Batter's Box Interactive Magazine Batter's Box Interactive Magazine Batter's Box Interactive Magazine
You got a reaction. You got a reaction, didn't you?

Forget the soap opera. This should be a good one. Justin Verlander, who's stumbled badly against the AL East in his last three starts, gets to deal with the Jays' A lineup: Encarnacion's back, Kawasaki is playing second, and Esmil Rogers is on the hill. I am squarely on the Rogers bandwagon. Everybody's welcome to join.

Game Thread — 7/4 vs Detroit | 37 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
uglyone - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 05:15 PM EDT (#275840) #
don't screw this up, kawasaki.

nice to see Miggy out of their lineup. without him, that lineup looks....mediocre.

And we have Ace Esmil on the mound.
BlueJayWay - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 06:05 PM EDT (#275841) #
Can take this one.  Verlander hasn't been his usual stuff, Esmil's pitching well, Tiger's haven't seen him yet, no Cabrera.
Mylegacy - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 07:07 PM EDT (#275844) #
What do I know?

Rogers (ya I know - SSS ALERT) is looking good - not just his results but his stuff and how he uses it. I see him as a possible real find in an otherwise not so fine year. Clearly, in the 2014 rotation.

Dickey - all season I've been on the, "his neck/back/sexlife/goiter/gout is bothering him" bandwagon. It seems he's fixed up at least one or two of those as he's starting to become the Big Dick we thought we were getting. 2014 co-ace with Esmile?

Cecil SHOULD be in the 2014 rotation - period. He is clearly, back - the Terminator had nothing on our Brett.

McGowan should be on - or at the very least least - should be given EVERY CHANCE to be on - the 2014 rotation. I think the kid is back! (A note - way too many of you seem ready to destroy his arm for a "fix" this year - the kid needs to be given the winter and spring to get himself ready for the rotation.)

Johnson better put on his boots - you know the ones that are made for walking - 'cause that's what I want that dude to do - walk off, stage right.

Buehrle - sigh - a sink hole of financial destruction. His contract makes Vernon's look like a minor league deal. At least Wells looked cool - even when stinkin' the joint out. Looks like he's our number 5 guy for far too many years to come. Perhaps - the world's most expensive long relief guy in the pen?

Hutchison - in my mind (if there was a god) a real shot at the 5th starter role in 2014 - IF there wasn't an albatross already signed who's untradeable.

Drabek - IF - he's back it'll be in the pen. Gonna be crowded there next year, n'est pas?

Romero? To paraphrase the Bard - "Romero, oh Romero wherefore art thou..."

Now - how about a 10 man pen in 2014 - no question we've got the arms to man it.


rpriske - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 07:18 PM EDT (#275845) #
So... What's with the pink hats?
rpriske - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 07:46 PM EDT (#275847) #
I really wish they would stop showing that bloody Lone Ranger ad.
Chuck - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 07:51 PM EDT (#275848) #

n'est pas?

That may wash on the west coast. To those of us closer to PQ, it's n'est-ce pas. It's the c in ce that makes the ess sound.

What's with the pink hats?

I think the white caps and red brims are somehow in honour of Uncle Sam. Can't say that I know how.

Chuck - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 07:55 PM EDT (#275849) #
Henderson Alvarez is getting treated badly in his 2013 debut.
Mike Green - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 08:17 PM EDT (#275850) #
More chasing up and down from Lind in both at-bats tonight.  I don't know if it's the bad back or something else.  He definitely at minimum needs to spend considerable time in the video room. 
eudaimon - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 08:20 PM EDT (#275851) #
Too early to worry about Lind, he was bound to have a slump at some point
CeeBee - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 08:20 PM EDT (#275852) #
He appears to have lost his mojo... Hope he finds it soon,and the strike zone.
rpriske - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 08:33 PM EDT (#275853) #
Well, they just explained the ugly hats.

Question... Did mlb celebrate Canada Day in U.S ballparks?
scottt - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 08:46 PM EDT (#275855) #
That would only apply to a team hosting the Jays on Canada Day. I don't remember Toronto not getting the home game recently.
smcs - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 09:54 PM EDT (#275856) #
Casey Janssen pitching in a 9-0 game to get work in is a pretty great reason to get rid of the 8 man pen.
John Northey - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 10:53 PM EDT (#275857) #
Missed the game to go see a movie with my wife (Lone Ranger - fun silly movie, don't think too much and you'll enjoy it). 

Weird that two pitchers were left in for an extra inning and knocked out before getting an out - led to 5 runs.  Can understand why, but unfortunate that they didn't see they were losing it before.  Lind K'ing 3 out of 4 times suggests he could've used a few more days off.  In the end though if the team scores just 1 run you are going to lose 90% of the time.

Alex Obal - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 10:53 PM EDT (#275858) #
So the book is out on Rogers: swing the bat. It'll be interesting to see whether he has to adjust (maybe that actually helps him?), and whether he does.
Paul D - Thursday, July 04 2013 @ 11:32 PM EDT (#275859) #
If one were to look on the bright side, you could say that the Jays just came out of one of the toughest stretches of their season (Bal, TB, BOS, DET) and went 6-8. 
Mike Green - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 11:03 AM EDT (#275861) #
The early returns on the Royals' recent moves are very positive.  Home runs have started to come (whether it is the spirit of Charley Lau in George Brett or something else) and runs are mysteriously being scored.  The bullpen remains strong.  The subtraction of Francouer surprisingly does not seem to have hit the club too hard. 

I expect them to be around in September.

zeppelinkm - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 11:10 AM EDT (#275862) #
Hosmer, from June 1st on, has been a very different Hosmer then the one the Royals had for April and May.
85bluejay - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 11:45 AM EDT (#275863) #
When you have dug the hole the Jays have, there is no bright side in a 6-8 stretch, regardless of the opponents.
Magpie - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 12:11 PM EDT (#275864) #
Too early to worry about Lind

Agreed. We're basically talking about two games. Against Max Scherzer and Justin Verlander.

That said, Lind will certainly go through an extended spell when he looks completely lost at the plate, because that's what baseball players do. The whole thing about Lind is whether his bad spell lasts three weeks or three months.
Mike Green - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 12:21 PM EDT (#275865) #
I don't agree.  Lind has had a 3 year spell of poor performance, and seemed to have a new approach this year which he was employing against RHPs throwing 93-95 mph fastballs up (laying off).  He's not sticking with the new approach right now.  An honest expectation of what he is likely to do going forward is much closer to his career line than to his seasonal line this year.  ZIPS (R) has him at .276/.331/.470, which is probably fair.  It also makes him only really useful as a platoon player.  So far this year, Lind is hitting .348/.348/.478 against LHP with a 0/13 W/K in 46 PAs.  He's only hitting decently courtesy of a .469 BABIP. 
China fan - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 01:25 PM EDT (#275866) #
"....Casey Janssen pitching in a 9-0 game to get work in is a pretty great reason to get rid of the 8 man pen...."

Wouldn't have mattered if it was a 7-man pen or a 6-man pen. He wasn't pitching often enough because there weren't very many Jays leads for him to protect in the 9th inning. Blame the hitters and starters, not the size of the pen.
Paul D - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 01:45 PM EDT (#275867) #
CF, he would have pitched in an earlier game in this series (Say the Tuesday game that the Jays lost by one run) with a smaller bullpen.
Mike Green - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 02:00 PM EDT (#275868) #
Correction: Janssen could have pitched in Tuesday's game more usefully.  Conventional usage now would not entail a closer coming into a game on 1 day rest down a run (Janssen had pitched on Sunday), whether the team is running a 6 man pen, a 7 man pen or an 8 man pen.  There are two problems at work, the size of the pen and the strictures of conventional usage.
smcs - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 03:24 PM EDT (#275869) #
(Janssen had pitched on Sunday)

He threw 2 pitches.
John Northey - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 03:40 PM EDT (#275870) #
2 pitches or 200 and the manager still won't bring him in without a lead unless he is desperate or the closer needs work or on the road in extras (no save possible then).
Mike Green - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 03:52 PM EDT (#275871) #
Almost, John N.  The conventional closer role includes 9th inning (or extras) of a tie game at home.  On the road, the closer doesn't come in unless the club has a lead of 3 runs or less or he needs work. 

Incidentally, bullpen WPA is a pretty good measure of overall effectiveness of the crew.  The Jays stand 4th in the major leagues at 4.28, well behind the Rangers and Pirates who are about 7 and the Yankees at 5. 

Intricated - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 03:56 PM EDT (#275872) #
Wang back in AAA, now for Buffalo.  Guess he feels with how the remainder of the ML rotation is performing, he may get another shot with the Jays.

And interesting (to me), 5 of the 11 players in DFA status are former Jays (Olivo barely counts).  Speaking of former (ML-experienced) Jays:

Doing good: Jason Frasor (consistently good), Yan Gomes (130 OPS+)

Doing ok: Carlos Villanueva (since being moved to the bullpen, flamed out as a starter), Kelly Johnson (hot start, pretty bad since Jun 1), Mike Aviles (90 OPS+ playing mostly SS, but better than all Jays infielders not named Reyes), Yunel Escobar (91 OPS+, not worth his 5M price tag, even if drama-free)

Stunk in ML: Brandon Lyon (inconsistent throughout the year), Jeff Mathis (171/263/357, but that's due to a recent 3-game stretch; without it, he's been Thole with more pop), Adeiny Hechavarria (56 OPS+ through 70 games, with 2 of his 2 HRs and 10 of his 21 RBIs from just 2 games), John Buck (hot start has regressed back to career norms; 81 OPS+), Casper Wells (might have a career as a relief pitcher though...), Henry Blanco (GS in Seattle debut, but pretty much the same as we saw in T.O... still better than Thole)

Stuck in AAA: Scott Richmond, Aaron Laffey, Eli Whiteside, Bobby Wilson

Barely played: Henderson Alvarez (season debut yesterday)

Special Mention: Sam Dyson (doing pretty good in AA as a starter)

Miss any of them?
Chuck - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 04:02 PM EDT (#275873) #
Brandon Lyon (inconsistent throughout the year)

And now DFA'd.
Mike Green - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 04:06 PM EDT (#275874) #
Yunel Escobar (91 OPS+, not worth his 5M price tag, even if drama-free)

Whoa.  Yunel is a fine-fielding shortstop and has been for years.  When he hits like he has this year, he's worth more than $5 million in half a year.  There are reasons the Rays seem to be in the playoff hunt with a low payroll year after year.  One of them is acquisitions like this one.
92-93 - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 04:10 PM EDT (#275875) #
In 64 games since April 20th, Yunel Escobar is hitting .285/.346/.421 with solid defense.
Chuck - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 04:23 PM EDT (#275876) #
Agreed re Escobar. He may rub many the wrong way, myself included, but he is en route for a 3-4 win season which is worth FAR more than a mere $5M.
John Northey - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 05:22 PM EDT (#275877) #
Funny how many here (myself included) hoped the Jays would resign Lyon, especially when he was so cheap ($750k).  Weird how much he declined in NY.

K/9: Jays 10.1, Mets 6.0
H/9: Jays 6.8, Mets 11.3

That pretty much explains it there.  H/9 skyrocket, K/9 dropped like a stone.  Changes BB/9 and HR/9 were minimal while ERA jumped by 2. Would it make sense to send Wagner down and put Lyon in that slot for awhile?  Lyon's WPA is positive for 23 games, 0 for 2, and negative 12 times (negative 32%, positive 62%).  Wagner is positive 15 times, negative 4 times (negative 21%, positive 79%).  Wagner BB/9 3.2 K/9 5.9 HR/9 1.1 vs Lyon 3.4 BB/9 6.0 K/9 0.8 HR/9.  Tempting as Lyon has a better history.  Of course, that lands under 'very marginal improvement' but better is better.

hypobole - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 06:21 PM EDT (#275878) #
Look at quality of competition. No Orioles, Tigers, Red Sox in NL. Get to face the Marlins a bunch of times.
John Northey - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 06:42 PM EDT (#275881) #
Good point hypobole, he did face the Marlins 7 times, 6 1/3 IP 10 hits, 1 R/ER, 2BB 4 SO.  Geez, that Met defense must be pretty bad.  He also threw 1 IP vs NYY (1 H 0 R).  Atlanta got to him (4 ER in 5 2/3), as did the Dodgers (3 ER in 1 2/3) and Nationals (4 IP 7 ER). 

I don't see Lyon as a priority by any stretch.  Just a 'nice to have' with Wagner moving back to AAA for depth.  Lyon has been good before, as recently as the last half of last year with the Jays.  Wagner, on the other hand, has been a career minor leaguer so both carry risk but neither is more than a 4th to 8th on this teams'  bullpen.

Ryan Day - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 07:03 PM EDT (#275882) #
I don't see Lyon being much of an improvement, since he's just another short RHP reliever. I'd be more inclined to bring up Lincoln to replace Wagner, as he's shown he can be useful in multi-inning outings.
Intricated - Friday, July 05 2013 @ 10:55 PM EDT (#275887) #
I should clarify: Escobar's 2013 on-field performance to-date (and corresponding 5M salary), which is valuable to Tampa Bay, and likely many other teams, but is not worth having for the Blue Jays organization, even if he did nothing this season to draw ire of his off-field (sorta) behaviour.  That's just how bad I feel that eye black blunder was... but it's good to see him doing well (and drama-free)... somewhere else (even if it's the Rays).

Game Thread — 7/4 vs Detroit | 37 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.