Word has it that former Yankees standout Chien-Ming Wang has opted out of a minor league deal to take on a major league contract with your Toronto Blue Jays. The sinkerballer is slated to start Tuesday instead of Esmil Rogers.
If Wang can still wing it I think it might work out ok.
A reasonable move, and even better - Thole up, Blanco designated for assignment. Also, LaRoche up.
On Wednesday Blanco caught a shutout. He was behind the plate for Dickey's best start of the season by any Blue Jay starting pitcher. He scored the eventual winning run by busting a gut scoring from first on a double. He possibly enjoyed the flight back to Toronto. Then boom, see ya.
The thing I will be looking for is how much playing time will Thole get? Is he just Dickey's catcher or will he play more than that? Tomorrow is a day game after a night game, who starts?
It's only a reasonable move if Arencibia isn't the starting C for 4 out of every 5 games.
"It's only a reasonable move if Arencibia isn't the starting C for 4 out of every 5 games."
We can st least hope this is the case.
We can st least hope this is the case.
If Wang can still wing it I think it might work out ok.
How long has it been since Wang could wing it effectively? Five years ago? Ricky Romero's entire career has come, and possibly gone, since those days. And when Wang actually was good, he was an extreme ground ball pitcher, which probably won't work with this infield.
Hey, I've been listening to Miranda Lambert a lot lately. Growing on me...
Throw a dog a bone, I'll take it if i have to
Go real fast like there's somewhere we can get to...
Desperation
There's danger in frustration
How long has it been since Wang could wing it effectively? Five years ago? Ricky Romero's entire career has come, and possibly gone, since those days. And when Wang actually was good, he was an extreme ground ball pitcher, which probably won't work with this infield.
Hey, I've been listening to Miranda Lambert a lot lately. Growing on me...
Throw a dog a bone, I'll take it if i have to
Go real fast like there's somewhere we can get to...
Desperation
There's danger in frustration
5 years..... an eternity. Desperate times call for desperate measures I guess.
How long has it been since Wang could wing it effectively? Five years ago?
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He has been doing quite well in AAA.
As I said in the minor league thread...
Well that makes a lot of sense. Blanco has not hit and the guy he was hired to catch has not done as well as expected. Thole has torn up AAA (322/383/510) and really is needed here.
LaRoche has been talked about too much by me and others in another thread.
Chen-Ming Wang is an interesting one. Low K, low HR/9 guy in his career, but really stunk a few times. 103 ERA+ lifetime, but not since 2008 (when LaRoche was a top 100 prospect). Has been effective in AAA for the Yankees with a 2.33 ERA 0.3 HR/9 1.6 BB/9 and 3.9 K/9 rate. An extreme ground ball pitcher, I hope we have the best available defense when he pitches (although who knows what that is lately).
Well that makes a lot of sense. Blanco has not hit and the guy he was hired to catch has not done as well as expected. Thole has torn up AAA (322/383/510) and really is needed here.
LaRoche has been talked about too much by me and others in another thread.
Chen-Ming Wang is an interesting one. Low K, low HR/9 guy in his career, but really stunk a few times. 103 ERA+ lifetime, but not since 2008 (when LaRoche was a top 100 prospect). Has been effective in AAA for the Yankees with a 2.33 ERA 0.3 HR/9 1.6 BB/9 and 3.9 K/9 rate. An extreme ground ball pitcher, I hope we have the best available defense when he pitches (although who knows what that is lately).
Thole for Blanco is obviously overdue. I can actually see the logic of using Blanco to open the season, and giving Thole a month of regular play in AAA to re-establish himself after his concussion season last year. But by now... yes, long overdue.
I assume that the LaRoche move means Lawrie isn't going to be back until the All-Star Break, they don't think DeRosa will be effective playing every day, and having all three off Izturis, Bonifacio, and Kawasaki in the lineup is just too depressing to contemplate.
It would depress the hell out of me.
I assume that the LaRoche move means Lawrie isn't going to be back until the All-Star Break, they don't think DeRosa will be effective playing every day, and having all three off Izturis, Bonifacio, and Kawasaki in the lineup is just too depressing to contemplate.
It would depress the hell out of me.
actually it was just two years ago that Wang was able to wing it effectively as a fill in starter...giving the nats 11 starts, 62.1ip, and a 4.04era.
last year it didn't work out so well for him, though.
last year it didn't work out so well for him, though.
[Wang] has been doing quite well in AAA.
Yup. Of course, so did Ramon Ortiz.
On the other hand... with any other pitcher, Wang's K rate in AAA this year would be a concern (he has just 25 Ks in 58 IP.) Except over the course of his career, the more hitters Wang strikes out, the less effective he is. He is a very unusual pitcher. So maybe that's a good sign.
Yup. Of course, so did Ramon Ortiz.
On the other hand... with any other pitcher, Wang's K rate in AAA this year would be a concern (he has just 25 Ks in 58 IP.) Except over the course of his career, the more hitters Wang strikes out, the less effective he is. He is a very unusual pitcher. So maybe that's a good sign.
I hope we have the best available defense when he pitches
My first thought, too. Can an extreme ground ball pitcher, who strikes out barely 3 guys per 9 IP, succeed with a shortstop who has... oh, Derek Jeter's defensive skills?
Oh. Apparently he can.
My first thought, too. Can an extreme ground ball pitcher, who strikes out barely 3 guys per 9 IP, succeed with a shortstop who has... oh, Derek Jeter's defensive skills?
Oh. Apparently he can.
His K rate is riskier for a team like the Jays with a horrible defense.
Whoa there, ayj! "DFA Wang's ass" is way outside the foul lines. Don't we quote Michelle Branch here?
Female pop singer with a couple of hits in the mid-00s, I think. One of which still gets stuck in my head on an annoyingly regular basis
If you have to ask, you are beyond redemption, ayj!
John Lott @LottOnBaseball
Gibbons vague on how he'll use Thole, LaRoche. Thole will play more than Blanco did. LaRoche? "We'll pick our spots."
John Lott @LottOnBaseball
Wang starting Tuesday? "I got no idea," Gibbons said. Said he didn't know anything about Wang reports.
Gibbons vague on how he'll use Thole, LaRoche. Thole will play more than Blanco did. LaRoche? "We'll pick our spots."
John Lott @LottOnBaseball
Wang starting Tuesday? "I got no idea," Gibbons said. Said he didn't know anything about Wang reports.
"Yup. Of course, so did Ramon Ortiz."
well, not quite exactly. Ortiz was putting up a decent looking ERA in AAA but that was smoke and mirrors based on a .193babip and a team-worst 6.05fip.
Wang's putting up a similarly pretty ERA, but his periphals actually support it (.275babip, 3.36fip).
Not that I expect anything much out of Wang, but still.
well, not quite exactly. Ortiz was putting up a decent looking ERA in AAA but that was smoke and mirrors based on a .193babip and a team-worst 6.05fip.
Wang's putting up a similarly pretty ERA, but his periphals actually support it (.275babip, 3.36fip).
Not that I expect anything much out of Wang, but still.
For Thole catching...
2012 Dickey: with Thole 2.87 ERA 288 OPS against; with Mike Nickeas 2.23 ERA 585 OPS against
2011 : with Thole 3.50 ERA 702 OPS against; Paulino 3.48 ERA 706 OPS against; Nickeas 2.14 ERA 622 OPS
2010: with Thole 3.17 ERA 719 OPS against; Blanco 2.52 ERA 528 OPS; Barajas 1.86 ERA 650 OPS (3 games)
That covers his big 3 years. Thole caught him all 3 years and every year had the worst ERA of anyone catching him. Nickeas was probably the best for him and we have him in AAA but he is hitting extremely poorly (420 OPS in 83 PA).
2012 Dickey: with Thole 2.87 ERA 288 OPS against; with Mike Nickeas 2.23 ERA 585 OPS against
2011 : with Thole 3.50 ERA 702 OPS against; Paulino 3.48 ERA 706 OPS against; Nickeas 2.14 ERA 622 OPS
2010: with Thole 3.17 ERA 719 OPS against; Blanco 2.52 ERA 528 OPS; Barajas 1.86 ERA 650 OPS (3 games)
That covers his big 3 years. Thole caught him all 3 years and every year had the worst ERA of anyone catching him. Nickeas was probably the best for him and we have him in AAA but he is hitting extremely poorly (420 OPS in 83 PA).
With Henry Blanco being DFA'd, does he retire if not claimed, or report to AAA? Who might fill the Catcher's spot in AAA, if Blanco can't (Nickeas as #1 Catcher)? As long as J.P. Arencibia catches no more than 4 Games a week, calling Thole up won't be a waste. Considering Brett Lawrie has a bad sprain to recover from, and a cold bat to restart, I don't expect him back before the All Star Break at the very earliest, early August more likely. Andy Laroche only needs to be better defensively than anyone not named Lawrie. The bat will come around, but not another JoeyBats. I think we should be happy the better Bench and smaller Bullpen. Chien-Ming Wang could be useful, as it lets Jenkins work on his stuff, and he must be better than anyone else healthy.
Sean Ochinko has been promoted from AA to AAA. He and Mike Nickeas will share the catching duties.
SI Article.
Cashman quote: “He’s not the power sinker he used to be, but we believe he needs to mix in more of his breaking balls to have the type of success necessary to pitch up here consistently… He needs to incorporate some of his pitches in there and mix and match because he’s that reduced in velocity. His lines have been very nice and good, but he’s working on all his weapons because what he’s doing down there wouldn’t represent necessarily what we think he could do up here right now.”
Hopefully the offspeed stuff has improved since then.
Re Gerry on Ochinko's promotion, TamRa and John Northey on Chris Snyder:
If the Jays' organization decides to add another catcher from outside the organization, plenty of Canadian catchers are playing in the minors:
1) Chris Robinson, age 29, in 2013 Orioles' 5th season AAA, career AAA slash line:.281/.318/.365
2) Mike Blanke, age 24 in 2013 White Sox' 1st season AA, has not ever played AAA.
3) Lars Davis, age 27 in 2013 Rox' AAA, first season in AAA in 2013: .305/.370./420
4) Luke Carlin, age 32 in 2103 Angels' 8th season AAA, career AAA slash line: .247/.366./356
5) Joey Paciorek, age 24 in 2013 Brewers' 1st season AA
6) John Suomi, age 32 in 2013 Phillies' 7th season AAA, career AAA: .240/.281/.361
7) Matt Emery in Germany
8) Jordan Rogers in Germany
9) Cole Armstrong, age 29 in 2013 Independent League, career AAA for 4 seasons: .261/.322/.434
10) Patrick D'Aoust, age 27 in 2013 Can-Am League
11) Emerson Frostad, age 30 in 2013 Can-Am League, career AAA for 4 seasons: .234/324/336
Robinson' got only 103 PA in AAA and Armstrong got 58 PA at a Double-A level indy league. Lars Davis had played three AA seasons before this 148 PA, first AAA season. Thus he seems to be blocked which could also mean his skills is not enough valuable as a prospect.
If Snyder cannot join the Herd in Buffalo, one of these three players could be a choice: Armstrong a better chance, IMO.
If the Jays' organization decides to add another catcher from outside the organization, plenty of Canadian catchers are playing in the minors:
1) Chris Robinson, age 29, in 2013 Orioles' 5th season AAA, career AAA slash line:.281/.318/.365
2) Mike Blanke, age 24 in 2013 White Sox' 1st season AA, has not ever played AAA.
3) Lars Davis, age 27 in 2013 Rox' AAA, first season in AAA in 2013: .305/.370./420
4) Luke Carlin, age 32 in 2103 Angels' 8th season AAA, career AAA slash line: .247/.366./356
5) Joey Paciorek, age 24 in 2013 Brewers' 1st season AA
6) John Suomi, age 32 in 2013 Phillies' 7th season AAA, career AAA: .240/.281/.361
7) Matt Emery in Germany
8) Jordan Rogers in Germany
9) Cole Armstrong, age 29 in 2013 Independent League, career AAA for 4 seasons: .261/.322/.434
10) Patrick D'Aoust, age 27 in 2013 Can-Am League
11) Emerson Frostad, age 30 in 2013 Can-Am League, career AAA for 4 seasons: .234/324/336
Robinson' got only 103 PA in AAA and Armstrong got 58 PA at a Double-A level indy league. Lars Davis had played three AA seasons before this 148 PA, first AAA season. Thus he seems to be blocked which could also mean his skills is not enough valuable as a prospect.
If Snyder cannot join the Herd in Buffalo, one of these three players could be a choice: Armstrong a better chance, IMO.
Re John Northey on Mike Nickeas and Snyder:
I just got an interesting thought along the line of getting Canadian catchers,
1) the Jays could sign LHB Armstrong and send Nickeas to AA.
OR 2) claim Snyder off Orioles waiver and trade him to the Royals for age 30 George Kottaras. George has topped all these other CAN catchers in career AAA slash line with multiple MLB season. The Royals needs a veteran backup to Salvador Perez and Snyder is a good one to fit that bill. If this transaction goes through, George can get regular PAs in Buffalo to establish his MLB career and raise his batting for average in Bisons lineup.
I just got an interesting thought along the line of getting Canadian catchers,
1) the Jays could sign LHB Armstrong and send Nickeas to AA.
OR 2) claim Snyder off Orioles waiver and trade him to the Royals for age 30 George Kottaras. George has topped all these other CAN catchers in career AAA slash line with multiple MLB season. The Royals needs a veteran backup to Salvador Perez and Snyder is a good one to fit that bill. If this transaction goes through, George can get regular PAs in Buffalo to establish his MLB career and raise his batting for average in Bisons lineup.