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Here's a pinch hit from regular Batter's Box reader Will Rainey:

For my first effort at an original contribution to Da Box, I present for your consideration an overview of "the ones who got away." One of the spinoff benefits of Leigh Sprague's magnificent overview of the Jays trade history is the ability to examine that history from a variety of angles. One of those angles is the history of the involvement of "prospects" in these trades.

The cliched "common knowledge" understanding of trading prospects is that you are trading away future greatness for current reward. Baseball fans who pay attention to their team's minor league talent are often heard to moan about the great talent being traded away in an attempt to "rent a player." But does this turn out to be true?

It seemed profitable to me to see whatever happened to those players that the Jays' various GM's "sacrificed" in order to acquire major league talent. A possible corollary to this would be to examine what we got when we acquired “prospects,” but that is for another day.

Before I begin, I’d like to mention a few preliminary considerations. This report is dependent on Leigh's work, and owes its existence to it. However, it goes beyond that work in surveying the rest of the traded "prospects" career, as opposed to just what that player did for the receiving team, to see just what we lost. That said, I did not include statistics, as Leigh did, for these players' entire career for the sake of brevity. However, I tried, as much as possible, to confine my comments on those careers to the obvious facts rather than opinions, since I would be making no effort to support those opinions within the body of this report. Also, for the sake of consistency, those players commented on are those who never played any significant role as Toronto Blue Jays. They were either traded as minor leaguers, or with no more than a "cup of coffee" in a Jays uniform.

So, with that out of the way, let’s dig in . . .

Our first consideration, the Peter Bavasi years, are sort of a write off for this study. The only "prospect" I see that Bavasi traded (as might be expected from a newly formed team) is Mike Weathers who never played in the majors.

Pat Gillick's Record

  • Dennis DeBarr: Never pitched in the majors again after leaving the Jays.
  • Victor Cruz: Pitched pretty well for three years in middle relief, then disappeared. Injury?
  • Ted Wilborn: Eight at bats, post Toronto.
  • Charlie Puleo: hung around the league for parts of eight seasons, never winning more than 6 games in a season.
  • Gil Kubski: got 63 pretty empty AB in 1980 and disappeared.
  • Tom Dodd: Logged all of 13 AB in his major league career.
  • Steve Senteney: Never appeared in the majors again.
  • Augie Schmidt: Never played in the majors.
  • Jack McKnight: Never played in the majors
  • Ken Kinnard: Never played in the majors.
  • David Shipanoff: Spent one year in the majors
  • Jose Escobar: finally made the majors six years after the trade, for all of 15 AB.
  • Matt Williams: pitched 26 innings, post Toronto
  • Jeff Mays: Never played in the majors
  • Greg Forlanda: Never played in the majors.
  • Luis Aquino: Had a decent little nine year career in middle relief.
  • Oswaldo Peraza: had one unimpressive season in the majors.
  • Jose Mesa: The first guy traded out of the minors in the history of the Jays to have a long and productive career.
  • Mike Brady: Never played in the majors
  • Francisco Cabrera: Cabrera went on to spend 4 years in the Atlanta system as a marginally useful bench filler. Was out of the majors at 27 (if in fact that was his real age).
  • Kevin Batiste: Never played in the majors after leaving Toronto.
  • Pedro Munoz: Spent 6 years as a part time OF with the Twins with average results, and had a one season farewell tour with the A's. Was out of the majors for good by 28.
  • Alex Sanchez: a special case since he returned to the Jays system, no impact for anyone.
  • Ken Rivers: never played in the major leagues.
  • Ron Blumberg: never played in the majors.
  • Shawn Jeter: got only 13 major league AB
  • Steve Wapnick: posted a total of 12 IP in the majors.
  • William Suero: accumulated 30 AB in the majors.
  • Rob Wishnevski: never played in the majors.
  • Ryan Thompson: acquired over 1200 entirely mediocre AB over the course of nine seasons.
  • Stoney Briggs: never played in the majors.
  • Jose Herrera: 390 irrelevant AB for the A's and was out of the majors at the ripe old age of 24.
  • Steve Karsay: Didn't really break through until he was 27 but has since had a nice little career.
  • Domingo Martinez: never got an AB in the majors again.

The Beloved Gord Ash

  • Peter Tucci: never played in the majors.
  • Carlos Almanzar: continues to hang around the fringes of the major leagues as a AAAA talent.
  • Beiker Graterol: logged all of 4 innings for his major league career.
  • Pat Lynch: never played in the majors.
  • Jorge Nunez: never played in the majors.
  • Jim Mann: has accumulated 30 odd decent innings but is a fringe player at this point.
  • Darwin Cubillan: fringe major leaguer with AAAA talent at best so far.
  • Mike Young: Has turned into an excellent if underrated 2b for the Rangers. Definitely a significant loss in retrospect.
  • John Sneed: never played in the majors.
  • Brent Abernathy: a couple of mediocre seasons, now struggles to get back to the majors at all.
  • Gary Glover: useful, if unspectacular, bullpen filler for the last three years.
  • Clayton Andrews: never played in the majors
  • Leo Estrella: bounced around minors before finally winning a spot in the majors in 2003. Nothing to write home to mother about so far.
  • John Bale: fringe player so far.
  • Mike Williams: never played in the majors.

J.P. Ricciardi's Short Record

  • Mike Kremblas: never played in the majors.
  • Chris Mowday: hasn't yet played in the majors
  • Michael Rouse: hasn't yet played in the majors.


The Final Score

  • 67 (Not counting Alex Sanchez) such players were dealt the 26 year history of the Jays.
    • 1 by Bavasi
    • 33 by Gillick
    • 30 by Ash
    • 3 by J.P.

  • 30 of these never appeared in the majors after leaving the Jays system.
    • 1 by Bavasi
    • 14 by Gillick
    • 12 by Ash
    • 3 by J.P.

  • 13 had no more than a couple of cups of coffee as major leaguers (less than 100 Ab or 50 IP).
  • 7 were out of the league within three years
  • 7 had extended, though ordinary, careers which are now over.
  • 10 others are still active major leaguers with relatively assured roles in the majors this season, not all of whom are significant players.
  • In sum total, out of 67 players who departed the Jays minor league system in their entire history only 17 had any extended major league career, and only three significant major league careers have resulted:
    • Jose Mesa
    • Steve Karsay
    • Mike Young


Finally to be fair and complete, the Jays have traded a number of players who were in the infancy of their major league careers who can be loosely considered "prospects." These include: Pete Vuckovich, Phil Huffman, Mauro Gozzo, Willie Blair, Denis Boucher, Jeff Kent, Paul Menhart, Edwin Hurtardo, Cesar Izturus, Felipe Lopez, and Mark Hendrickson, of whom four are still active on major league rosters. Only two of those (three if Lopez lives up to his clippings some day) were in any way significant major leaguers: Vuckovich and Kent.

So the question before the house is this:

Is the conventional wisdom about trading away future stardom when you deal minor leaguers completely false? Or have the Jays simply been incredibly lucky to have traded 78 such players and have lost only 5 important players, and only one real star player?

Further how does this record inform future decisions in regards to trading minor leaguers for major league help?
Pinch Hit: The Ones Who Got Away | 37 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
_Robbie Goldberg - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 06:01 PM EST (#79661) #
Great article, Will. Just out of curiosity, when you refer to the one star player produced, I assume you mean Kent --- though I suppose Mesa had a pretty decent career too...
On the question of whether the Jays have been incredibly lucky, I honestly don't think so. While teams may give up some prospects at the deadline, they will almost never trade those prospects that truly seem like future stars. Just look at this offseason --- I know there are a lot of other financial considerations taken, but the Dodgers wouldn't give up on the prospects they regarded as future stars (Miller and Jackson), even if it meant getting Ordonez or Garciapparra. I don't think the Jays would trade Rios or McGowan for anything (well...maybe Prior ;)) and I'm sure teams with players like Rodriguez, Griffey, Delgado or Mauer feel/felt the same way. Most of the players that do turn into stars are ones who bloom at a late age (re: Kent) and aren't really star-prosepects at the time. I know it's a completely different baseball landscape now compared to twenty years ago, but the only deal I can think of in the past five years where highly regarded prospects were sacrificed is the Colon deal with Brandon Phillips, Sizemore and Lee (a deal that can't really even be evaluated yet).
_Rob - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 06:16 PM EST (#79662) #
Interesting take and good article on the Player X-for-prospects situations, Will.

Somewhat off-topic, what happened to Cesar Izturis? I thought he was good defensively, so I looked up his stats. But I don't know much about Range Factor or if it is an accurate representation of a player's defense. Is RnF usually a good measure? And, was Izturis any good with the glove?
_Donkit R.K. - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 06:31 PM EST (#79663) #
Anybody else think Mike Young is worthy of star status already? He's certainly on that track, anyway. It wasn't that long ago that he was compared with Vernon Wells on this site, wasn't he?
_Magpie - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 06:32 PM EST (#79664) #
I'm thinking that receiving Fred McGriff as the prospect in the Dale Murray deal is enough to tip the lifetime balance in the Jays favour for this type of transaction.
Leigh - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 06:34 PM EST (#79665) #
I'm thinking that receiving Fred McGriff as the prospect in the Dale Murray deal is enough to tip the lifetime balance in the Jays favour for this type of transaction.

IMO, that is the greatest Blue Jays trade ever.
_Iain - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 06:38 PM EST (#79666) #
It would be interesting to see the same thing done with other teams, such as the yankees and the tigers for a nice spectrum
_Jordan - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 06:52 PM EST (#79667) #
It would be very interesting to see other teams' recent results in this kind of study; I expect that most would do poorly, even if we looked only at the last 20 or 25 years.

The Yankees have lost Fred McGriff and Jay Buhner ("Ken Phelps? What were you thinking!?") in that time frame, to name just two off the top of my head. The Tigers gave up John Smoltz to get Doyle Alexander, but at least Alexander was a key playoff cog: the Red Sox lost Jeff Bagwell for nothing more than Larry Andersen. Even the Braves coughed up Duane Ward to get Jim Acker. Any others spring to mind?

Great job, Will!
_Mike Moffatt - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 07:05 PM EST (#79668) #
http://economics.about.com
Any others spring to mind?

Since 1990 the Dodgers have lost an entire starting roster of guys to the Expos. So have a bunch of teams, tho. The Pirates throwing in Moises Alou as a PBTNL in the Scott Ruskin for Zane Smith trade was really sweet.

Cheers,

Mike
Pepper Moffatt - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 07:14 PM EST (#79669) #
http://economics.about.com
More Expos pickups:

Darrin Fletcher (From Philly, Dec. 9 1991)
John Wetteland (From Cinci, Dec. 11 1991)
Gil Heredia (From SF, Aug. 18 1992)
Pedro Martinez (From LA, Nov. 19 1993)

These four guys all had some playing time in the bigs, so might not have fit Will's criteria.

Cheers,

Mike
_Blue in SK - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 07:32 PM EST (#79670) #
Good work Will, I recognized the name from another Jays board and I'm sure you will find your efforts appreciated much more at da Box.
_WillRain - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 09:39 PM EST (#79671) #
Just a note to clarify, someone mentioned the criteria used, in general the main part of the list was designed to include only those who never played in the majors for the Jays, or had only a very brief apperance (such as a September call-up or an injury fill in roll)

The paragraph at the end which included the reference to Kent was just a nod to those players who had somewhat too much for the main list but never really had a full time chance as a Jay. That part was admitedly a bit subjective so I didn't say much about it.

As to other teams dealing star players before the made the majors with their team (or at least before having any success with them), some off the top of my head (beyond those already mentioned) include Curt Schilling, Eric Milton, Tony Armas, A.J. Burnett, Mike Lowell, Jeff Bagwell, Carl Everett, Sean Casey, and Phil Nevin.
_Donkit R.K. - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 10:05 PM EST (#79672) #
Abreu? Sosa?
_Donkit R.K. - Tuesday, February 03 2004 @ 10:31 PM EST (#79673) #
I guess Abreu had a bit more than a cup of coffee in the majors, but Sosa seems to fit. How about Miguel Batista (he's a star here),Preston Wilson, Justin Speier ;-), Paul Konerko, Ted Lilly, Freddy Garcia, and Derrek Lee. All of the names (save Abreu and Sosa) were found at B-R's 1998 transactions page that is linked above and I think they all fit the criteria.
_Jeff - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 09:31 AM EST (#79674) #
This was a pretty interesting analysis. I would have thought that more of these players would develop. In terms of explanation and the players mentioned as being traded, you can't forget who the prospect was traded for. To get certain players, higher level prospects are required. Also teams are much more willing to part with future stars in the midst of pennant race than they are in the offseason. The fact that the Jays won two world series and were very competitive over a ten year span and lost as few good prospects as they did speaks volumes about their past management.

Trading Vukovich and Young are the only obvious mistakes the Jays made in these types of transactions.
_coliver - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 09:37 AM EST (#79675) #
I get to see a lot of Dodgers games through the MLB Extra Innings Package and announcer Vin Scully just raves about Izturis' range and overall defence all the time. Whether the Dodgers dig Izturis is up to speculation, but Scully surely does!!!
_coliver - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 09:39 AM EST (#79676) #
According to the last "where are they now" by Jerry Howarth, Victor Cruz is divorced, unemployed, and living in the Dominican Republic.

When Cruz ended his pro career in Pittsburgh, he was fat, fat, fat. He ate his way out of baseball.
_pete_the_donkey - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 10:00 AM EST (#79677) #
Great article - I'd love to see the flip-side:
Players the Jays have recieved as prospects in trades.
Coach - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 10:40 AM EST (#79678) #
Nice job, Will. You could add Dave Gassner (PTBNL in the Stewart deal which ultimately landed Lilly) and Sandy Nin (part of the Speier trade) to J.P.'s record; some of us thought they were fringe prospects, even though both project as bullpen guys.

Mike Rouse had a pretty good year in 2003, including his Team USA stint. I wouldn't be shocked if he makes the A's as a backup middle infielder as soon as this summer, but I don't think he's a future star. The plan, of course, was for Lidle to pitch a lot better than he did, sign a three-year deal somewhere else as a free agent, then the Jays would replace Rouse with the extra draft picks. That didn't work out so well, as Cory was hurt and wouldn't admit it.

Sure, it's too soon to tell, but even if Phillips is a complete bust, Sizemore and Lee could make Omar Minaya's misadventures with Colon historically bad, perhaps in the Bagwell for Andersen class. Especially since he ended up with a lame El Duque and the mediocre Biddle and Liefer, rather than Colon.
_R Billie - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 10:53 AM EST (#79679) #
I have to agree Coach. Many people were praising Minaya's guts and creativity in landing Colon but it doesn't take much creativity to trade off your best three prospects (three of the best in baseball) to land a starter that you couldn't even afford beyond a year. Sure it was a different situation in Montreal but they still overpaid by a mile. From a Toronto perspective it would have been like giving up Rios, McGowan, and Quiroz.

There's no question Colon helped the Expos compete for a few months but they sure could use Lee in their rotation this year instead of an injured Hernandez.
robertdudek - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 11:26 AM EST (#79680) #
Most of the players traded early in their careers that become great were not regarded as good prospects at the time. Ryne Sandberg was a throw in that the Phillies came to regret. Pedro Guerrero was shipped out of Cleveland after his rookie ball season; Cecil Fielder was traded by KC after rookie ball. Brook Jacoby had a couple of cups of coffee with the Braves before he became an Indian. The Indians also got Brett Butler in that deal which sent a washed up Len Barker to Atlanta.

Carlos Baerga made it to triple A, but never played for the Padres. Moises Alou played 2 games for the Pirates before he was sent to Montreal (with Zane Smith going the other way). A defensible trade, as Pittsburgh had some pretty good outfielders already and needed pitching. Joe Carter started big league life as a Cub, but he was traded with Mel Hall and 2 others to net Rick Sutcliffe. Kenny Lofton was stolen from the Astros and became a key member of the powerhouse Indians almost immediately.

Eric Milton was traded to Minnesota after his AA season in the Yankees organisation (Guzman and Knoblauch were they other main guys involved). David Cone pitched 22.7 innings for the Royals before making his way to the Mets - now that was a bad trade for the Royals, as no one else in the deal amounted to a hill of beans. Randy Johnson was traded mid-season 1989 (45.7 career innings with the 'Spos) with Langston going the other way; Langston in turn became a free agent at the end of that season. Mike Hampton threw 17 innings for Seattle before a very successful stint in Houston. The Mariners gained revenge by extracting Freddy Garcia and Carlos Guillen for a half-season of Randy Johnson.

Keith Foulke was included in a 9-player deal by the Giants (who can blame them after 44+ terrible innings). Similarly, the Rangers didn't think they needed Robb Nen and packaged him to Florida in '93; he emerged as a closer in '94.

Sandy Alomar played 8 games for the Padres and was actually regarded as one of the top prospects in baseball at the time of his trade to the Indians. I remember everyone in baseball shouting at the Padres to trade Alomar Jr. because they already had a young stud catcher named Benito Santiago. They finally made a deal and got Joe Carter for Alomar Jr and a throw who turned out to be pretty good (Baerga). Jose Cruz Jr was regarded as one of the top prospects in baseball at the time of his trade to Toronto.

A dealine deal for a big star ought to get you some decent players in return - the Mariners did well getting Johnson and almost as well when they finally dealt him. I'm sure there are many more examples over the last 20 years.

I think the Jays have done extremely well in this department - a fair number of players traded very early in their careers become quality major league players, but only a handful of Jays traded away have ever done anything much in the majors.
robertdudek - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 11:31 AM EST (#79681) #
It seemed to start with Carter, Butler and Jacoby, then Baerga, Alomar Jr and Lofton and now Bradley, Lee, and Sizemore. The Indians seem to specialize in trading for good prospects and young players from other teams and turning them into quality major leaguers.
robertdudek - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 11:32 AM EST (#79682) #
I forgot to mention Jay Bell, who the Indians got in the Blyleven deal from Minnesota, only to lose him to the Pirates for next to nothing.
Craig B - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 11:45 AM EST (#79683) #
Interesting take and good article on the Player X-for-prospects situations, Will.

Somewhat off-topic, what happened to Cesar Izturis? I thought he was good defensively, so I looked up his stats. But I don't know much about Range Factor or if it is an accurate representation of a player's defense. Is RnF usually a good measure? And, was Izturis any good with the glove?


I don't think one can draw any conclusion other than that Izturis was good, maybe even fantastic, with the glove. Using the three most sophisticated defensive measures I have available, Zone Rating, Ultimate Zone Rating, and Defensive Win Shares:

Izturis led all shortstops in baseball in Defensive Win Shares. 17 AL shortstops and 17 NL shortstops had 500 defensive innings; Izturis ranked third in DWS per inning (trailing both Alex Gonzalezes).

UZR is less enthusiastic; it ranked Izturis at +5 runs per 162 games over his career, but at exactly average in 2003.

Zone Rating has him as above average, in a big knot of players who are all very close. He's 12th among starters in ZR.

Izturis also has a good fielding percentage. I'd say all in all the statistical evidence points to him being good to very good. The anecdotal evidence says he's better; I think Izturis is spectacular. That doesn't mean he's good, of course, but he's great to watch.

From the hitting side, I know Izturis looked bad in 2003 (he hit .251/.282/.315 for a 597 OPS and a 61 OPS+) but he is young and is still improving with the bat. He really improved from the left side of the plate and Dodger Stadium does hurt his numbers a bit.

He's never going to be a great player, but he is a great glove man and a very useful player to have if he doesn't have to start for you.
_Shane - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 12:52 PM EST (#79684) #
Many people were praising Minaya's guts and creativity in landing Colon but it doesn't take much creativity to trade off your best three prospects (three of the best in baseball)...

Thank you. Minaya having some extraordinary abilty to assemble a ballclub is a journalism myth.
_Rich - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 02:24 PM EST (#79685) #
Does anyone know if it's actually true that Gillick had worked out a Bill-Singer-for-Ron-Guidry deal in 1977 before Bavasi killed it?
Craig B - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 02:29 PM EST (#79686) #
Rich, I think it may be a stretch to say the deal was "worked out".

Stephen Brunt tells the story in Diamond Dreams, and it doesn't (as I recall) read exactly like that. Gillick had spoken to the Yankees about Singer (who the Yankees wanted badly) and apparently the Yankees were keen to do the deal for young players and/or prospects. Now Gillick also knew (because he had just left the Yankee organization) that Billy Martin didn't think much of Guidry at all and would probably be happy to see him gone for a veteran arm.

Whether they actually had a deal worked out, I don't know, but Gillick apparently considered it likely that a deal could be worked out, and he was in position to know. I doubt a deal was worked on, because after all Bavasi was the GM and he refused to even consider dealing Singer.

Interestingly, it was apparently the only time that Bavasi ever used his "veto power" over Gillick on the baseball side.
_Rich - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 04:12 PM EST (#79687) #
Craig, you have one hell of a memory. I am looking at Diamond Dreams right now (I read it about 5 or 6 years ago) and your recollection is almost verbatim to how Brunt reported it. He does say that it was the Yanks who were looking to dump Guidry.
Craig B - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 04:35 PM EST (#79688) #
My memory ain't that good. I was reading Diamond Dreams two weeks ago, because I was editing Leigh's magnum opus on the trades!
_WillRain - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 09:52 PM EST (#79689) #
Speaking of trades that didn't get made, I mentioned this a couple of weeks ago, Baseball Weekly (I believe) once had a story about the Jays and it was reported in this article that Gillick had two possibilities in '93 when he dealt Karsay for Henderson, and he had decided to go with the other one, but after trying all day on the 31st he could not get Woody Woodward on the phone and had to go with Ricky henderson after all, missing the chance to close the deal for Randy Johnson.

Bummer.
_Jeremy - Wednesday, February 04 2004 @ 10:17 PM EST (#79690) #
About the Guidry for Singer deal listed above. I believe that the story goes that the Jays and Yankees had agreed, at least in principle, to do the deal. Then it was discovered that Singer was on the cover of the media guide. Apparantly the Jays couldn't, or wouldn't, make a change to the cover, so the deal was scrapped.

At least, I think that's how the story goes.
_Warse - Thursday, February 05 2004 @ 03:17 AM EST (#79691) #
Fransico Cabrera was only marginally useful?!?

You would think that pinch hitting home Sid Bream from second base with 2 outs in the bottom of the 9th to win Game 7 of the 1992 NLCS would entitle a guy to a little more respect! And I haven't even begun to list his other notable accomplishments! Like there was that one time that he......um........

Okay, so the guy only had one meaningful at bat his whole career, but he sure as heck made it count.
Craig B - Thursday, February 05 2004 @ 08:30 AM EST (#79692) #
Apparantly the Jays couldn't, or wouldn't, make a change to the cover, so the deal was scrapped.

Sorry, but that sounds like a fabrication. Singer wasn't valuable because he was on the cover of the media guide; he was valuable because he was a well-known name who would (it was hoped) sell tickets.

Bavasi wasn't the brightest star in the heavens, but he wasn't that dumb.
_Rich - Thursday, February 05 2004 @ 09:44 AM EST (#79693) #
My recollection of the Randy Johnson talks is that Olerud's name was in the mix.
_Shane - Thursday, February 05 2004 @ 10:28 AM EST (#79694) #
My recollection of the Randy Johnson talks is that Olerud's name was in the mix.

That was a rumor at one time, but not the "time" that Will is talking about. Trading Olerud during the '93 stretch drive obviously wasn't happening. The rumor was probably post-'93.
_Rich - Thursday, February 05 2004 @ 10:32 AM EST (#79695) #
Well, it's a bit hard to know, although you may well be right. In '93 everyone's concern was whether or not the pitching was good enough, and Carlos wasn't far away from the big leagues. When I say Olerud's name came up, that doesn't mean that the Jays offered to trade him.
_S.K. - Thursday, February 05 2004 @ 02:20 PM EST (#79696) #
There is no way the Jays were considering trading one of the best hitters in the league while they were contending for a playoff spot. The idea that another team would even suggest it is ludicrous.
_MatO - Thursday, February 05 2004 @ 04:13 PM EST (#79697) #
Olerud was hitting over .400 at the time. He only fell off in September.
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