Okay, someone give me some speculation, here: what would the Red Sox trade for Lilly that the Jays could use? What would that do to the rotation -- keep Walker in it and call Bush back up? And would the Red Sox really play with fire by giving a division rival something to fill in a hole on their team in such a tight race?

Not discounting it, just trying to figure out the logistics.

Hey, wait, does Johnny O want to retire as a Jay? Nah, if he did he could have approached 'em in the offseason, right?

I can recall at least one instance where "we're not trading that guy" very quickly dissolved into a trade.

How is Bush doing in AAA? I can't see trading away Lilly, with the team on the edge of contending, without a serious plan to replace him.

Last time I heard J.P. give his list of untouchable guys it was Hill, Rios and Halladay, end of list. I could be remembering that wrong -- Thomas can either back me up or make me look foolish, because that was at the Alan Schwarz talk on the weekend.

No. He'll be entering his final arbitration year.

Please link, or provide sources, for any news/rumors. So instead of writing 'the Red Sox are interested in Lilly' write who is saying it, for example, 'According to the Wilner on the Fan the Sox are interested in Lilly'.

Scouts, plural? Do they send a scout, and then another scout to check up on the first scout in case the first scout starts becoming delusional? ("That Huckaby is a real gamer, and I think that he can help our ballclub.") Do they travel in pairs to provide a pinochle partner to while away the empty hours between games?

(I'm not making fun of you, Lefty - I assume that you are accurately reporting what you heard. My tiny brain is just fascinated by the idea of multiple scouts from one team.)

I can't imagine any scenario where that would happen. It's not like Lilly and Batista are Clemens and Rivera. If Carlos Beltran gets a few B prospects last year I can't see Arizona trading their A prospects.

Batista is interesting though. For the past few years the Jays have needed a closer, and now they apparently have one. Batista probably has trade value, but if you do trade him you're opening up a pretty big hole in the bullpen. I don't see anyone currently on the team, or in the organization, filling the hole, and based on this offseason you're not going to sign a closer for what Batista is costing you now ($4.75 next year - quite an albatross, eh?). So given that, why should the Jays even consider trading Batista.

The Toronto Sun reported yesterday that the Red Sox are one of several teams scouting Toronto Blue Jays lefty Ted Lilly for a possible trade.

The rest of the article is here, but that single line is the only mention of the rumor. Anyone got a reference from the Sun?

"What does it say about the Jays that they are thinking about moving their second best -- okay, maybe that's Gustavo Chacin -- starter?" asks Bob Elliot. "It says wait until next season."

Without providing direct quotes, Elliot implies that the four executives were there to see Lilly. He says:

The gallery at Rogers Centre, eight rows behind home plate, was impressed with the elevation of Lilly's pitches, his mechanics, his velocity (94 m.p.h) and his results Monday as he worked seven innings in an 11-2 win over the Baltimore Orioles.

Other than this, Elliot provides nothing. Well, I was impressed with Lilly that night, too, but I'm not going to trade anyone for him. Hell, I was at the game in good seats! But that still doesn't mean I'm in negotiations to trade anything for him.

All in all, it's an article that could have some truth in it that appears to be based on coincidence and guesswork.

The trade is a stupid one for the Mets, no doubt, and a surprisingly good one for Tampa Bay. But the difference is that Kazmir is a pitcher. Teams are far more likely to trade pitching prospects because of their unpredictability than they are to trade Grade A hitters, who are much easier to forecast.

This is somewhat off topic, but one of the more brilliant trades in recent years was the fleecing the Indians pulled on the Expos. Bartolo Colon is a terrific pitcher, but to give up Grady Sizemore, Cliff Lee, and Bradon Phillips (who, ironically, is the worst player to come over) is perhaps a bit much. For all his genius, Billy Beane couldn't get nearly as much in return for Tim Hudson, who is arguably the better pitcher -- without question, he's got a bigger reputation -- and who should have commanded more. Yet Mark Shapiro is never mentioned in the same breath as Beane, by both the mainstream media and by the blogging community. Hopefully Shapiro will get his due, because the Indians have made some sharp moves in recent years.

Never a dull moment. He's had 4 starts. The hitters roughed him up in the first one, and Esix Snead roughed him up in another. He's 1-0, 4.57. 16 K and 7 BB in 21.2 IP.

With all due respect, I doubt many fans outside of Toronto have heard of Hill, Purcey, and League. But it's hard not to root for a guy named Kip. I mean, the Kipster! A name can say a thousand pictures. For instance, would Bip Roberts have been half as popular with a name like, say, Clint?

Heh. I was waiting for someone to suggest the Jays acquire Albert Pujols for $24 worth of beads. :)

That said, I very much doubt the return on Lilly will amount to anything, as is the nature of these salary purges. Who did the M's get for Randy Johnson? John Halama, Carlos Guillen, and ... I forget the other one. J.P. ought to be thrilled with that. And he won't get it, sorry.

Question: What's the difference between that and, say, what Keith Law does for the Jays?

But wow! It sure would be nice to get Pujols for those beads ...

It worked for Chris Gomez

In truth, I simply wanted to say that I really would like, say, a team like, say, the A's to get, say, a player like, say, Pujols for $24! Problem is, would he solve their offensive problems? Hurumph.

Saying "trade 3 B prospects for a low-salaried superstar" is as about as useful advice as saying "Hey, you, Strawberry.. hit a homerun!"

But the latter actually worked!

But we're talking about *you* now, Mr. Changing the Subject Guy.

Speaking of changing the subject, I would really like a pony or possibly a unicorn.

Dammit, I already gave you your unicorn!

And of course that GM is no longer around either

Russ Adams is looking for a home in the Blue Jays batting order. For most of this year, it has been at the bottom of the lineup. Last night, he was flipped to the top for the first time in the majors.

First time in the majors? First time this season. Fully two thirds (49 of 72) of his AB last September came while he was hitting #1 in the order.

Sure, but I don't think there's any way Lilly is a number 2 starter on a legitimate contender. On a .500 team, sure. He's a .500 pitcher. When he was on a real contender, he was a 4th starter.

Ideally for me it would be Hill because of his arm strength.

I've seen this argument over and over and really don't understand it. Exactly what good is better arm strength without range (since it's usually at the extent of one's range where you need the arm strength)? So when Adams gets to balls that Hill can't get to, he can't get the out cause he doesn't have Hill's arm? No one else sees the flaw in this statement? BTW I've constantly heard about the thowing difference in the two, but really, I don't see it. Hill's definately got a better arm, but it's nothing special, and Adam's isn't terrible. I think people really overemphasize the difference.

I'm only talking arm strength here. Maybe Hill has better than average range too, haven't seen him play enough SS to tell. But saying he should play short because of his arm in non-sensible to me.

I said 90 in my pre-season prediction, but I'm not into making hard-and-fast-this-will-happen pronouncements. But those who do should be ready to put their money where their mouths are.

But let's say we had a bet at 85 games: you'd get a sweatshirt for 84 or less, what would I get for 85 or more?

Done. I mean, waiting to be done.