Batter's Box Interactive Magazine

The top two affiliates went winless but the young guys managed to pull out four wins to make it a solid night on the farm... Oh, and the number two is featured prominently in this report.

Fresno 3 Las Vegas 2

His stuff might be lite for the potent AL East but Brad Mills knows his way around AAA... and could really use a relocation to the National League during the upcoming off-season. On this night, he allowed three runs in seven innings of work. He gave up eight hits but did not allow a walk. He struck out five batters. Kyle Davies made his first appearances and worked out of the bullpen (He's normally a starter) and pitched a scoreless inning. Adeiny Hechavarria was 0-for-3 with a strikeout but he walked twice. David Cooper and Ricardo Nanita each had three hits.Chris Woodward went 2-for-5 and was involved with both runs as he recorded a RBI and was plated. Adam Loewen had a pinch-hit double.

New Britain 8 New Hampshire 5

Dustin McGowan suffered through his worst start. He gave up five runs one six hits and a walk over 3.1 innings of work. He did not strike out a batter. Wes Etheridge, almost unhittable in high-A ball, was touched up for three runs in 2.2 innings. B.J. LaMura and Evan Crawford worked scoreless innings. Anthony Gose's average dipped below .250 with an 0-for-3 day. He did, though, walk twice, steal two bases and score... you got it, two runs. Mark Sobolewski had two hits, including a solo homer. Yan Gomes also went deep. John Tolisano went 0-for-3 with a walk, strikeout and an error.

Dunedin 7 Daytona 5

Ryan Tepera had a so-so day. He gave up three earned runs in five innings but was touched up for seven hits. He walked one and did not strike out a batter. Brian Tallet was credited with the win in a rehab appearance. He gave up one run in one inning one two hits, including a solo homer. Aaron Loup worked the final two frames for the save. Kevin Nolan was 1-for-3 with two RBI. Brian Van Kirk and Brad Glenn each had two hits (one of which was a double for both hitters). Glenn scored two runs, while Van Kirk drove in a pair. Ivan Contreras went 1-for-3 with two runs scored, a stolen base and an error. Ryan Schimpf did not put a ball in play with an 0-for-3 day that included a walk and three Ks.

Lansing 4 Dayton 3

Sean Nolin had another strong game as he looks to finish the season on a high note. The lefty struck out eight batters in seven innings and did not issue a walk. He allowed three runs but only two were earned. Nolin gets lost in the wave of impressive, young pitchers but he`s a solid sleeper prospect. Danny Webb returned from the DL (and one-game rehab stint in the GCL) to pitch a scoreless inning. He struck out two batters. At the plate, K.C. Hobson and Matt Nuzzo each had two hits. The latter player also walked twice and reached base in all four plate appearances. Eli Boike went 0-for-2 but he walked twice and drove in a run. Markus Brisker went 1-for-3 with a double and two Ks.

Vancouver 8 Salem-Keizer 7

The Canadians held off the Giants' affiliate despite a late push. Drew Permison shut the door in the ninth inning for his 12th save even though he did allow one run to squeak through first. Jesse Hernandez started the game and gave up four runs in five innings on nine hits. Bryan Longpre allowed two runs in three innings of relief. Jon Berti had a busy day both at the plate and at second base. He was involved in two double plays, he went 2-for-4 with two doubles, two RBI and two runs scored. He also walked twice, took a pair of Ks and stole a base. Kevin Patterson's late-season surge continues as he went 3-for-5 with two RBI. Andy Burns had two hits, stole a base and scored three runs.

Bluefield 9 Pulaski 2

Tyler Ybarra's move back to the starting rotation continues to go smoothly. He held the Jays' former affiliate to just two hits in five shutout innings. He walked two batters and struck out four. Jon Lucas worked two scoreless innings. Ian Kadish finished the game with 1.2 hitless innings. Sleeper prospect Danny Arcila went 2-for-3 and scored a run. The second baseman was also involved in three double plays. Gustavo Pierre had two hits and scored two runs. Chris Hawkins banged out two doubles, drove in two, scored a run, and stole a base. Kevin Pillar continued to swing a hot bat with two more hits, including a homer. The aggressive hitter also walked. Dalton Pompey went 0-for-4 but he scored a run and drove in two.

GCL Jays - Off Day

DSL Jays - Season Over

Three Stars:
3. Sean Nolin, eight Ks in seven innings
2. Tyler Ybarra, five shutout innings
1. Jon Berti, 2 hits, 2 walks, SB

Posted by Marc Hulet on Monday, August 22 2011 @ 08:05 AM EDT.

The Power of Two | 77 comments | Create New Account

The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.

Bankertuck - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 08:50 AM EDT (#241759) #

With the DSL season over; can we see any moves up to the Gulf?

MatO - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 09:52 AM EDT (#241764) #

I suspect US visa hassles would preclude bringing anyone in from the DSL for the last couple of weeks of the GCL season.

Gerry - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 01:54 PM EDT (#241783) #

I was "wowed" by Adeiny Hechavarria's defense back in June, now his new manager in Las Vegas is "wowed" too.

"Every day he seems to do something on the defensive side where you just shake your head and think, 'Wow,' " Las Vegas manager Marty Brown said.

"I've had a lot of really good middle infielders play for me -- Jhonny Peralta, Brandon Phillips, Maicer Izturis -- but Hetch is one of the most special, as far as being able to do the things he can do with the glove, his arm strength, his overall range and his reads off the bat."

The Las Vegas Review-Journal also talks about Hech's more relaxed approach at the plate and getting his family out of Cuba.

dan gordon - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 02:08 PM EDT (#241784) #

Nolin was picked just after Thon in last year's draft and signed for a bonus of $800. He's a big guy at 6'5", throws left, and has bounced back nicely this year after getting hit around a bit at Auburn last year. His K:BB ratio is very nice at about 3.5 to 1. He's certainly on my radar as a prospect to watch.

Ybarra was a very late pick in 2008. He was considered a tough sign, but the Jays were able to land him. He missed the 2010 season - I'm assuming due to injury, but he's had a pretty good season this year - strikes out more than a batter an inning, and, like Nolin, has a K:BB ratio around 3.5 to 1.

Patterson's showing some good power with 9 HR's in 136 AB's between Bluefield and Vancouver. Old for that level, of course. Several of the college guys the Jays picked up after their top 20 picks this year have performed quite well - Patterson, Rollins, Pillar, Taylor, Broussard, Mooney. Not great mlb prospects, obviously, but, hey, youneverknow. At least they help to create a winning atmosphere at the lower levels.

China fan - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 02:11 PM EDT (#241785) #

Thanks for posting that article, Gerry. Among other things, I learned that the first syllable of his surname is pronounced "Hetch" -- not "Heck" as I had long assumed.

92-93 - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 02:20 PM EDT (#241788) #

If Nolin only got $800 he may want to find himself a new agent.

MrPurple - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 02:24 PM EDT (#241790) #

Not sure which thread to post this but http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/ has an interesting piece on why 'your team' will NOT sign Prince Fielder. The interesting part is when it comes to the Blue Jays, its the only team they can't come up with a good reason why they would not sign him. They have a spot realtivly open for him. Toronto can afford him. Toronto may have the players in place to contend in 2012. So why not?

DaveB - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 02:35 PM EDT (#241792) #

Eric Arce hit his 14th HR today, which I believe is a GCL record. That's not exactly a harbinger of future success -- at 13 he was tied with washout Derrick Bly and longtime minor league-Japan banger Tony Blanco, and John Tolisano hit 10 in 2007 -- but a fine accomplishment nonetheless. Arce also leads the GCL in walks (38 in 203 PA).

Mike Green - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 02:42 PM EDT (#241794) #

If Jhonny Peralta is your idea of a really good defensive middle infielder, you have not watched enough baseball. Gerry, I believe your view is that Hechavarria made plays that you did not feel Escobar could make; that would be a more impressive standard than the likes of Peralta.

TamRa - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 02:50 PM EDT (#241795) #

without any hard data, I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess that Peralta was a considerably better SS when he was in AAA than he is now, several years later.

Sneeps - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 02:52 PM EDT (#241796) #

Nolin signed for $175k.

Ducey - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 03:04 PM EDT (#241798) #

Re: Fielder:

I am not sure how excited I would be at the Jays spending $100 M for a guy 5'10" and 275 lbs. No doubt he is a terrific hitter but that weight is likely to cause some issues going forward, isn't it?

finch - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 03:24 PM EDT (#241803) #

Two thoughts on Prince Fielder.

1. I believe I recently heard that AA was not too thrilled about paying free agents for what they have done, but what they are going to do. Given Prince's shape, although he'll still be productive, I think he's got 2 or 3 years left in being a stud at 1B. Thus AA won't be handing out a 5 or 6 year + contract to him.

2. If they do sign Prince, they have 2 1st Round picks next year so losing one won't hurt us that much, given we finish in a spot where we would have to give up a first.

I can see the Jays going hard after someone if the compensation is a Comp Pick plus a 2nd rounder.

MatO - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 03:27 PM EDT (#241806) #

Other notes from the GCL game. Jacob Anderson hit his 2nd HR. 27th rounder and Anderson roomie Derek Loveless played his first game. Musgrove continued his recent streak of good performances and excellent control. Dickie Thon, on the other hand, is in a major slump.

TheBunk - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 03:29 PM EDT (#241807) #

John Tolisano hit a lot of homers in the GCL but it was about the only thing of note that he did in his time there. Arce's line destroys Tolisano's.

Ron - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 03:37 PM EDT (#241811) #

Should the Jays sign a 27 year old player who has never been on the DL with a career 142 OPS+? Give me one good reason why the Jays shouldn't at least call Boras to see what his demands are.

finch - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 03:39 PM EDT (#241812) #

Should the Jays sign a 27 year old player who has never been on the DL with a career 142 OPS+? Give me one good reason why the Jays shouldn't at least call Boras to see what his demands are.

Vernon Wells and Alexis Rios just told me there's no reason why not to inquire.

John Northey - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 03:47 PM EDT (#241814) #

Oh, the Jays will ask (as they will for Pujols I'm sure) but odds are Boras will want to soak every last penny for Fielder - as well he should. Still, he could find it a lot more limited market than desired. AA should figure out what Fielder is worth, offer it and keep it open for as long as possible. Once Pujols is signed by someone then things will fall into place quickly I suspect.

James W - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 03:53 PM EDT (#241817) #

I'm not exactly keen on signing Fielder, but neither Wells nor Rios contributed one season of 135 OPS+, let alone a career of it.

jester00 - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 04:03 PM EDT (#241819) #

Rios's average OPS+ from age 23-27 = 105

Well's average OPS+ from age 23-27 = 113

Fielder's average OPS+ from age 23-27 = 151

Rios and Wells shouldn't even be mentioned in the same breath as Fielder. I don't know if the Jays will be kicking the tires on Fielder or not, but they absolutely should be. He is a elite hitter who will likely be worth whatever he is paid, at least for the first 3-5 years of his deal. Plus Rogers is a slighly more friendly hitters park which should help his numbers some.

uglyone - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 04:03 PM EDT (#241820) #

Active Career OPS+

1) A.Pujols (31): 171
2) M.Cabrera (28): 148
3) J.Thome (40): 147
4) L.Berkman (35): 146
5) A.Rodriguez (35): 145
6) R.Braun (27): 144
7) P.Fielder (27): 142
8) J.Giambi (40): 142
9) C.Jones (39): 142
10) V.Guerrero (36): 141

TamRa - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 04:04 PM EDT (#241821) #

I, for one, would FAR rather have Pujols than Fielder...I'd spend as much as $5 mil a year more for Albert. easily.

He's the only free agent, other than Darvish, that I'd make more than a token interest in.

Not that I'm going to whine if we sign Fielder, but it's not something I'm worked up about.

uglyone - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 04:08 PM EDT (#241822) #

Put it this way - Fielder is a better hitter than anyone on the Yanks or RedSox, and younger than pretty much all of them to boot.

Ryan Day - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 04:18 PM EDT (#241824) #

Comparing Wells/Rios to Fielder is kind of silly, as the former had a lot of value tied up in their defence. Fielder doesn't even have a Gold Glove at first, let alone one in centre. (Not that GGs are particularly authoritative, but you get the idea)

Anyway. Fielder is obviously worth big money, but I wouldn't want to give him big years. The standards Superstar Contract is already 6-7 years, and you know Boras is going to want to set a new standard. Fielder already weighs 275 - what's his health picture going to look like in 5-7 years?

Ducey - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 04:23 PM EDT (#241825) #

Fielder has been a great hitter. The point is whether that is likely to continue.

You would think it would, but how many guys at less than 6 ft and close to 300lbs have had long careers?

greenfrog - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 04:38 PM EDT (#241826) #

If Pujols were Fielder's age (27), I would support an all-out campaign to sign him for 8-10 years. But I think paying $200M+ for his declining years is a bit daft. I would also be concerned about giving Fielder a mega-deal (body image issues). Too much risk, in both cases. Those signings would be more JP than AA.

Plus, big, heavy guys in their 30s + artificial turf = injuries.

I think Pujols will get at least an eight-year deal. Fielder will get at least six years.

finch - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 04:50 PM EDT (#241828) #

In terms of comparing Wells/Rios to Fielder, i'm not comparing them in terms of skills but how the long term affects of their contracts and how that worked out for the jays.

TamRa - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 04:55 PM EDT (#241829) #

to be clear, my position was "of the two, which?" - I'm not advocating either.

I am however leaning to the positive view on Darvish.

Ryan Day - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 04:55 PM EDT (#241830) #

Those signings would be more JP than AA.

I don't think we know that to be true yet. Anthopoulos hasn't done much on the FA market yet, so it's impossible to say what he would or wouldn't do. Ricciardi, after all, didn't make a significant FA signing until 2005 - up until the Burnett/Ryan/Thomas deals, all he'd done was sign Corey Koskie and Miguel Batista. Remember, back in the days when everyone still liked him and he was still in the process of dumping the big contracts his predecessor had left.

MrPurple - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 04:56 PM EDT (#241831) #

Well maybe the Jays shot would be stupid money/year over a short 3/4 year contract and see if he bites.

As far as preference of Pujols over Fielder, I would also prefer a Bugatti Veyron over a Dodge Challenger, but I would pretty happy with the Challenger.

Lylemcr - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 05:16 PM EDT (#241835) #

AA loves those draft picks. I cannot see him spending the big bucks to lose those picks.

I also agree with AA that free agency is no way to build a team.

Look at the 2009 free agents... http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2008/11/2009-top-50-fre.html

Outside of Sabathia(and maybe Teixera) , most of the contracts are regretable. I think Crawford, Werth, Dunn and Beltre are going to be regreted

Part of that article notes that the Jays seem to have a "ceiling" at about 70 million. Would you be willing to have Fielder take up 1/3 of our budget?

Another question. How would Bautista feel if we signed Fielder for 20+ million a year? Would he want to renegotiate?

I am not against free agents, just ones that cost 5-6 year contracts. After all, we do not have the Yankees payroll.

Mike Green - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 05:21 PM EDT (#241836) #

If you like the "buying low" theory, Pujols is actually having the worst year of his career at age 31 in his walk year, but there is nothing in the deeper numbers which suggest that he won't bounce back to something close his career norms for a couple of years. He is not striking out significantly more. He still leads the league in homers. And he's still an average defender. You can put him there for 120 games and let him DH for 30-35 while Lind/Cooper or Encarnacion get some playing time, and gradually slide him over to DHing as he ages.

I would rather have Pujols at 35 than Fielder at 31.

Moe - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 05:48 PM EDT (#241840) #

Considering the limited market for Fielder this offseason, he might be open to a short, high $/year contract. Start at 4/25 and throw in a 5th year player option at 20 if that's not enough. That's a lot of money but since the contract runs only for 4 years, it's manageable. It allows Boras/Fielder to be back on the market at 31 in what could be a better situation for him. However, this type of deal might also work for the Brewers.

Dave Rutt - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 06:56 PM EDT (#241844) #

Thanks for posting that article, Gerry. Among other things, I learned that the first syllable of his surname is pronounced "Hetch" -- not "Heck" as I had long assumed.

It should actually be closer to "aitch", but North American broadcasters are unlikely to get quite that close (nor should they, it's painful to hear us gringos try to master Spanish pronunciations).

Richard S.S. - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 07:28 PM EDT (#241846) #

If I am not mistaken, isn't Prince Fielder healthier in his career than most Blue Jays? His Dad, Cecil had a very good career himself. It is time to spend SOME money. Sort of "put up or shut up". He's exactly the big bat A.A. was hoping E.E. would be. IMO it would be foolish to not sign him. We need a GOOD closer, adding Prince would be easy. I would not sign Pujols, I just don't think he'll be heathy enough to justify the expense. It,s hard doing this on an iPhone.

hypobole - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 07:32 PM EDT (#241847) #

Tony LaCava's turn in the MLBTR series on GM candidates. I think there will be some openings in our organization over the next few years as some of the bright minds move on to bigger things.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/08/gm-candidate-tony-lacava.html

Magpie - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 09:29 PM EDT (#241850) #

It should actually be closer to "aitch"

How should the rest of his name sound? I've heard both "Aitch-uh-VAR-ee-uh" and "Aitch-uh-va-REE-uh." (My money's on the second one, but I'm here to learn!)

Marc Hulet - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 09:33 PM EDT (#241851) #

One thing to at least consider with Fielder is that he and his dad do not get along AT ALL. I find it hard to believe he would want to follow in his father's footsteps and come to Toronto (or Detroit, for that matter). It might seem like a little thing but if you were estranged from your family member - and at your own choice - would you suddenly start re-tracing their past?

Dave Rutt - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 10:08 PM EDT (#241854) #

How should the rest of his name sound? I've heard both "Aitch-uh-VAR-ee-uh" and "Aitch-uh-va-REE-uh." (My money's on the second one, but I'm here to learn!)

The general rule is you stress the second last vowel sound (tor-TILL-a, guac-a-MO-le, san-ti-A-go). BUT, I believe the ia should be considered a single vowel sound, in which case the stress should go on the var in Hech's name. Some Spanish words that end in io have an accent on the i (e.g. fr�o, cold), which signifies a vowel that should be emphasized, but others don't (silencio), and as far as I can tell there isn't one on Hech's name. So I believe it's actually the first of your options (with the added caveat that instead of "VAR" it should be more like "VARRRRRRRR").

Mylegacy - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 11:00 PM EDT (#241860) #

A sobering thought...

Tomorrow (Tuesday) we start a 20 game straight, no days off, session. After that we've just 15 more games and the season is over...Man is it ever gonna be tough catching the Yanks and Sox in just 35 games! They better start losing big time!

Hope next year year this time we're a wee bit closer to them. Time for a scotch - a double - single malt naturally.

DaveB - Monday, August 22 2011 @ 11:34 PM EDT (#241863) #

Aaron Sanchez was assigned today to Vancouver, according to MiLB transactions. He's had better control recently and dominated in his last start, Aug. 17 for Bluefield: 5IP, 2H, 1ER, 0BB, 7K, 7GB outs. There's enough left of Vancouver's season for him to get three more starts.

dan gordon - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 12:18 AM EDT (#241867) #

I remember reading an article not too long ago about the performance produced by big-dollar baseball free agents. A lot of big signings have been under performers, and many have been huge busts. In a lot of cases, players have seen big dropoffs in their performance after the signing of the big contract. Some people think this is due to a lack of motivation. Some think it is due to the increased pressure of trying to live up to such a huge contract. Just looking at last year's crop of big time signings and you see Dunn, Crawford and Werth as 3 more guys who have seriously underperformed expectations after signing big contracts. Crawford is a very athletic guy in his prime years. Dunn was as consistent as it gets in the HR department. Yet they both have been big disappointments. As a Giants' fan, I'm certainly very familiar with Barry Zito (and Aaron Rowand for that matter). There are dozens of examples of big contracts turning into big mistakes. Sure, sometimes they work out, but often you end up with a team killing deal. The Jays just got out from under a huge overpriced contract - I still can't believe how lucky they were to get out of that Wells deal - and I'm not too eager to see them enter into another one. I think they should be very careful about trying to land a guy like Fielder.

They need to do something about the pitching for next year. That's where I'd like to see some additions made. Even if it means parsing off some good prospects, as long as they're adding good youngish pitching.

Ron - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 12:48 AM EDT (#241870) #

The difference between Fielder and all the other big name FA's that signed long-term/big money deals is that none of them were 27 years old or younger (besides Adrian Beltre which worked out for the Mariners). Like I mentioned earlier, Fielder has never been on the DL before. The same thing can't be said for almost every other high impact FA. If I was in charge of the Jays, I would have no problem offering Fielder 5 years with a couple of team options attached to it.

dan gordon - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 01:45 AM EDT (#241872) #

The Beltre contract wasn't a great deal for Seattle. If you average out the 5 years, his performance was well below the season he had right before the contract was signed. His numbers were not terrible in Seattle, but I don't think they really got what they hoped for. His next great year after the 2004 season with LA was the 2010 season with Boston.

I read today that Fielder is looking for $200 million, which would be about $25M/year for 8 years, or $28.5M/year for 7 years. You're not going to get him on a 5-year deal plus options. I don't want any part of that kind of stuff for a guy with his body type.

TamRa - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 02:03 AM EDT (#241875) #

TamRa - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 02:06 AM EDT (#241876) #

check that - I had tomorrow listed as an off day but there is a game - so yeah, if he starts tomorrow he can just squeeze in three starts

TamRa - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 02:24 AM EDT (#241877) #

Part of that article notes that the Jays seem to have a "ceiling" at about 70 million.

That's the nonsense part.

John Northey - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 07:12 AM EDT (#241882) #

Fielder can look for $ 200 million but unless someone goes nuts ala Texas with the first giant A-Rod deal I don't see it happening. 5 for $ 125 is far more likely and maybe 5 for $100.

Mike Green - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 08:45 AM EDT (#241885) #

Song of the day. Hmm, there are the obvious ones about the boys returning home- The Boys are Back in Town, Homeward Bound, Home (Edward Sharpe and the Magnetic Zeros), and of course, the Tom Jones classic the Green, Green Turf of Home. Instead, inspired by our discussion of Fielder and Pujols, I'll choose an early Joni Mitchell song about a hometown hero choosing free agency.

Evair Montenegro - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 08:55 AM EDT (#241886) #

How should the rest of his name sound? I've heard both "Aitch-uh-VAR-ee-uh" and "Aitch-uh-va-REE-uh." (My money's on the second one, but I'm here to learn!)

I think it should have an accent in the last "I" but I have seen some articles in spanish that don't have the accent but similar last names in spanish have the accent there so I think it should be the second one unless it have a rare pronunciation.

Kasi - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 09:03 AM EDT (#241888) #

Teixeira got well more than that, and sure he might have a better glove but Fielder has the better bat and is younger than Mark when he signed. Fielder will certainly get more than 125 million. It might be something like 150+ over 7 years, but he'll get a top contract no doubt.

hypobole - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 09:21 AM EDT (#241890) #

Green, Green Turf of Home

I've never heard that rendition. How about the Sam Cooke classic Bring it on Home to Me

MatO - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 09:36 AM EDT (#241892) #

I would rather have Pujols at 35 than Fielder at 31.

I've heard rumours that people think Pujols is a year or two older than listed.

Mike Green - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 09:46 AM EDT (#241894) #

I've heard rumours that Prince is really the King.

sam - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 10:07 AM EDT (#241899) #

You gotta think the floor for Prince is whatever he turned down in Milwaukee. Wasn't it something like 5-125?

Lylemcr - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 10:44 AM EDT (#241904) #

My question is, who are we not going to be able to sign because we sign for Fielder? Bullpen help? Future draftees? Etc. it is not like Blue Jay fans are filling the Skydome.

Denoit - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 12:17 PM EDT (#241926) #

Personally I would much rather see the money spent on

A) Legitimate bullpen help, not retreads that nobody wants as their closer anymore.

B) A legitimate top of the rotation arm. Romero and Morrow are there but another top of the rotation guy could put the team over the top.

If these two things are filled then I would like to think the offence will be ok. As it stands right now the only weak spot in the lineup is 2B, with potential to grow in a lot of areas, specifically CF, 3B, and Catcher.

Denoit - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 12:29 PM EDT (#241928) #

I should rephrase that, I dont think they have to fill these holes through free agency, and therefore may not need to spend much money at all to fill the holes. But I just feel those are more pressing needs for this team than a very expensive middle of the order bat. I have almost come to expect that Anthopolous will blow us away with another major move this offseason to get one step closer to where they need to be. I wouldn't be completly against bringing Feilder in, but it doesn't matter how many runs you score if your bullpen gives up more.

uglyone - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 12:30 PM EDT (#241929) #

Pujols career trajectory - including some stumbling this year - sure makes more sense if he's 2yrs older.

Either way, I wouldn't rather have ANYONE at age 35 instead of Fielder at 31.

electric carrot - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 12:32 PM EDT (#241931) #

I'm with Denoit. I can live with Lind at 1st base -- or some combination of him and Encarcion and Thames rotating through 1b and DH. I want another starting pitcher. I wonder, for example, if Shawn Marcum is available? Or another Brewer, Greinke. I'm not entirely serious about those two in particular but a top of the line pitcher of that ilk or better is the trade I would be concentrating on if I'm Alex.

Ron - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 12:48 PM EDT (#241934) #

According to Fangraphs, Beltre provided a surplus value of 3.3 million during his tenure with the Mariners. His bat was slightly above average and his defense was elite.

Fielder can ask for whatever he wants, he has every right to do that. I have a hard time picturing any club giving him 200 million dollars. If the Jays are serious about winning the World Series, Fielder is exactly the guy they should be targeting. It's not often you're able to get a proven 27 year old elite bat with a clean medical history without giving up anybody from the major league or minor league roster in return. He would be a huge upgrade to the 1B or DH position.

92-93 - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 01:02 PM EDT (#241937) #

But Ron...haven't you seen that bad body? Don't forget the contract's implications in 2017; after all, it was impossible to dump the Rios & Wells contracts.

John Northey - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 01:10 PM EDT (#241939) #

Good point about teams still giving out massive deals. $25 is probable for Fielder over 5 years. Trick is he is so large that many will fear giving 6 or 7 as he'll want.

If AA is creative (and we know he is) then perhaps a 5 year $125 with vesting years after that at $25 per for 3 more based on him playing regularly. IE: if he gets 600 PA in any one season then 1 more year tacked on. 600 in a second, 2 years tacked on. 600 in a third, the full 3 years so he has an 8 year $200 million deal. The Jays never worry about having more than 5 nightmare years (ie: 0 PA and shelling out $25 mil per) and Fielder gets the ability to say he got the first $200 million deal that wasn't an A-Rod deal (until Pujols signs).

Ron - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 01:25 PM EDT (#241941) #

But Ron...haven't you seen that bad body? Don't forget the contract's implications in 2017; after all, it was impossible to dump the Rios & Wells contracts.

Yeah that bad body that has resulted in 0 DL trips. Another reason not to go after Fielder is that the Jays would lose a 1st round pick. My sources tell me the World Series is going to be handed out next season to the team with the best farm system. Wins at the major league level don't count for anything, it's all about the Minors. I also must be delusional to think the Jays should target Fielder considering Paul Beeston has said they can't support a large payroll because Toronto is a small market.

92-93 - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 01:35 PM EDT (#241943) #

Don't forget - you get extra points for winning with a smaller budget...so it makes no sense for the Blue Jays to add talent they can easily afford if there's any possibility it will be a problem down the road (or in otherwords, the Jays can never sign a FA to a multi-year deal). Seriously; it's like people don't even realize this payroll projects to under 60m after all the arbitration raises and WITH Mark Teahen, and that Rogers is pulling in 70m+ from the MLB central fund and revenue sharing alone while they continue to raise your ticket prices.

MatO - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 01:39 PM EDT (#241945) #

But that draft pick has a 20% chance of helping the Jays win the World Series in 2018. You can't just ignore odds like that!

ayjackson - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 02:09 PM EDT (#241949) #

Our three best players - Bautista, Escobar and Romero - are peaking right now. I agree, sarcasm aside, with 92-93 and Ron that we should be moving to add those final pieces in the offseason.

If not, we should think about trading our peaking stars for players who will be peaking in 2014.

Ryan Day - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 02:20 PM EDT (#241952) #

There is not enough sarcasm in this thread.

Jonny German - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 02:24 PM EDT (#241954) #

Exactly.

uglyone - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 02:52 PM EDT (#241965) #

LOLing

TamRa - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 03:19 PM EDT (#241990) #

B) A legitimate top of the rotation arm. Romero and Morrow are there but another top of the rotation guy could put the team over the top.

Who is, exactly, a legitimate top-of-the-rotation starter and among those, who's available?

Let's say CC opts out - are you prepared to give him (speaking of bad bodies) $25 mil or more through his age 28 season?

He's the one who will be on the market, as for the rest"

(you could make a case for any of these, though not all would agree about all of them being "legitimate top of the rotation" depending on what you read into that description)

Doc
Verlander
Beckett
Lincecum
Lee
Hamels
Weaver
Kershaw
Haren
Hernandez
Johnson (injured)

I'm sure there are other good pitchers who could be cited...Price for instance...I was just running down the ERA leader list.

Anyway, the point is that very very very few - if any - of those guys is available. and if you get one you will pay heavily for the honor.

I think - unless you go after Darvish - that expecting to add an imported "top of the rotation" pitcher is a highly unrealistic goal.

Magpie - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 04:01 PM EDT (#242037) #

It's very strange that Lind has hit just 12 doubles this season. He's normally hit more doubles than homers.

Mike Green - Tuesday, August 23 2011 @ 08:47 PM EDT (#242092) #

As greenfrog posted in the other thread, Nestor Molina continued his sensational start in the EL with 5 innings of 2 hit ball, 0 walks and 7 strikeouts. So far this year, he's thrown 124 innings, walked 15 and struck out 139. He threw 81 innings last year and you might wonder how much more work he'll get during the playoffs.

Over his minor league career, Molina is 26-7.

dan gordon - Wednesday, August 24 2011 @ 12:50 AM EDT (#242104) #

Molina has been amazing. An infielder converted to pitching in 2008, and then to starting this year, and look at the kind of games he's now producing at AA, He has moved up the Jays prospect charts a long way this year. We might even see him in Toronto some time next year.

bpoz - Wednesday, August 24 2011 @ 10:21 AM EDT (#242118) #

I believe N Molina has to be added to the 40 Man Roster. I am OK with 1 of Carreno, Farquar & N Molina being the 7th man in the pen in 2012. IMO they are longshots for the rotation, but in the pen they could look good and THEN be considered for the rotation. Marcum did it that way.

Mike Green - Wednesday, August 24 2011 @ 10:37 AM EDT (#242121) #

Anthony Gose had a pretty typical game last night. He reached on a fielding error by the shortstop on a ground ball (that'll happen a lot when the batter runs like the wind) leading off in the first inning, promptly stole second (he's 60-15 on the season) and scored. He later doubled and scored, walked and scored and struck out. The boxscore says 1-4 with a strikeout, which is pretty much his seasonal average, but he did exactly what you want a leadoff hitter to do.

China fan - Wednesday, August 24 2011 @ 10:50 AM EDT (#242126) #

Wojo had another impressive game for Dunedin yesterday: 6 innings, 1 run, 5 strikeouts, no walks. In his past 4 games, he has an ERA of 1.66 and a WHIP of 0.97, including 15 strikeouts and no walks.

Sounds like Wojo is ready for promotion to New Hampshire to join that amazing rotation. I suppose at this point it's more likely that he gets promoted next season, however.

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