another game, to which he responded "We don't have anybody else".
Nigel - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 05:39 PM EDT (#431131) #
Oh I know, and to be fair, Jackson pitched 2-3 years past his best before date. His time in Toronto was definitely way more Jackson Pollock on speed than Rembrandt that's for certain. But there was an earlier time ....
Mike Green - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 05:49 PM EDT (#431132) #
Da Box. Come for the statistical analysis. Stay for the artist analogies.

I think there's a contest there somewhere.
greenfrog - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 06:17 PM EDT (#431133) #
Rembrandt, Pollack and Samuel Johnson references in the same thread? What the heck is going on?

I guess Rembrandt is appropriate now that we have Sem Robberse in the system.
greenfrog - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 08:37 PM EDT (#431140) #
Michael’s trade suggestion of Zack Greinke may have just gone by the wayside, as he’s been placed on the IL with shoulder tendonitis.
mathesond - Wednesday, July 05 2023 @ 09:10 PM EDT (#431141) #
One good about thing the delayed start to the Jays game is that it gave me the opportunity to watch the 2nd half of the Liberty/Mercury (WNBA) game. And it was pretty darn good watching!
Leaside Cowboy - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 12:09 AM EDT (#431143) #
Leaside Cowboy thinks the players cut their left ears after being swept (again) by the Red Sox.
Leaside Cowboy - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 11:50 AM EDT (#431163) #
L-C enjoys the WNBA, as well as ladies professional wrestling and mixed martial arts.
92-93 - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 12:57 PM EDT (#431165) #
Francis, White, and Hatch haven't pitched since (at least) last Friday, while Mayza, Garcia, and Richards haven't pitched since Sunday. A good case can be made for the 27th man actually being a position player today.
Leaside Cowboy - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 04:38 PM EDT (#431170) #
Let's go back to April 7th, 1977. Toronto Blue Jays vs. Chicago White Sox. Double-Header! We make hay when the sun shines. José Berríos starts game 1. Yusei Kikuchi (staff ace) game 2.
Nigel - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 05:58 PM EDT (#431171) #
One of the less understood aspects (myself included) of baseball is the inter relationship between offence and defence. 92-93's comment on recent bullpen usage is a direct result of the team playing many low scoring close games recently. The offence's inability to be more than mediocre (by poor luck/sequencing or otherwise) means that its felt like the pitching staff has been in high leverage situations the whole year. One of the posters (apologies for forgetting) mentioned that its felt like all year when one of the starters posts 4 or 5 scoreless innings to start a game the offence has seemingly often matched that. It has really felt like this pitching staff has had almost no "low leverage" or laugher innings to pitch. The team's run differential on the year suggests that to be the case and just eyeballing the results for the season its remarkable how few blowouts (either way there have been). I know Mike G keeps emphasizing that the hitting has been better than the pitching (although unlucky) but I wonder if the pitching has actually suffered due to pitching in constant high leverage situations?
BlueJayWay - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 06:05 PM EDT (#431172) #
Scoreless through 4. Feels like the Jays have had a lot of games just like this this year.
Magpie - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 06:17 PM EDT (#431173) #
I agree that it sure feels that way - it feels like the pitchers have never had a moment to  relax.  The team actually appears to be a little bit below the middle of the pack ion both the blowouts....
lowouts

TEX  31
SEA  28
OAK  27
BOS  26
TBR  26

KCR  24
MIN  23
DET  23
NYY  22
TOR  22

HOU  20
CLE  20
CWS  17
BAL  16
LAA  12


and the one-run games.

1 run ganes
CLE  36
OAK  32
TBR  29
CWS  27
BOS  26

NYY  25
SEA  25
MIN  24
LAA  24
TOR  23

BAL  23
DET  22
KCR  21
HOU  19
TEX  17,/
Texas has certainly had a nice, stress-free time of it.
Chuck - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 06:18 PM EDT (#431174) #
Umpie doing his best to ensure game 2 starts on time. Strike zone? It’s ALL strike zone, baby.
Nigel - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 06:21 PM EDT (#431175) #
Thanks Magpie. That's interesting. End results don't necessarily tell you the story of the number of "high leverage innings" but you'd think there was a correlation.

Today feels like Groundhog Day - feels like about the 15th game exactly like this this year.
Petey Baseball - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 06:26 PM EDT (#431176) #
Somebody's going to have some pretty convincing evidence the offense has been better than the pitching. I'm not convinced.
Nigel - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 06:35 PM EDT (#431177) #
Kirk has obviously really struggled at the plate this year but he has been really good defensively since he returned from the hand injury.
greenfrog - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 06:44 PM EDT (#431178) #
Deja vu all over again. The Jays starting pitcher puts up a string of zeros. The Jays offense does the same, inning by inning.
Chuck - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 07:06 PM EDT (#431179) #
First base umpire is missing a good game. Maybe he should stand on the base.
Magpie - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 07:08 PM EDT (#431180) #
End results don't necessarily tell you the story of the number of "high leverage innings"

No they don't. And here we go again.
Magpie - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 07:09 PM EDT (#431181) #
Well, I'd say Lance Lynn has passed the audition. You know, if Manoah/Ryu don't work out.
Nigel - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 07:11 PM EDT (#431182) #
The Jays' hitters sure look like they want out of town quickly too. A coalition of the damned with the home plate ump. Some really really poor ABs today.
greenfrog - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 07:20 PM EDT (#431183) #
Extra innings. Moment of truth.
uglyone - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 07:28 PM EDT (#431184) #
I will never understand pulling a guy pitching a 1 hitter on under 90 pitches. Even worse when it comes in the first leg of a doubleheader.
James W - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 07:29 PM EDT (#431185) #
Trevor Richards is firmly in the middle of the trust circle.
Petey Baseball - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 07:34 PM EDT (#431186) #
1 hit in 10 innings against three very hittable pitchers.

Ouch.
hypobole - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 07:56 PM EDT (#431188) #
And life is good again.
Chuck - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 07:58 PM EDT (#431189) #
The BABIP gods are in mocking mood.
greenfrog - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 08:06 PM EDT (#431190) #
Apres 10 innings, le deluge
Nigel - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 08:14 PM EDT (#431191) #
Nothing about this game feels persuasive.
scottt - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 08:33 PM EDT (#431192) #
Bummer outing for Hatch here.
I guess that only count as 1 earned run, but he's out of options next year and probably gone.

Did they take away the strike zone box to protect the ump?
Generally, when the strike zone is larger, there are fewer hits.

hypobole - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 08:34 PM EDT (#431193) #
Well the pitchers we need to pitch well pitched well. The only one who didn't already had a return ticket to Buffalo in his pocket.
scottt - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 08:37 PM EDT (#431194) #
The Orioles has brought out Cowser, another high draft pick, to play CF.
12-0 against the Yankees in the 4th inning.
In the Bronx.
Must be a fun game to watch.

James W - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 09:19 PM EDT (#431195) #
How do the replay officials keep getting these calls wrong? That one wasn't even difficult.
Nigel - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 09:20 PM EDT (#431196) #
Really poor base running from a normally smart base runner. I assume that the limp offense has everyone pressing.
Petey Baseball - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 09:30 PM EDT (#431197) #
Jays could be 8 games out of the division with another win tonight. Rays just got swept by the Phillies and play Atlanta over the weekend.
Magpie - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 09:37 PM EDT (#431198) #
Really poor base running from a normally smart base runner. I assume that the limp offense has everyone pressing.

I didn't mind the decision with the 678 hitters coming to the plate. Sure, get to third base with one out. Good idea. Naturally the 678 hitters all get hits, and the out on the bases costs them probably two runs.
Nigel - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 09:49 PM EDT (#431199) #
Normally I’m with you on being aggressive there but that was a medium distance (trending to shallow) fly ball. The throw was pretty accurate but really weak. Most RF’s throw the runner out with ease in that situation. I’m not a fan of gambling on the other team screwing up to achieve success. Of course, it is the White Sox so maybe it makes sense?
Nigel - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 10:36 PM EDT (#431201) #
I didn’t see the point to the Merrifield deal due to the contract - I was wrong.
Petey Baseball - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 10:47 PM EDT (#431202) #
I saw him as an upgrade to Biggio and Espinal the minute he was required and still do. It was an excellent trade.
Magpie - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 11:26 PM EDT (#431203) #
Really poor base running from a normally smart base runner.

Hey, it got worse!

What happened to Guerrero was weird because it was the kind of thing that happens in basketball or hockey all the time, but not so much in baseball. He was watching the play at the plate, and forgot about his own role in it. And when the play was over - whoops, I'm way off the base.
99BlueJaysWay - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 11:38 PM EDT (#431204) #
Im so happy for a sweep. They got it done! I hope the hitting continues
Leaside Cowboy - Thursday, July 06 2023 @ 11:44 PM EDT (#431205) #
The Blue Jays are moving up the standings.

Leaside Cowboy played a baseball video game: White Sox vs. Toronto.
with the score 10-0 in the 6th inning, L-C hit a solo homer and a 2-run shot, but eventually lost the game 13-3.
uglyone - Friday, July 07 2023 @ 01:07 AM EDT (#431206) #
So yeah even just a .500 record vs the AL East and we're probably in 1st place.
scottt - Friday, July 07 2023 @ 09:25 AM EDT (#431214) #
I honestly don't understand how well Tampa Bay has played.
Lots of fringe players on that team.

The young lineup in Baltimore looks pretty deep now.
I think they are just one shortstop away from something really scary.

The Yankees are not same without Judge.
Severino looks done and he's a free agent.
Donaldson is gone after this year as well.
Their young infielders haven't made an impact yet.


Leaside Cowboy - Friday, July 07 2023 @ 11:55 AM EDT (#431221) #
L-C agrees, only Baltimore really looks legitimate. Tampa Bay is always smoke and mirrors.

L-C enjoys watching " Angels in the Outfield " (1951) starring Janet Leigh.

John Schneider ought to mimic the field-manager in the movie: " Guffy McGovern. "

Old Guffy frequently engages in discussion with umpires.

Leaside Cowboy - Friday, July 07 2023 @ 12:39 PM EDT (#431225) #
The Pittsburgh "Pirates" are the home team in the movie. So, who played for the real 1951 Pittsburgh Pirates? Mel Queen! Ralph Kiner and others appear in the movie. Joe DiMaggio and Ty Cobb have cameos, as well as Bing Crosby (part-owner of the Pirates.) Cobb quips, "the game of baseball has changed!"
bpoz - Friday, July 07 2023 @ 12:56 PM EDT (#431226) #
TB plays well and have a low payroll. It is possible to have a very reliable pen and not spend a lot on it IMO. How would you have a good pen that is cheap? No $15mil closers. 5 relievers at $3mil costs $15mil.

I don't know the cost details of the TB & Jays pen. Also try not to use a reliever that throws meatballs. It is not TB's fault for destroying meatballs offered from the other pen.

Don't run the bases badly. Sometimes you need power so trade for Melky Cabrera but realize that speed on the basepaths is not his strength and neither is his OF defense. The OF should be made up of 3 CFs for the best D.

Counting Ryu the Jays are paying 3 SPs $20mil/yr. TB does not do that but did have an expensive C Morton.

AA wanted an AS at every position. TB does not believe in that IMO.
vw_fan17 - Friday, July 07 2023 @ 03:19 PM EDT (#431232) #
Leaside Cowboy played a baseball video game: White Sox vs. Toronto.
Which game? I play a lot of SuperMegaBaseball 3 these days.. (I know, 4 came out, but it's not that much better, and being laid off, $60 isn't worth it - there's still many hours left in SMB3).
Leaside Cowboy - Friday, July 07 2023 @ 05:09 PM EDT (#431239) #
L-C got a classic Super Nintendo. Ken Griffey Jr. presents MLB.

some of these retro games can be expensive. I discovered 8 or 10 vintage shops around the city.

old-school video games are part of the new mid-life crisis.

Leaside Cowboy - Friday, July 07 2023 @ 05:19 PM EDT (#431242) #
best thing is Tampa Bay does not exist in the 1994 video game!

some Japanese baseball games of that era feature a limited number of MLB clubs, including the Blue Jays.
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