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To attach any importance to this game for the Blue Jays in the standings, you have to be concerned with things like staying above .500, or holding off those pesky Orioles for third place in the division. However, it's always a big event when Roy Halladay starts, and if there's as much entertainment tonight as there was last night, I suggest you stay awake.

Doc could become the first 17-game winner in the majors, and an .850 win percentage, while it may not prove his superiority to Loiaza, Mulder and Hudson, would keep his Cy Young candidacy very much alive in the minds of the voters, not to mention the hearts of Jays fans. He's 2-2 against Seattle in his career with a 3.25 ERA; even better (1-1, 2.16) at Safeco, where the Mariners have hit .191 against him. Five days ago, he got stronger as the game progressed, going the distance against the D-Rays.

Freddy Garcia isn't having much fun this year, with that 9-12 record and 5.45 ERA, and is just 4-3, 5.68 in his career against the Blue Jays, who have hit him at a .285 clip over the years. He's 0-4, with a ridiculous 11.39 ERA, since the break, and the whole league has hit him like Ted Williams (.388) during that stretch. His latest wasn't quite that bad, as he lost 3-0 to Cleveland, giving up six hits in 6.1 innings. He and the Mariners will be feeling more pressure than the Jays, who have nothing to lose.
Game 119: Going For #17 | 34 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
_Donkit R.K. - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 09:58 PM EDT (#94777) #
As crazy (and , really, meaningless) as it might be I'd be awfully dissapointed if we fell behind the Orioles this year.
Coach - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 10:03 PM EDT (#94778) #
The lineup again has Cat and Hinske at the top of the order, but in a bit of a surprise, Greg Myers sits and Tom Wilson is the catcher. I'm sure Tosca knows he's 4-for-6 against Garcia. Delgado's at first, and Phelps is the DH. Bordick is back at short, trying to extend his 18-gamer, but he's in the 9-hole. Reed Johnson sits again, with Bobby Kielty in RF, but if Kielty doesn't start hitting better from the left side soon, he could see more pine time.

Carlos Tosca told Jerry Howarth that Lurch is "pretty sore" and his arm is "black and blue." They will make a decision about his next start late tomorrow. The skipper praised Hendrickson's efforts to improve his slide step, which helps keep baserunners honest. Aquilino Lopez and Dan Reichert also earned accolades; it sounds like Lopez will get more ninth-inning chances, although Tosca still isn't sure of his ability against lefty batters.
_Andrew Edwards - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 10:25 PM EDT (#94779) #
Tosca still isn't sure of his ability against lefty batters.

Of course not. No one who is right-handed could possibly get a left-handed batter out. That's why we need 32 relievers each game.

Go F-Cat, btw. Garcia should be in for a pounding tonight, I predict.
_A - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 10:26 PM EDT (#94780) #
Wow, now that was an impressive (and even more so after last nights poor attempt) bullet from Cash
_Donkit R.K. - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 10:27 PM EDT (#94781) #
Maybe the F-Cat will come around, and once again be a favorite here in Da Box. I can hope...
_A - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 10:29 PM EDT (#94782) #
My mistake, credit that beautiful toss to Wilson...It was Cashesque.
Dave Till - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 10:29 PM EDT (#94783) #
Wow, now that was an impressive (and even more so after last nights poor attempt) bullet from Cash

Actually, it was Wilson. Nice throw!
Dave Till - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 10:29 PM EDT (#94784) #
Oops, A - our posts crossed :-)
Dave Till - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 10:33 PM EDT (#94785) #
Doc just made Edgar Martinez look silly. It's looking good.
Coach - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 10:54 PM EDT (#94786) #
This isn't Kielty's night. Five men LOB may come back to haunt the Jays, and that was a poor throw. Get Sparky in there.
_Donkit R.K. - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 11:06 PM EDT (#94787) #
If not for Vernon Wells (and I haven't heard enough mention of how amazing it is that after his age 23 and age 24 seasons he could have combined for 65 homers and 150 RBI's) and the fact I proclaimed him a future Hall of Famer part way through last season Spraky would definitely be my favorite Jay right now. The HOF predicition that I now must defend, is a lot to pass to become my favorite though.
_jason - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 11:23 PM EDT (#94788) #
John Cerrutti on Jamie Moyer:

"In a seven game series you need more than that."

Why?
_Donkit R.K. - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 11:26 PM EDT (#94789) #
Because John Cerutti has no clue
_Dez - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 11:51 PM EDT (#94790) #
Unbelievable throw...
Coach - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 11:52 PM EDT (#94791) #
Johnson would have been safe against any other RF, but he had to learn the hard way not to challenge Ichiro's arm. A costly out; another opportunity squandered.
_BJ Birdy - Tuesday, August 12 2003 @ 11:59 PM EDT (#94792) #
That baserunning mistake by Johnson was just horrible. I'm a big Johnson fan, but how does he not know about Ichiro's arm?

Just as I'm typing this Davis hits one off of the bag at first . . . this is not going well. Who would have thought a win for Hendrickson and a loss for Halladay?
Coach - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 12:26 AM EDT (#94793) #
This game was lost in the first and third innings, when they could have put Garcia away but failed to cash in all those walks. Doc was excellent, as usual, but he needs a little help.

I have no idea why Myers didn't hit for Wilson in the eighth, or for Phelps in the ninth, but those decisions didn't affect the outcome as much as Kielty's slump.
_Jurgen - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 12:31 AM EDT (#94794) #
Well, I guess Freddy gets to keep his rotation spot for another week. He'll probably continue to string together some lucky starts until the playoffs, and then revert to Freddy of old (or is that new?) and get mashed.
_Jurgen - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 12:35 AM EDT (#94795) #
Didn't earlier in the broadcast Faulds and Cerruti say something about the Mariners and Cubs being the only teams to only use five starters this season? Does Juan Cruz not could as a starter?
Coach - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 08:09 AM EDT (#94796) #
In the Seattle Post-Intelligencer today, John Hickey raves about Ichiro's throw, and so do the Mariners.

"That throw was faster than my fastball," Hasegawa said. "That was 95, 96 mph. I think Ichiro should be the closer."

Cutoff man Rey Sanchez hadn't been a Mariner long enough to see one of those patented lasers in person before.

"When he let go with the throw, I just got out of the way. That was impressive."

Mike Cameron said Sparky shouldn't have challenged Ichiro.

"Not when the ball is hit right to him like that," Cameron said. "I wouldn't go unless the ball was hit to the right or to the left of him."

Johnson should have been up in the ninth with the game on the line (Myers could have pinch-hit for Wilson or Phelps) and he would have been a very tough out in that situation. I don't want Reed to change a thing about the way he plays, except for one new wrinkle -- caution on balls hit to right against the Mariners.
Pistol - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 08:43 AM EDT (#94797) #
Quiroz didn't play for the Ravens for a 2nd straight night. I haven't seen anything with an injury, or a call up, but I suspect that one or the other has happened.
_Matthew Elmslie - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 09:36 AM EDT (#94798) #
Johnson's attempt to go first-to-third against Suzuki's arm is being widely characterized as a mistake, but I wouldn't call it one. Johnson was clearly out, but the only reason it was so clear was because the throw was so perfect.

Well, full marks to Suzuki for making a perfect throw, but let's face it; he's not going to make throws like that every time. Hardly any of the time, I'd say. A strike to third base from right field? Come on. He's got a good arm but he's not Superman. If it's anything other than a perfect throw on that play, Johnson's in there. And even if it is a perfect throw, there's always the chance - and a decent one - that it'll hit Johnson in the back of the head, or the third baseman will drop it, or Johnson will knock it out of his glove or something. If they ran that same play nine more times, I bet Johnson would be safe all nine.
_Joe C. - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 09:48 AM EDT (#94799) #
Actually, more times than not, Ichiro's throw will be like that. His throws are rarely, if ever, off-line. The strength and accuracy of his arm is amazing to all, and I'd be shocked if Johnson wasn't told before the game not to challenge Ichiro. It's not as if he's a secret. If they ran the play 9 more time, Johnson would have been safe once or twice. Ichiro is not lucky, he is darn good.
_Matthew Elmslie - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 10:29 AM EDT (#94800) #
I remain skeptical.

Not that I believe Suzuki was just lucky on the throw; I'm aware that he's got a good arm, and I'm sure we'll see him make throws like that again. I just don't believe that anyone can do it consistently. (And if he can, he's wasted as an outfielder.)
_Joe C. - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 12:27 PM EDT (#94801) #
A few comments from the U.S.S. Mariner Weblog:

Freddy finally got a win, even though he didn't pitch well. Anytime we can come out with a W in a Garcia-Halladay matchup, though, I'll count my blessings.

I'm sure Ichiro's throw was impressive and all, but let's be clear; he does not have the best arm in baseball. Go watch Vladimir Guerrero airmail throws from the warning track to the plate on the fly.
robertdudek - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 12:36 PM EDT (#94802) #
Matthew,

I must disagree. Ichiro makes throws like that routinely. Note also that the ball beat Johnson by 15 feet - even a normal outfielder's arm would have had a good chance to throw him out. I don't know that I've ever seen Ichiro make a bad throw to third base out of the many dozens I've witnessed. The ball was hit sharply right to him - it was foolish to attempt to go to third in that situation.
robertdudek - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 12:38 PM EDT (#94803) #
The problem with Vlad's arm is that he is not as accurate, but I agree his arm is a bit stronger than Ichiro's. I'd like to see a strength/accuracy competition between Vlad, Ichiro and Jose Guillen.
_Matthew Elmslie - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 01:05 PM EDT (#94804) #
Ichiro makes throws like that routinely.

All right. Doesn't seem likely to me, but I will submit to the consensus.

Note also that the ball beat Johnson by 15 feet - even a normal outfielder's arm would have had a good chance to throw him out.

Here I disagree. I saw the play, and the replay. Johnson was going at a pretty good clip, and the way I saw it, the only reason they got him was because Suzuki placed the baseball directly in the third baseman's glove. I believe that if he had had to reach up for the throw and then back down for the tag, or if the throw had bounced or something, Johnson would have been in there.
Gerry - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 01:21 PM EDT (#94805) #
I don't think he was out by 15 feet, but I would have said 6. It wasn't a bang-bang play but I think the third baseman would have had time to take a high throw (or one to the side) and get the tag down.
robertdudek - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 01:55 PM EDT (#94806) #
Of course it takes time to apply the tag - if the ball gets there when the runner is less than 6 feet from the bag he'll most likely be safe (unless the 3B doesn't have to move his glove to apply the tag). It is in this sense that I claim the ball was there when Johnson was still 15 feet from the bag.

In any case, it was a routine tag.
_Matthew Elmslie - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 02:05 PM EDT (#94807) #
Of course it takes time to apply the tag - if the ball gets there when the runner is less than 6 feet from the bag he'll most likely be safe (unless the 3B doesn't have to move his glove to apply the tag). It is in this sense that I claim the ball was there when Johnson was still 15 feet from the bag.

In any case, it was a routine tag.


Exactly. With this particular throw, my impression is that a statue of a third baseman would have been able to tag Johnson out. It really didn't look like a close play at all.
robertdudek - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 02:16 PM EDT (#94808) #
Correct. It wasn't a close play. Combine that with the idea that Ichiro, charging a ball hit right at him, is going to make a similar throw something like 9 out of 10 times and you begin to see the foolishness of this particular gamble.
_Matthew Elmslie - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 03:04 PM EDT (#94809) #
I'll stop arguing.
Gitz - Wednesday, August 13 2003 @ 05:06 PM EDT (#94810) #
I'll throw my beret into the "Ichiro makes that throw regularly" category. In the two years I've been in Seattle, I have been consistently surprised just how well he plays baseball, above and beyond the high BA. He's as "fundamentally sound" as any player in the majors.
Game 119: Going For #17 | 34 comments | Create New Account
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