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Due to scheduling changes caused by hurricane, today's sceduled off-day has been moved to Thursday. It seems that TSN, which was to broadcast the 3-game set in New York, will not pick up tonight's game. My Extra Innings package lists the game as being available - let's hope that holds up.

Gustavo Chacin, the lefthander who tore up the Eastern League in the second half and thus did more than any other Blue Jays farmhand to improve his stock since mid-season, will get the difficult starting assignment.

Game 150: Final Road Trip of 2004 Begins | 266 comments | Create New Account
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_CaramonLS - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 06:46 PM EDT (#34122) #
This really sucks - I wanted to see Chacin pitch.
_Fozzy - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 06:47 PM EDT (#34123) #
Is tonight's game on the Fan?
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 06:56 PM EDT (#34124) #
Is tonight's game on the Fan?

Radio? As always, I presume.
_Smack - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 06:57 PM EDT (#34125) #
Should be, no one likes McCowan and his uninformed opinions.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:06 PM EDT (#34126) #
Bob McCown is only on from 4-7, so he doesn't lose any time out of his show for baseball...except when the Jays have a 1:00 weekday start and it goes long.

Boy, is he ever mad when that happens.
_Mark J - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:09 PM EDT (#34127) #
The YES broadcast seems to be working fine on Extra Innings. Now, to exercise the MUTE button on my remote control.
Dave Till - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:10 PM EDT (#34128) #
This is apparently the first time in baseball history that an all-Venezuelan battery is taking the field: Chacin and Quiroz are both from Venezuela.
Dave Till - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:11 PM EDT (#34129) #
Yay, Russ!
_JackFoley - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:12 PM EDT (#34130) #
Way to go not crappy Adams!
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:12 PM EDT (#34131) #
We need a Russ Adams HR cheer.

1-0!
Pistol - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:12 PM EDT (#34132) #
Russ is growing into his man strength!

He now has 200% more HRs than Rios......
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:13 PM EDT (#34133) #
Sorry to use math, Pistol, but he has 100% more HRs than Rios.
But yeah, good job Adams!
_Tassle - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:14 PM EDT (#34134) #
Russ Adams is really having a callup to remember. This is only going to do wonders for his confidence going into next season. I can't wait to see what he's going to become.
_Tassle - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:15 PM EDT (#34135) #
On an unrelated note, I'd kill to be able to see Gus. So throw some names out there and I'll see what I can do.
_Curtis Dixon - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:16 PM EDT (#34136) #
I'm watching the YES feed on MLB Extra Innings. While I do enjoy the Fan's broadcast (I get it on Rogers Digital out here in NB), it is kind of neat to hear a different perspective on the Jays. Calling the game for YES are Jim Kaat and Ken Singleton. Should be interesting. They must have the media guide handy, they knew quite a bit about Russ Adams.
_Dr. Zarco - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:16 PM EDT (#34137) #
Nice bit of hitting by Delgado. Lofton should have had 2 errors on that play.
_Curtis Dixon - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:18 PM EDT (#34138) #
Looks as though Chacin is bald. It just hit me that I really don't know what most of the AA looks like.
_Ryan01 - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:23 PM EDT (#34139) #
They must have the media guide handy, they knew quite a bit about Russ Adams.

Ken Singleton's son Justin was Adams' teammate last year at New Haven so he's probably picked up a few things about the Jays prospects following his son. Be sure to let us know any interesting tidbits that Singleton has on Chacin and League, two of Justin's teammates this year on the Eastern League champion Fisher Cats.
_Tassle - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:25 PM EDT (#34140) #
Ugh. Gus is having some trouble finding the strike zone. 8 Balls, 3 strikes.
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:26 PM EDT (#34141) #
Jerry Garvin!
_Dr. Zarco - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:27 PM EDT (#34142) #
Nice play by Chacin coming off the mound. He appears to have quite a long delivery to home. It seemed like Jeter could have taken off if he wanted. Anyone know if Gus has any kind of decent pickoff move?
_R Billie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:28 PM EDT (#34143) #
Technically, Gus has a full count groundout and a 3-1 walk. So he can't have any more than 7 balls.

Gus comes back to get ahead of Bernie Williams 0-2 and then a very slowly chopper that Chacin fields and throws low to first dug out by Delgado. 2 away with Rodriguez going to second base.
_Dr. Zarco - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:28 PM EDT (#34144) #
Whoops, Jeter=ARod
_Tassle - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:29 PM EDT (#34145) #
Yeah, I realized that, I just didn't think it deserved a post to correct it.

Strikes him out!
_Jim - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:29 PM EDT (#34146) #
Singleton said that the players watched a lot of YES network when they were in New Haven, but this year in New Hampshire it was all Red Sox.

Is that interesting? I didn't think so either :).
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:29 PM EDT (#34147) #
Dr Zarco - assuming you're watching this game, on some broadcast outlet not available to me? (I'm answering Jerry's trivia questions.)

Who does Chacin look like? Full and colourful descriptions, if you please!
_R Billie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:30 PM EDT (#34148) #
Swing and a miss strike three on Matsui. Chacin allows two groundouts, a walk, and a strikeout in his first major league inning.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:32 PM EDT (#34149) #
Can anyone actually see Chacin? Anyone with Extra Innings or MLB.TV?

I would gladly join forces with Tassle and murder someone for the opportunity to watch this game.
_Dr. Zarco - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:39 PM EDT (#34150) #
Well physically I was a bit surprised. They first showed him without his hat and he's got this big bald head and it seems like his features are all scrunched in a small area on his face. Sorry...a rather odd observation. He's wearing #39...like the Dominator for my Sabres back in the day. He throws kind of side armed, nothing like the over-the-top Lilly. But he's more burly that I expected. He has the build of a...hmmm, Glendon Rusch? First lefty that popped into my mind.

As for pitching-wise, he's throwing his fastball at 91ish. Like most lefties, it doesn't look particularly straight. He seemed nervous there going 7 balls to 3 strikes in the beginning, but he's looked good. Spotted a few fastballs on the outer corner, blew one by Matsui. I'm encouraged.

The question becomes...Is there anything Chacin can do this September to earn a spot next year?
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:40 PM EDT (#34151) #
On the Boston broadcast... there she is...

Its Hazel Mae!

Treason. Treason, I tell ya...
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:41 PM EDT (#34152) #
Thanks Doc.

Doc?

Whatever! :-)
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:41 PM EDT (#34153) #
Yeah.. Hazel's been admiring Boston and the Red Sox from afar. Traitor!
_Dr. Zarco - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:42 PM EDT (#34154) #
During his delivery, Chacin kinda brings his hand down behind his back and bends his wrist the way Zito does. That's fairly hard to describe...

Nice turn by Hinske/Hudson!
_Dr. Zarco - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:44 PM EDT (#34155) #
Haha, sure Magpie, whatever works. Sweet catch by Hudson. He'd better win the gold glove.
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:44 PM EDT (#34156) #
The sons of Sam Horn are excited about the "Hazel Mae mojo" she's bringing to the game.

They did win, what 25 of 30. And I'm sure she helped more than Terry Adams.
_R Billie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:45 PM EDT (#34157) #
Second inning for Gus. Leadoff single Posada, 5-4-3 doubleplay Sierra, Hudson a diving linedrive catch off Olerud.
_gid - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:47 PM EDT (#34158) #
I'm a little surprised to see A-Rod batting 2nd. I would have thought he would be 4th (or maybe 3rd with Sheffield out of action) and maybe Matsui 2nd. I guess I'm using conventional "put your best power hitter 4th" logic.. somebody help me understand Torre's thinking.
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:50 PM EDT (#34159) #
Torre has always been a manager who plays hunches, rides hot hands, and juggles if he can. He doesn't do it as much with the Yankees. But really, he just shook things up, tried this lineup (Jeter 1st and ARod 2nd) and the team started winning agasin. So he's riding it...
_R Billie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:55 PM EDT (#34160) #
Batting order really doesn't matter that much where moving a hitter one or two places in the lineup has a dramatic effect. Especially over as small a sample as one game.
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:57 PM EDT (#34161) #
Hey, does anyone know where the heck Gustavo Chacin's eyebrows are?
_Dr. Zarco - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:58 PM EDT (#34162) #
Maybe that's why he looks a little funny! I couldn't place it...
_Curtis Dixon - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 07:59 PM EDT (#34163) #
Seems to me I've read (on a a sabermetric board) that putting your best hitter second maximizes his value. Not that I think Torre is operating with that logic. Anyhow, I noticed he batted second over the weekend against Boston, so maybe this is permanent.
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:00 PM EDT (#34164) #
After a shaky start, Chacin has located well. He struck out Matsui on a great sequence and had given up a few line drives which were caught. Posada's single wasn't hit hard at all, but snuck through the 3-S hole.

Adams just airmalied a routine grounder for a 2-base error.
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:00 PM EDT (#34165) #
Sheesh, somebody tell Russ that he's allowed to set his feet and throw when he's fielding a grounder.

Shake it off kid.
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:05 PM EDT (#34166) #
Wow, I'm impressed.

Gus "Goony Goo-Goo" Chacin goes right after A-Rod and K's him on 4 pitches.

He's been impressive so far.
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:05 PM EDT (#34167) #
Chacin throws an 0-2 straight change right over the middle of the plate - that takes guts - and strikes A-Rod out.
_R Billie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:06 PM EDT (#34168) #
Swing and a miss, down goes A-Rod on a high fastball! A line out, ground out, 2 base error, then a strikeout in Chacin's third inning. Best of all, just 36 pitches through 3 innings against a tough Yankee lineup. He's not dominating but he's holding his own.
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:06 PM EDT (#34169) #
Jeter? A. Rod?

No sweat...

Meanwhile, Tim Wakefield hits a batter, walks a couple, and gets tagged by BJ Surhoff for a GS.

Cool.
_Jim - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:08 PM EDT (#34170) #
A-Rod ended up second because of his success in that slot in Seattle.
Torre wanted Sheff to protect him without moving Sheffield from the third slot.
_Curtis Dixon - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:10 PM EDT (#34171) #
Singleton & Kaat are hilarious. They just commented that had Bo Jackson not suffered a football injury, he could haver been the best baseball player of his era. ROFL.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:10 PM EDT (#34172) #
Hmm..which line is better through three innings?

Chacin: 3 IP, 1 H, 0 R, 0 ER, 1 BB, 2 K, 0.00 ERA
or
Toronto 2, NY Yankees 0

Close call.
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:19 PM EDT (#34173) #
Curtis, I don't think Singleton and Kaat are too far off. Bo Jackson is probably the best athlete I've ever seen, and it's not as if he was just doing some Deion Sanders-like stunt... he could flat out play.

Who knows, if Shannon Stewart never sustains a football injury in high school, maybe he's one of the better defensive outfielders in the game right now... he might have actually been able to play some right field.
Named For Hank - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:20 PM EDT (#34174) #
I'd love to be watching Chacin's debut, too, but I decided I'd have a nice old-fashioned lie down in the backyard listening to the radio.

Until my neighbor decided to start using his powersaw to cut something into pieces. So now I'm indoors.

So far the jersey I bought yesterday seems like good luck!
_Ron - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:20 PM EDT (#34175) #
Can't believe this game isn't on TSN or Sportsnet. What a shame.

I enjoy watching the kids play. We got Adams, Rios, Quiroz, and Gross playing. Chacin is pitching. League is in the bullpen with Crozier on the bench.

I can't believe I see boxing on Sportsnet. Arghh.....
_R Billie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:22 PM EDT (#34176) #
Sit down Posada and Williams. That's a doubleplay. 4 shutout innings for Gus.
_Jim - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:23 PM EDT (#34177) #
'Singleton & Kaat are hilarious. They just commented that had Bo Jackson not suffered a football injury, he could haver been the best baseball player of his era. ROFL.'

They said he could have been the most complete player.
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:23 PM EDT (#34178) #
Chacin is now a strike machine. Jim Kaat was commenting on Chacin's delivery - he throws the glove out in front before the pitching arm comes through. Kaat noted that that's the way most pitchers did it in the old days.

A sharp grounder up the middle was slowed enough by the grass to be turned into a routine inning-ending DP.

2-0 Jays through 4.
_R Billie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:24 PM EDT (#34179) #
I think it's a bit strange that Menechino is DHing against the righty instead of Crozier. I was trying to figure out who the lefty bat was that wasn't playing and I couldn't think of who it was...now I remember it's Crozier.
Named For Hank - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:25 PM EDT (#34180) #
Can't blame Sportsnet for this, Ron -- TSN owns the rights to the three Yankee games. Because of the scheduling change, they couldn't get a crew there a day early to broadcast this game and they were either unable or unwilling to pick up the YES feed and run that. So if you want to be annoyed at someone, pick on TSN.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:26 PM EDT (#34181) #
Yay! Chuck Steiner! Yankee homerism is just what the Jays' radio broadcast needs.
_Tassle - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:27 PM EDT (#34182) #
Vernon's all the way back. I honestly can't WAIT to see him next season. I'm predicting a big time breakout, beyond even his numbers last year. Anyone noticed that his walk rate has been spiking upwards the last 3 years? If he fully matures as a hitter and regains his power from last year, he's Carlos Delgado the Center Fielder.
_Fozzy - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:28 PM EDT (#34183) #
When anyone else listens to Charlie Steiner, do you picture Mr. Wendy, unofficial spokesman?
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:29 PM EDT (#34184) #
Bo Jackson was, beyond doubt, the greatest athlete I have ever seen. And I saw him do things on a baseball diamond I have never seen anyone else do.

I once saw him hit a ball at the old Ex that left the yard like Tiger hitting it off the first tee. I have never seen a ball get out of a ball park so fast in my life. It didn't even look like a baseball anymore.

I saw him hit a routine ground ball single to straight away centre, and slide into second before Moseby could get the ball back into the field.

Nevertheless, he was just a good baseball player. Amazing tools. But John Kruk (I aint no athlete, lady) was a better baseball player. The fundamental skill in the game (for non-pitchers) is the ability to track a moving object in flight. Bo did not have that gift, or at least not to the degree that Kruk had it.

Great rundown in the Red Sox game, which they messed up after at least six throws, allowing the run to score...
_Smack - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:31 PM EDT (#34185) #
If you have heard Steiner call a Yanks-Jays game, he is more concerned with how Boston is faring, rather than if the Yankee's can come back against the Jays. What's strange is he keeps agreeing to call a few innings on the Fan network.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:32 PM EDT (#34186) #
Nice one, Fozzy.

All right, Rios!

What happened? Steiner is just going nuts over the Lofton catch.

(Whoa, three separate thoughts there.)
Named For Hank - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:32 PM EDT (#34187) #
Hey, Extra Inningsers, why is Gibby out to dispute the call?
_Smack - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:33 PM EDT (#34188) #
Am I listening to the Yes! network?
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:33 PM EDT (#34189) #
Hinske hit a sinking liner to right that Lofton just caught (looked initially like a trap), then Rios was called out at first because the umpire thought the throw in beat him. Replay showed clearly that Rios was back in safely.
_Dr. Zarco - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:33 PM EDT (#34190) #
What a terrible call. Rios was safe by a bit. His straight leg had already hit the bag and begun to bend by the time Olerud caught it. Nice catch by Lofton though.
Named For Hank - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:33 PM EDT (#34191) #
When anyone else listens to Charlie Steiner, do you picture Mr. Wendy, unofficial spokesman?

Geez, I do now, Foz.
Named For Hank - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:35 PM EDT (#34192) #
HOORAY FOR SUPERVERNON!

Chacin is buying him a steak or two tonight.
_Dr. Zarco - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:35 PM EDT (#34193) #
Whoops, Lofton didn't even catch the ball. Double bad call.
_Fozzy - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:36 PM EDT (#34194) #
In yo' face Mr. Wendy Steiner! Great catch Wells!
_Blue in SK - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:37 PM EDT (#34195) #
Am i reading that right? Vasquez 94 pitches, Chacin 56.
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:37 PM EDT (#34196) #
Go Vernon!

Watch out for this on the highlights tonight. Palmeiro batting, runners on 2 and 3. He walks. Mora, thinking the bases are loaded, starts trotting home. Oops.

Then the Red Sox screw up the run down (Millar, covering home, makes a bad throw to Mirabelli who by now was covering home. Mirabelli then picks it up and throws it away.)

And you all thought Tampa at Toronto on Sunday was sloppy!
Named For Hank - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:38 PM EDT (#34197) #
I'm picturing him with a burger in his hands, Foz. I can't get it out of my head.

My God, I'll never take him seriously again.

Okay, the saw has stopped in my neighbor's yard, so I'm headed back outside with my radio.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:38 PM EDT (#34198) #
I am laughing all over right now:
"IT IS BACK! IT IS AT THE WALL...and caught." Then he moves right on to the next batter.

So the Yankees got bad two calls their way at home? Wow, alert CNN! Breaking news! ;)

Wow, in the time it took me to type that, Chacin dealt a 1-2-3 inning.
_JackFoley - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:38 PM EDT (#34199) #
The Yankees radio broadcaster (sorry I don't know his name---not Steiner) said that the Yankees got lucky on both ends of that double play---tgat Lofton trapped the ball and Rios beat the throw back to the bag.
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:38 PM EDT (#34200) #
Make that "Mirabelli who by now was covering third."
_JackFoley - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:39 PM EDT (#34201) #
That, even.

What a flood of posts!
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:39 PM EDT (#34202) #
Very nice play by Hinske on a grounder he had to come in on; the batter was hustling out of the box. Three up three down in the Yankees 5th.

Chacin's hitch was the topic of discussion. In the windup he has something that looks like a hesitation or false-start at the beginning of his delivery.
_Tassle - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:40 PM EDT (#34203) #
Man, is it wrong that I love Melvin Mora? He seems exactly like Manny Ramirez, another guy I love: Laid back, loves having fun, makes the occasional mistake but ends up making it right anyways, and to top it off, they're both fantastic ball players. Anyone see the clip of him taking the foam finger from the kid and playing around with him? That is what I love. Does it say something about my personality that these are some of my favourite players?
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:42 PM EDT (#34204) #
Hey, forget Bat-girl's Santana-Nathan '04 campaign, how about:

and ?
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:42 PM EDT (#34205) #
I thought Lofton caught it - it seemed like the webbing of the glove was on the ground and the ball fell into it. I only saw one angle on the replay.
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:43 PM EDT (#34206) #
That Brandon League is one skinny dude.

Chacin... not so much.
_Fozzy - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:47 PM EDT (#34207) #
Rob, I might add an Adam Peterson to that list as well.
_Fozzy - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:51 PM EDT (#34208) #
Hmm, my internet feed to the fan590 has crapped out.
_greenfrog - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:51 PM EDT (#34209) #
I would love to watch Chacin pitch a few frames. What a huge game for this kid.

Anyone get a reading on his fastball? Is he cracking 90? How does his stuff look?
_Fozzy - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:52 PM EDT (#34210) #
Ah, there we go. That was a quiet 7 minutes
_ScottS - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:52 PM EDT (#34211) #
Hmm, my internet feed to the fan590 has crapped out.

Mine too...

Wait, now it's back!
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:53 PM EDT (#34212) #
From watching "Goony Goo Goo" Chacin, does his delivery remind anyone else of David Wells' delivery?

Same ball-hiding technique and odd leg kick and everything.
Pistol - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:54 PM EDT (#34213) #
Anyone get a reading on his fastball? Is he cracking 90?

The YES network gun has him consistently at 90-91.
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:56 PM EDT (#34214) #
Anyone know what pitches Gus throws?

I've only seen the fastball which has registered consistently at 90-91 MPH, and a pitch (cutter?) that keeps registering at 84 MPH.

Other than that, I haven't seen a curveball or a slider or anything like that. Am I just an oblivious idiot or is Gus just a 2-3 pitch pitcher?
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:56 PM EDT (#34215) #
If you're going to give up a run, might as well get a couple of outs while you're at it....
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:56 PM EDT (#34216) #
OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WHAT A PLAY BY ERIC HINSKE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

THAT'S ONE OF THE BEST PLAYS ERIC'S EVER MADE!!!!
Pistol - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:57 PM EDT (#34217) #
No more balls hit up the middle!

Hudson must have been shaded because it seemed like ARod had a sure single.

And now Hinske with a stellar defensive play? Oh my!

Ok, what paper is going to have the 'Chacin but not heard' headline?
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:58 PM EDT (#34218) #
Is it just me, or does League look really cool in that picture?

Rob, I might add an Adam Peterson to that list as well.
Couldn't find his picture, but here are McGowan and Vermilyea (and David Purcey, just for fun):


Out of town: If Minnesota wins tonight, they clinch. In Chicago. How sweet that would be. They're up 5-0 in the 4th.

Those radio ads for "The Score" are pretty blatant, aren't they?
Mike D - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:58 PM EDT (#34219) #
Or "Must Be Chacin To Be Believed"?
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 08:59 PM EDT (#34220) #
Hinske makes a great play - a play he would not have made early this year. Bernie hits a tapper that Eric has to run in on, barehand and fire in one motion. The previous batter, A-Rod, hit a tailor made DP up the middle in a first and third no out situation. 3-1 Jays after 6.
_Ryan01 - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:00 PM EDT (#34221) #
Chacin's repetoire is mainly the fastball, change, cutter. He does have a slider but it hasn't been a particularly strong pitch for him in the past.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:00 PM EDT (#34222) #
"Chacin The Future, and The Future Is Good."
_greenfrog - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:00 PM EDT (#34223) #
How about Chacin It, Better Believe It
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:01 PM EDT (#34224) #
Anybody have visuals of Zach Jackson while we're at it.

Liam says he looks a little like Matt LeBlanc except his face isn't as round?
_IainS - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:01 PM EDT (#34225) #
I find this very encouraging:

Groundouts - Flyouts: Chacin 12 - 4
Thomas - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:02 PM EDT (#34226) #
Not being able to watch this game is killing me.
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:03 PM EDT (#34227) #
I think Chacin's been going fastball, cutter and perhaps mixing in a straight change. I'm sure he has another pitch, maye he hasn't shown it tonight.
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:05 PM EDT (#34228) #
Hudson doubles to deep centre. Delgado IW'ed. Rios falls behind but hits a sharp grounder down the line which A-Rod snags. He can only get the force at second, however, and Hudson scores to make it 4-1. Exit Javier Vazquez.
Mike Green - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:07 PM EDT (#34229) #
http://mirrorimageorigin.collegepublisher.com/media/paper657/stills/2zwdbi18.jpg
Magpie, COMN for a picture of Zach Jack in mid-delivery.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:10 PM EDT (#34230) #
Zach Jackson, I believe:
_Smack - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:10 PM EDT (#34231) #
What is everyone's fascination with the looks of the players? We're not in the business of selling jeans here!

And does the fan590 feed always crap out like this?
_Jim - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:11 PM EDT (#34232) #
Wells was the first comp that came to mind for me with Chacin.
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:11 PM EDT (#34233) #
Zach Jack in mid-delivery.

My God. He does look like Joey.

A little bit... :-)
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:12 PM EDT (#34234) #
Jackson vs. Joey:


I apologize for the pictures in the thread. It probably slows down the refreshing rate.
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:13 PM EDT (#34235) #
What is everyone's fascination with the looks of the players?

Well, we already know what Hazel looks like.
Thomas - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:13 PM EDT (#34236) #
Delgado got a generous smattering of boos when he ran out after the 7th inning stretch.
_Smack - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:15 PM EDT (#34237) #
But why would God Bless America be played in Toronto? Or in any baseball stadium.
Thomas - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:19 PM EDT (#34238) #
Another solid inning by Chacin. 3-up, 3-down.
_Prisoner of Ham - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:20 PM EDT (#34239) #
As a newcomer to your precincts, may I humbly offer "Machine" as a suitable nickname for Chacin.
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:20 PM EDT (#34240) #
Posada was fooled by a lovely ankle-high change-up for strike two but battled to a 3-2 count. I was willing Chacin to throw the fastball, as I was ceratin Posada would lay off the change and draw the walk. Posada flied to right-centre for the second out. Chacin then easily took care of Sierra, who popped to short for the final out.

Beautiful, artful pitching tonight.
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:23 PM EDT (#34241) #
Anybody who's seen Eddie Murphy's "Delirious" from back in the day knows that "Goony Goo Goo" is the proper nickname for Gus Chacin.
_Braby21 - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:27 PM EDT (#34242) #
But why would God Bless America be played in Toronto? Or in any baseball stadium.

The game's in NY tonight. They play it in NY to honour the USA after the 9/11 attacks. Not too sure if they play it anywhere else.
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:30 PM EDT (#34243) #
If we don't score now, this kitten will die.

_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:31 PM EDT (#34244) #
Hey!

It worked!!
_Prisoner of Ham - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:31 PM EDT (#34245) #
Sigh.
_Jordan - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:31 PM EDT (#34246) #
Russ Adams frickin' rules.
_R Billie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:31 PM EDT (#34247) #
You go RAdams!
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:31 PM EDT (#34248) #
"Up the middle, past a diving Jeter..."
_Jordan - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:32 PM EDT (#34249) #
may I humbly offer "Machine" as a suitable nickname for Chacin.


As does this.
Thomas - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:32 PM EDT (#34250) #
"....past a diving Jeter...."

Music to my ears. Hats off to Adams on a fine night at the plate.
_Tassle - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:32 PM EDT (#34251) #
Someone think of something witty to say connecting Russ Adams and pussy (Saves the kitten). Quickly.
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:32 PM EDT (#34252) #
Q: What do you call a grounder to Derek Jeter's left?

A: Base hit up the middle.

(And yes, the joke was stolen, likely from here.)
_Dr. Zarco - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:33 PM EDT (#34253) #
This game is so encouraging. It's fun to watch all these rookies do so well. What a great sign for next year (and beyond)!! I hope the kids keep it up.
Mike Green - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:33 PM EDT (#34254) #
Hey, Calvin Pickering fans. Calvin has had a big night- double, homer and 2 walks in 4 trips to raise his season numbers to .259/.375/.536. Just about as one might have guessed.

Back to the main event.
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:34 PM EDT (#34255) #
Drawn in infield will sometimes bite you in the a**. Torre uses it more than any other manager I can recall.
_Smack - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:34 PM EDT (#34256) #
My apologies, I knew that the game was in NY, but I swear I heard Steiner say, "What a beautiful day in Toronto.", but then again, I should have realized he could not have possibly complemented a city other than New York.

Whoa Quantrill hasn't been able to force grounders like in the past.
This is where low strikeout totals hurt in key situations.

Anyone besides me think Brad Lidge is a better closer than either of the guys he set up for? His stuff is nasty and he has a rubber arm to go with his great mentality.
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:37 PM EDT (#34257) #
Does Torre know Carlos has 4 HR in 15 AB against Nitkowski?

That's all he has against him, but still...
_Tassle - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:37 PM EDT (#34258) #
Anyone besides me think Brad Lidge is a better closer than either of the guys he set up for?

He's probably close to the raw stuff of Billy Wagner before elbow surgery.
_Braby21 - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:41 PM EDT (#34259) #
Did anyone know that Billy Wagner is a born right hander. He blew out his arm so learned how to throw left handed by throwing buckets at his farm. I don't have a source or anything to back it up but I play intercounty baseball and one of my import teammates from Texas told me this.
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:42 PM EDT (#34260) #
With the lead being 6-1 right now, I think it wouldn't be a bad time to bring in League for his ML Debut.
Named For Hank - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:43 PM EDT (#34261) #
And does the fan590 feed always crap out like this?

I thought the Fan's internet feed was supposed to be blacked out for MLB games? It usually is.
_Braby21 - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:43 PM EDT (#34262) #
I found a quote from Billy.

"I'm right handed but pitch left-handed. When I was a kid, I broke my right arm twice. While it was broken I still wanted to pitch so I just started using my left hand and it stuck."

http://www.ferrum.edu/news/ArchivePreMay02/billy.htm
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:45 PM EDT (#34263) #
Chacin's up to 86 pitches after 7; I'd imagine this is his last inning.
_Braby - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:46 PM EDT (#34264) #
Spier 8th, Batista 9th?
_R Billie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:49 PM EDT (#34265) #
Er Eric... :P

Second and third no-one out for Lofton.
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:50 PM EDT (#34266) #
Two inning "save" for Batista coming up.
_Mike Forbes - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:50 PM EDT (#34267) #
Chacin had a great game but now its time for some... *Cringe*... bullpen action.
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:50 PM EDT (#34268) #
John Gibbons is choosing Batista for the 8th... Not sure if he's got Speier in mind for the ninth, or Batista for a 6-run save.
_Braby - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:51 PM EDT (#34269) #
It would be a 6 run loss, haha.
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:51 PM EDT (#34270) #
Dave, why is this a "save", and not just a save?

You've got to figure that coming in with the bases loaded and none out makes for a difficult situation.
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:52 PM EDT (#34271) #
Ah.. bloody typos. That should have read "Batista for a 6-out save."
Named For Hank - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:53 PM EDT (#34272) #
Very efficient, Mr. Batista!
_Tassle - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:53 PM EDT (#34273) #
Way to go, Mr. "Clutch". First pitch swinging.
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:54 PM EDT (#34274) #
James, I wasn't sure if it's offically a save with a 5 run lead and 6 outs remaining. That's all, nothing against Batista.

"Mr. Clutch" Derek Jeter wasn't so clutch right there, good job to enduce the fly out to shallow right and a great throw by Rios to hold the not so fleet of foot Johnny O at 3rd.
_Smack - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:54 PM EDT (#34275) #
I think someone posted an article on Wagners journey to the bigs, he is one of my favourite pitchers. In terms of age, arbitration, I would rather have Lidge though.

Remember JP not taking trade offers for Batista? Well he was arguably better than Zambrano, but I think a 4 mill starter has more value than a 4 mill closer, but heres hoping he has some good outings, including tonight.
_Mark J - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:54 PM EDT (#34276) #
I would make a threat as to what I will do if I see another commercial on YES that fawns over Derek Jeter, but then I'd probably have to carry through with it on the next commercial break.

Hope Batista gets out of this with minimal damage...

Chacin's looked pretty good. I'd like to see a few more Ks and a couple of mph on the fastball but he showed a lot of poise. I note his minor league walks allowed are fairly high, so control may be something of an issue. That cutter moves a fair bit though.
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:55 PM EDT (#34277) #
The tying run is on deck, so I believe it qualifies as a save situation. The confusion is understandable, though. Sorry.
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:56 PM EDT (#34278) #
I thought GQ was supposed to be this "master" behind the plate?

He looks an awful lot like Kevin Cash when it comes to blocking the plate as far as I'm concerned.
_Braby - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:57 PM EDT (#34279) #
with Zaun catching Cairo is out.

Bases juiced again.
_JackFoley - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:57 PM EDT (#34280) #
GQ is 23. Hard to be the master of anything at that age.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:59 PM EDT (#34281) #
Double play!
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 09:59 PM EDT (#34282) #
You have to love those 1-2-3 double plays!
_R Billie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:00 PM EDT (#34283) #
There's the DP and Batista escapes it with a 6-3 lead. No thanks to his own wildness.
_Braby - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:00 PM EDT (#34284) #
Double Play YUP, bases loaded none out against the Yanks w/ Jeter, A Rod, Posada and Matsui up and to come out with 2 runs in isn't a bad job at all by Batista. Could be worse for sure.
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:00 PM EDT (#34285) #
Of course it is Jack, but from what I heard before the callup I expected a rough time at the plate but some nice defense from GQ. He's made quite a few mistakes behind the plate so far in the bigs, which is to be expected, but that's a play that a good defensive catcher makes.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:02 PM EDT (#34286) #
Wait, Chacin started the 8th? Gusty move by Gibby to send the rook out for another inning.
_GregH - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:08 PM EDT (#34287) #
I wasn't sure if it's offically a save with a 5 run lead and 6 outs remaining

I believe an official save is when a pitcher comes in to relieve with a lead of three runs or less.

If someone besides Batista pitches the 9th, he would get a save.
_Jim - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:09 PM EDT (#34288) #
The tying run wasn't on deck when he came in.

It was 6-1 with the bases loaded. No save.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:10 PM EDT (#34289) #
It's a save situation for Miggy, I believe. Tying run was on deck when he entered, no?
_Jim - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:10 PM EDT (#34290) #
Damn my math is bad tonight - that is a save..

I'm the ministry of disinformation
_Prisoner of Ham - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:10 PM EDT (#34291) #
"Gusty move by Gibby to send the rook out for another inning."

Didn't Ricciardi criticize Tosca for something very similar in a Batista start?
_Jim - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:10 PM EDT (#34292) #
It wasn't gutsy, it was stupid. The bottom of the 7th went forever, no way should he have sent him back out.
_Mike Wilner - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:11 PM EDT (#34293) #
Just checking in, guys - Batista will get a save if he finishes and the Jays win in 9. Partly because coming in up 6-1 with the bases loaded means that the tying run WAS in fact on base. :-)
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:12 PM EDT (#34294) #
Didn't Ricciardi criticize Tosca for something very similar in a Batista start?

Hmm. Now that I think about it, if Tosca did that, I would be really mad. Change "gusty" to "unwise."
_Jim - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:13 PM EDT (#34295) #
Can someone please hit a 2 run homer. I have a four team parlay with Toronto, the over, Kansas City and Milwaukee that is 2 car payments... I don't ask for much.
_greenfrog - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:14 PM EDT (#34296) #
Hindsight is 20-20 but I wasn't crazy about bringing Chacin out for the 8th, mainly because he's already had a long season. And didn't he pitch in winter ball? Loved what I saw, er, heard and read about his start, though. Sounds as though he's got terrific poise.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:14 PM EDT (#34297) #
You're late, Wilner. We've already established that. Pick it up next time, will ya? ;)

Obviously, I'm kidding.
_Jim - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:14 PM EDT (#34298) #
'Hindsight is 20-20'

It wasn't hindsight for me, my GF was on the computer.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:16 PM EDT (#34299) #
Did Delgado have a chance at that grounder? And why wasn't Posada running all the way with a 3-2 count? He should have scored.
_greenfrog - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:16 PM EDT (#34300) #
How, how do you walk the tying runner to the plate? Can someone enlighten me?
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:17 PM EDT (#34301) #
Not that I'm complaining, of course.
_Jim - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:17 PM EDT (#34302) #
A. Not really
B. The run means nothing with 2 outs at home, there is no real advantage to having a force there.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:18 PM EDT (#34303) #
That was close.
_Ryan01 - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:19 PM EDT (#34304) #
Thank god for Mr. Clutch.
_Jim - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:19 PM EDT (#34305) #
Are you kidding me with that play by Adams. I thought for sure that was a hit off the bat, wasn't even close at first.
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:19 PM EDT (#34306) #
RANGE!

Adams showed he can go get it and credit Delgado with the nice pick to end the game.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:19 PM EDT (#34307) #
Good to hear that Adams made a nice defensive play. Description for the TV-impaired, Jim?
_JackFoley - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:19 PM EDT (#34308) #
Win number four!
Pistol - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:20 PM EDT (#34309) #
This has to be one of the most satisfying wins in awhile.

Although I'm not sure that watching Batista close is good for a person's blood pressure.
_Ron - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:20 PM EDT (#34310) #
One of top 5 wins of the season!!!!
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:21 PM EDT (#34311) #
That was Chacin's 20th win this season (16 AA, 1 AA playoffs, 2 AAA, 1 MLB). Now, wins and losses are generally meaningless, but it's hard to win 20 over three levels if you aren't good.
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:21 PM EDT (#34312) #
Gustavo!
_Smack - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:21 PM EDT (#34313) #
So far Adam's only weakness has been his throwing arm. Most of that is mental, from lack of confidence, but if he can work on positioning himself to make the easy throw he can stick at short. Whats Bordick doing next year?
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:22 PM EDT (#34314) #
Wow. I just saw the dot on the virtual field on Gameday. Adams got that? Just...wow.
_greenfrog - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:23 PM EDT (#34315) #
Awesome. Awesome. Chacin will never forget this start--this season, for that matter. He now has 20 wins in 2004 (I think), if you count all levels and the AA playoffs.
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:25 PM EDT (#34316) #
The ball was hit hard straight up the middle. Adams darted over from nowhere, caught it and bounced an off balance throw to first, which got there about a step and a half ahead of Jeter. Delgado mnade a nice scoop.
_Jobu - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:26 PM EDT (#34317) #
Will there be a jays in an hour broadcast of this fine game?
_Ron - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:27 PM EDT (#34318) #
When was the last time a Jay has recorded a W in AA, AAA, and MLB all in one season?
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:27 PM EDT (#34319) #
He didn't even have to make a diving stop. I don't know what his initial position was, but it looked like he covered some ground to get to it.
Mike Green - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:30 PM EDT (#34320) #
What a fine debut for Gustavo! I imagine he might have earned himself another start.
_Magpie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:30 PM EDT (#34321) #
RSN just had some highlights - Hinske's play, Adams' play to end the game. Both outstanding.

Did the Jays 2005 rotation just get a little more complicated? Or is it now: Halladay, Lilly, Bush for sure, with Chacin, Miller, Towers scrapping over the last two jobs.

And Batista in the pen...

Although actually, perhaps his role in Arizona is the one he is best suited for. He's a swing man. He can start and relieve. Very few modern managers want to try to deal with someone like that. Its much simpler to assign someone a role. Then you don't have to think about it anymore...
_Kevin Pataky - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:31 PM EDT (#34322) #
Great Job Gus!!!

_Smack - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:34 PM EDT (#34323) #
Eyebrows!

Reminds me of my grade 7 History teacher who used eyeliner to paint on eyebrows.
_R Billie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:34 PM EDT (#34324) #
I hope we see League one of the next two games. I have a feeling we won't see him in a close game though.
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:34 PM EDT (#34325) #
Mike Wilner, post-game on Chacin:

"All the guy needs to be a big time pitcher is eyebrows ... that's it."

Hilarious stuff, Mike.
_GregH - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:35 PM EDT (#34326) #
Wilner in the post-game show just praised Chacin hugely and then said:

All he needs to be a Major Legue pitcher is...eyebrows!
_Kevin Pataky - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:38 PM EDT (#34327) #
There is a reason for the eyebrows and the baldness. Its called alopecia. Look it up and have some compassion. I have the same problem with my eyebrows.
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:40 PM EDT (#34328) #
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/recap?gameId=240920110
Kevin, you would probably know better than most about Chacin. Do you know that he has alopecia? The AP game recap (COMN) says "With a shaved head, a 19-2 record in the minors and fresh off a playoff win at Double-A, Chacin..."
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:41 PM EDT (#34329) #
Chacin just made the McGowan TJ news a lot easier to bear.

I'm getting ahead of myself here, but a Doc-Lilly-Bush-Chacin-McGowan rotation would be nice. Perhaps too young, though.
_Kevin Pataky - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:41 PM EDT (#34330) #
Yes - we both do.
_Dr. Zarco - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:42 PM EDT (#34331) #
Kevin, Chacin has eyebrows in the photo that Rob posted above. Doubt they could have fallen out that fast. Sounds like a rookie hazing or a drunk pass out win the presence of mean friends.
_Tassle - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:43 PM EDT (#34332) #
I'm getting ahead of myself here, but a Doc-Lilly-Bush-Chacin-McGowan rotation would be nice. Perhaps too young, though.

I'm getting WAY ahead of myself, but a Doc-Clement-Lilly-Bush-Mcgowan rotation would look World Series calibre.
_Kevin Pataky - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:44 PM EDT (#34333) #
My eyebrows can completely fall out in 3-5 days if I don't get my injections every 6-8 weeks. After injections it can take up to 2 weeks for regrowth.
_Dr. Zarco - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:46 PM EDT (#34334) #
Oh...sorry. I suppose I should know these things.
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:46 PM EDT (#34335) #
We don't know when that picture was taken. Kevin follows the AA Fisher Cats closely so I would take him at his word. I meant no offense to Gustavo in quoting Mike Wilner.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:47 PM EDT (#34336) #
Let's put it this way: if Kevin Pataky, who has talked to the Fisher Cats much more than any of us have, says Chacin has alopecia, then Chacin has alopecia.

I'm glad I didn't post something about his eyebrows, but I did catch Wilner's line on the postgame intro and laughed -- since I didn't know about any health problems. Apologies for my laugh, which none of you heard, but was insensitive anyway.

Back to baseball: Does anyone know the answer to Wilner's trivia question?
_Ron - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:48 PM EDT (#34337) #
I'm getting WAY ahead of myself, but a Doc-Clement-Lilly-Bush-Mcgowan rotation would look World Series calibre.

Because you still need to score runs to win, I say trading for Bonds, Chavez, and Pudge will really boost our chances of winning next season!
_Lefty - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:48 PM EDT (#34338) #
Anybody watching the Seattle v. Angels game. Its a wild one. Vlad got smoked in the head by Franklin in the first. Both teams warned, Soscia has been tossed. He challanged Franklin to fisticuffs. Vlad's off to the hospital for Xrays. And Dallas McPherson smoked a double to the wall in his first appearance. 1-0 Angels. McPherson looks like a stad and Troy might be expendable.

Looking at the box score, that was a pretty ugly save by Batista tonite eh. But as the Rocket used to say, "Day all count."
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:49 PM EDT (#34339) #
Oh come on, sorry for the disrespect Kevin, but nobody knew that Chacin had alopecia. It's not as if everyone is just making fun of him because he has it.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:51 PM EDT (#34341) #
Italics are gone now, and I still don't know who the first player to win 20 organizational games for the Jays was.
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:52 PM EDT (#34342) #
I tried to cheat and still can't find it. My guess is Jeff Musselman, because he started to have some success in 1987 with the Jays. It's probably incorrect though.
_Kevin Pataky - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:52 PM EDT (#34343) #
It is a very difficult disorder to have - I can attest to that. It crushes your self confidence - and I myself find it difficult to look people in the eye when talking to them. When I do, I sense people staring at the uneven-ness or thinning/balding areas. One outgoing person once asked if I shaved them - and I almost popped the guy. It makes me cringe when I hear people say stuff about him because I'm going through it too. I go every 6 weeks, and the doctor injects my eyebrows with 15-20 holes in each eyebrow. It hurts incredibly because there is not much meat there. But if I didn't do it I'd have no eyebrows left.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:55 PM EDT (#34344) #
Steve Davis? Um, who?
_greenfrog - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:55 PM EDT (#34345) #
Tassle: do you mean Matt Clement of the Cubs? He of the $6M salary (to be increased next year, no doubt)--is he a free agent this off-season? He looks like someone likely to be poached by a deep-pocketed owner...
_P Smith - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:55 PM EDT (#34346) #
Steve Davis won 20 games for the Jays at three levels in 1985, including a couple with the big club.
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:55 PM EDT (#34347) #
http://www.baseball-reference.com/d/davisst03.shtml
This Steve Davis ^^
_Lefty - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:56 PM EDT (#34348) #
Mariners broadcasters have calculated how much dough the Angels will have off the books after this season. $38,000,000. Most it tied up in Sele, Appier and Glaus.

I reckon they'll be busy again this offseason huh?
_James W - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:56 PM EDT (#34349) #
Matt Clement is one of many potential Cubs free agents, including Nomar Garciaparra, Moises Alou, Mark Grudzielanek and Todd Walker.
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 10:57 PM EDT (#34350) #
Steve Davis: 57 IP, 64+ career ERA. Nice '86 season.
_Ryan Lind - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:03 PM EDT (#34351) #
What a terrible misfortune that this game was not televised.

PS: D-Rays lose! We're gaining ground!
_Tassle - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:04 PM EDT (#34352) #
Tassle: do you mean Matt Clement of the Cubs? He of the $6M salary (to be increased next year, no doubt)--is he a free agent this off-season? He looks like someone likely to be poached by a deep-pocketed owner...

Yeah, that Matt Clement. With Pedro and Pavano on the market as well, I think the Jays could be a dark horse with regards to Clement. A backloaded 3 or 4 year deal at 7 mill per might just get him. I think that leaves us with 3 or 4 million for a replacement 1st baseman, but I'd love that rotation.
_Mike Wilner - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:05 PM EDT (#34353) #
Just signed off, and got to reading. I meant no offense to Chacin or any other people who have alopecia, and I'm sorry, Kevin. I know that in the past, I have seen Chacin with a full head of hair and eyebrows, and I had thought that he just shaved 'em off or something. I'm still not sure if he has alopecia, but just in case, I won't say anything about it on the air anymore.

That said, I thought it was a pretty funny comment in a vacuum, and so (evidently) did others - and it may still be if Chacin doesn't have alopecia. All I mean by that is that there was no malicious intent, and I hope that was obvious.
_Scott Levy - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:09 PM EDT (#34354) #
I'm glad someone mentioned it. If Tosca keeps Chacin in for the 8th, most of this forum would be throwing F-bombs at Tosca's direction. Gibbons is making similar mistakes, and he gets a free pass. Poor Tosca.

Chacin was good. I read he was throwing 90-92 and he has the cutter that can neutralize righties. He could be a good 4th or 5th starter.
_Matthew E - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:11 PM EDT (#34355) #
I don't know. I had a couple of problems with Tosca, but I don't recall complaining too often about how he'd leave starters in there too long.
robertdudek - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:14 PM EDT (#34356) #
It was hit hard.
Pistol - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:17 PM EDT (#34357) #
Did the Jays 2005 rotation just get a little more complicated? Or is it now: Halladay, Lilly, Bush for sure, with Chacin, Miller, Towers scrapping over the last two jobs.

And Batista in the pen...


Regardless of how Chacin does the rest of the year I'd be surprised if he's not in Syracuse to start next year. He only has a couple AAA starts under his belt, and prior to this year he didn't have a whole lot of success.

Chacin pitched well tonight, but he did have just 2 Ks against 3 walks. I wouldn't conclude that he's ready to be a ML pitcher right now based on tonight.
_Kevin Pataky - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:19 PM EDT (#34358) #
Another picture of Gus from tonight.

_Lefty - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:19 PM EDT (#34359) #
I tell you what I'm wondering about. This Batista thing. Is this guy auditioning as the closer or what? If he is then why do you throw him out in the 8th and then have him come in the ninth. Figuring last nights save by Speiers is on account of giving Batista the night off after consistant use, well I could see that but Batista laboured in the eighth and the ninth wasn't a piece of cake either.

Do they use him again tomorrow if theres a save opp? Or go back to Speiers? Was Batista thrown out just because he qualified for the save? And if so then thats just stupid. Who's behind this confusion, the manager or the GM. I wonder what Tosca would think?
_DaveInNYC - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:20 PM EDT (#34360) #
Pistol, I think you can't base Chacin's success tonight by looking at the numbers. Who cares if he only had 2 k's to 3 walks? He held the highly potent Yankee lineup in check and had them off balance all night for the most part.

Remember, it's his first career start and it's in Yankee Stadium against one of the best lineups in baseball... not exactly the easiest debut in the world.
_Scott Levy - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:23 PM EDT (#34361) #
I don't know. I had a couple of problems with Tosca, but I don't recall complaining too often about how he'd leave starters in there too long.

Not necessarily leaving pitchers in too long, but damn near everything you can think of. Literally. Look back at the game threads here. I'm surprised no one blamed him for AIDS in Africa.

Gibbons is making the same mistakes, or similar mistakes, or mistakes period, and he's given a free pass. Not really fair, but that's the nature of the beast, I suppose.
_gid - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:25 PM EDT (#34362) #
GQ is 23. Hard to be the master of anything at that age.

Sure, he'll come around in due time. At a larger level, counterexamples of your second sentence abound, including one previously mentioned in this thread -- Eddie Murphy was 21 or 22 when Delirious came out (and I assume it's reasonable to consider that a "masterwork" of standup comedy).
Pistol - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:25 PM EDT (#34363) #
I don't know. I had a couple of problems with Tosca, but I don't recall complaining too often about how he'd leave starters in there too long.

I always thought that Tosca frequently left Halladay in the game too long.

I would have pulled Chacin after the leadoff walk, and possibly after the 7th depending on pitch count and how he felt. Leaving him in for 3 batters gave the Yankees a chance to get back in the game so I think it'd be fair to criticize Gibbons there.
_Andrew S - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:27 PM EDT (#34364) #
Rookies get more leeway to make mistakes. We're also allowing Adams to write of plays we'd jump on Woodward or Gomez for.
_Jeff - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:28 PM EDT (#34365) #
Sure is nice to have a recent to get excited. Wish these guys were playing earlier in the year.
_Ducey - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:29 PM EDT (#34366) #
Its official-Jays avoid 100 loss season in style (evidently). I wonder if Griffen and Elliot will come out of their garbage cans tomorrow.
_Jeff - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:29 PM EDT (#34367) #
recent should be reason. Guess I'm tired. :)
Pistol - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:29 PM EDT (#34368) #
Pistol, I think you can't base Chacin's success tonight by looking at the numbers. Who cares if he only had 2 k's to 3 walks? He held the highly potent Yankee lineup in check and had them off balance all night for the most part.

It's the DIPS in me.
Pistol - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:33 PM EDT (#34369) #
but Batista laboured in the eighth and the ninth wasn't a piece of cake either

I didn't think that Batista was laboring, I just think he wasn't all that effective. It didn't look too dissimilar to a lot of his 1st innings as a starter.

He does seem to have a knack for getting double plays though.
Pistol - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:35 PM EDT (#34370) #
Toronto: 63 wins
Tampa: 63 wins

Watch out Lou!
_Lefty - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:39 PM EDT (#34371) #
Your right Pistol, labouring was probably a sloppy choice of words. However I'm still wondering what the intent of the call was. He threw 37 pitches tonite. Does he come in again tomorrow? I mean if he's your closer. You know I could see it if he was Mariano Rivera and Torres really needed the game, but ...
_Rob - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:41 PM EDT (#34372) #
Well, with the Robert Goulet Memorial Wildcard Trophy out of hand, we can hope for the Jays to finish 4th and take home the "Damn That Grecian Wind" Trophy.
_R Billie - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:44 PM EDT (#34373) #
Chacin had just 86 pitches through 7 innings and wasn't especially hard hit for the most part. Since I wasn't watching the game I couldn't see specifically if he was tiring in the 7th but it didn't sound like it. He hadn't walked a lot of guys or given up a lot of hits. This guy has thrown 7 or 8 innings and around 100 pitches a lot this year and there was no reason to think he couldn't do so tonight, especially with a 5 run cushion. Lead off walk, what should have been an infield single, and then a hit batter chased him from the game but if he started an inning like that in the first half of the game you wouldn't have thought twice about it. He got his 100 pitches in against a tough team in his debut and there's nothing wrong with that. I might have pulled him after the Hinske error just to minimize the damage.

Gibbons is slow to make a move sometimes but I wasn't clamouring at the radio for a move to be made as I have during some other games this year.
_Chris H - Monday, September 20 2004 @ 11:56 PM EDT (#34374) #
http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/minors/04league20s/app.html
BA just came out with their Top 20 prospect list for the Appalachian League. One Jay made the top twenty - Yuber Rodriguez OF was 7th on the list...COMN.
_#2JBrumfield - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 12:14 AM EDT (#34375) #
Is it just me or does Chacin look a bit like Quiroz? There's a story on him in the latest issue of Baseball America (Miguel Cabrera on the cover). That's what I thought when I saw the pic, that Quiroz was pitching. The Zach Jackson/Matt Leblanc comparison is a good one also.

Man, it's great the Jays won and just as importantly, the Yankees lost. I was worried about Chacin against the Yankees but it worked out pretty darn well, going 7 innings in the Bronx Zoo. Batista's making me nervous as the closer but he's 2-for-2 in save opportunities.

After seeing the Jays win Saturday and Sunday at the Dome, then listening to them beat the Yankees tonight, and my 2-and-0 Detroit Lions on the verge of grabbing sole possession of first place in the NFC North (if the Eagles hang on), it's just doesn't get any better than this. Go Jays! Go Lions!
robertdudek - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 12:15 AM EDT (#34376) #
I think Chacin was taken out at exactly the right time. Sometimes starting pitchers lose their effectiveness fast. Before the 8th there was no sign that Chacin was tiring or that the Yankees were adjusting. Yes he walked the leadoff man in the 8th, but then Hinske failed to get an easy grounder down the line.

After that, you could plainly see that the Jays were stalling for time but Chacin had to face one more batter and he unfortunately hit him.
_Chris H - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 12:27 AM EDT (#34377) #
http://www.baseballamerica.com/chat/chat.php?id=2004092001
For those interested in talking about the Appalachian League...Will Kimmey will be taking questions at 2:30 tomorrow (Tuesday)...
robertdudek - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 12:31 AM EDT (#34378) #
The Jays don't have to give Batista ALL the save situations. If another save situation arises tomorrow it will likely go to Speier. I like letting Batista go two innings - it helps all the relievers in the pen get proper rest and is really really different than Tosca's way of handling a pen.

Today, I thought he was overthrowing. He looked off-balance and his control was not good, even by his standards.

Letting Frasor, Speier or Batista go two innings if they are throwing the ball well is the right way to go.

I'd like to see Batista come up with a circle change - everything he throws is 92-96 MPH and the batters adjust to the speed. He could be a serious strikeout pitcher if he came up with an 84 MPH change.
_Jobu - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 01:00 AM EDT (#34379) #
I think AAA is the place for Chacin to start the year next year. Alot of his success tonight could be attributed to teams not seeing the pitcher before and not knowing what to expect. Chulk and Frasor anyone?

Well, with the Robert Goulet Memorial Wildcard Trophy out of hand, we can hope for the Jays to finish 4th and take home the "Damn That Grecian Wind" Trophy.

I can't believe we lost the RGMWT the first year it was created!! That was supposed to be all ours! Now it will forever be disgraced with the engraving of "2004 Baltimore Orioles". This is surly the work of the CRUSTY OLD DEAN! .

Damn you dean!! I don't care who you played bass for, I will not let you stop the Jays from getting the Grecian Wind Trophy!
_Magpie - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 02:04 AM EDT (#34380) #
The reviews begin to come in:

Jeter: "...he had a good idea of what he was doing. He had command of his pitches. He did well."

Torre: "He showed a lot of poise....He pitched like a veteran tonight."
_Kevin Pataky - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 06:41 AM EDT (#34381) #













ANDREW SAVULICH/NEW
YORK DAILY NEWS

Jaysí Gustavo
Chacin, a 23-year-old Venezuelan making his first major league start at
Yankee Stadium last night, pitched into the eighth inning in leading the
Jays to victory in a game originally scheduled for tonight. Only 10,732 fans
exchanged tickets for the game.



New York Daily News




Toronto Star

_coliver - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 07:40 AM EDT (#34382) #
Excellent job by Chacin. I was worried, however, that Gibbons was going to keep him in too long. Six full innings should have been sufficient.

Being a Jay fan from Western New York, I always enjoy the Yankees telecasts of the Jays due to Ken Singleton. He is very aware of the players due to his son, Justin. Also, he sounded like a proud papa when he stated that Justin had a very good year--let's root for him!
Pistol - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 09:37 AM EDT (#34383) #
I find YES tolerable when it's just Kaat and Singleton. Add Michael Kay or Joe Girardi and get the mute ready. Paul O'Neill is hit or miss for me.

Also, he sounded like a proud papa when he stated that Justin had a very good year--let's root for him!

Right after he said that I looked up Singleton's stats in NH:

.236/.291/.438, with 152 Ks in 442 ABs.

He's got some juice when he makes contact, he just doesn't make contact much.
Mike Green - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 11:00 AM EDT (#34384) #
Pistol, you're absolutely right. It should be said that Singleton is by all accounts a terrific defensive centerfielder, and might find his way onto a major league roster as a 5th outfielder someday.
robertdudek - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 11:04 AM EDT (#34385) #
I don't think I'll ever forget the throw Justin Singleton made to home plate against Erie this year. Coach, Gerry and I were in attendance; Justin caught a fly ball and threw a laser to home plate (he was the rightfielder) to nail the runner trying to score on a sac.
_R Billie - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 02:01 PM EDT (#34386) #
Singleton could challenge for a gold glove in the majors if he hit enough to play everyday. It seemed every Fisher Cat game I listened to he would make one highlight reel play.
_Kevin Pataky - Tuesday, September 21 2004 @ 03:26 PM EDT (#34387) #
The last weekend in August, I witnessed 2 of the most incredible catches by a center fielder at any level. One was a saturday nite vs Erie when Singleton caught the ball while in the air - he then hit the wall and flipped over it into the opposing bullpen and still held on. The next day he killed a bases loaded rally late in the game with a long run followed by a fully extended bankhanded dive in left center. Truely incredible!




Fisher Cats centerfielder Justin Singleton makes a leaping catch
before falling into the visitors bullpen as leftfielder Tyrell Godwin looks on
during the game against Erie SeaWolves. (MARK BOLTON/UNION LEADER)

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