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The Jays record a nice win tonight, although the defense was not stellar. Big night for Colby Rasmus with a 5-5 night, combined with a bad error. Brett Lawrie hit leadoff and had three hits.

David Cooper had a 2 run home run although when he hit it I thought it was a fly ball. So far Cooper's power has been to left field.

Edwin Encarnacion sat out the game with his sore hand.

Ricky Romero looked very good for the first six innings. Then he made a couple of bad pitches and the defense made some errors and it looked like he was having a melt-down. I though Farrell did a good job to get him out of there.

Yan Gomes has been recalled. Jesse Chavez has been optioned down which means he has options I guess. Gomes might get the start at first tomorrow night against a left handed pitcher.

Alex Rios showed why Toronto fans were frustrated with him. He had a couple of hits but made the third out of the eighth inning at third base.

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uglyone - Tuesday, June 05 2012 @ 11:38 PM EDT (#257949) #
Nice looking lineup tonight. I say we keep it.
92-93 - Tuesday, June 05 2012 @ 11:40 PM EDT (#257950) #
Rasmus has been on absolute fire the last 2 weeks since he got the day off and reportedly changed his stance and moved up in the batter's box.
greenfrog - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 12:28 AM EDT (#257956) #
Coop is having a nice 2012 so far (324/359/568). Of course, he's played in only 10 games, but the Jays will take it. He's had some nice ABs since his recall.

Jays two games out of first place. It looks like a tough schedule in June - gotta eke out every win they can.
Anders - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 12:33 AM EDT (#257957) #
Thanks for the recap Gerry, I thought I was going to be able to do a scout, but work interfered.
China fan - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 04:37 AM EDT (#257959) #
It's much too early to know if Cooper has solved his power-shortage issues (although there's room for some optimism -- he's hit a combined 8 home runs already this year in the minors and majors, compared to 11 in the whole of last year). But what I do like about Cooper is his continued ability to get on base. His OBP numbers in the minors and majors continue to look very good, as they did last season too -- aside from those miserable first dozen games in the majors. Last night he showed a lot of calm poise by working a two-out full-count walk in the first inning with the bases loaded to drive in the first Jays run. Farrell appears to be recognizing this ability by putting him at the 5th or 6th slot in the lineup in recent games, ahead of JPA and Davis. If Cooper can keep this up, he's a huge improvement over Lind in the OBP department, which would provide a lot of value in the current Jays lineup, where OBP has been severely lacking (although Rasmus and Lawrie look a lot better after last night).

Another positive last night is that Romero continues to recover from his early-season control problems. He's only walked 2 batters in his last 13 innings. The Jays need him to be on form. Now if Drabek and Alvarez can settle down....
China fan - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 05:22 AM EDT (#257960) #
I agree with critics who say it was risky to go with 8 relievers and only 2 bench players last night. Luckily it didn't matter. I have to assume that the Jays were closely monitoring the health of key players (Encarnacion and Johnson especially) and trying to decide whether to bring up an outfielder or an infielder. If Encarnacion had been okay, it might have been better to call up an outfielder instead of Gomes. But EE's recovery is slower than expected, so Gomes was the logical guy to call up today. Also, I assume that Johnson is not 100 per cent, so the Jays prefer to keep McCoy on the team as the back-up for those days when Vizquel is in the lineup.
Chuck - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 06:50 AM EDT (#257961) #
Can't be long now before word gets around that Cooper can handle the outside pitch very well. In fact, he seems to want to go the other way, I don't know if that's just his prediliction, like Jeter's, or a slowness in his swing. I imagine that pitchers are going to soon start challenging him on the inner half of the plate to find out.
AWeb - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 07:57 AM EDT (#257965) #

Thoughts on last night: Cooper clearly has a lot of power, because that was a line drive home run to the opposite field. The wind was blowing that way, but still, off the bat I had no idea it would be a HR (neither did Martinez calling the game, he seemed completely caught off guard when it went out) . The question is whether he'll be able to consistently access the power, but after the last few years, just doing it once in a while and replacing Overbay's averagish 1B production would be a nice change. On the replay of the HR, it showed him running to first base - it appeared Cooper might be Olerud-slow. It looked like he almost fell over trying to run. Cooper will not be filling in somewhere else defensively.

Rasmus - this is a genuine hot streak for a Toronto hitter. Great to see from the non-EE/Bautista part of the lineup.

Lawrie - he seems to be trying to use his speed, rather than his power. To my untrained eye, he's had too much weight on his front side to effectively drive the ball most of the year. The upside is this allows him a running start and he legs out hits and doubles. The downside is that he won't slug .450 this way. Are the Jays asking him him to hit this way? It's notably different to the general "swing from heels and try to hit HR" approach that seems to be the standard. Maybe it's the last step in assembling a super-hitter. Counting the minors over the past few years - took walks at one point, hit HRs at one point, now hitting for average with speed. Maybe post-all-star break, he will start doing more than one at a time.

85bluejay - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 10:29 AM EDT (#257970) #
with the boss in Arizona (Kendrick) unhappy with Justin Upton,I wonder if AA may take another shot?
Chuck - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 11:07 AM EDT (#257973) #

I wonder if AA may take another shot?

And when Arizona asks for Lawrie in exchange?

92-93 - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 11:39 AM EDT (#257981) #
Can we still give them Drabek & Snider instead?
Chuck - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 11:49 AM EDT (#257982) #

Or what the typical Wilner caller might suggest: Cecil, Thames and Cooper.

joeblow - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 11:50 AM EDT (#257983) #
Was at a home game on the weekend and sat behind 1B. Got to watch Cooper and Rasmus in the batting cage and it was interesting to contrast their positions in the box. Rasmus is pretty much centered on the plate with a narrow stance and Cooper has his legs spread further and left foot almost outside the back corner of the box. Something you don't notice as much watching on tv.

Beyonder - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 12:00 PM EDT (#257986) #

Sorry for the ghost post (again)

Do Bauxites listen to Wilner's post game? I find he doesn't ever engage the (few) thoughtful callers to his show, and he's rude and dismissive to the more casual fan who calls in (his bread and butter). I acknowledge he's got a tough job, but to me the show is unpleasant from start to finish.

jgadfly - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 12:31 PM EDT (#257991) #

         Thoughts on last night:    ...   tough night for Lawrie defensively.  On two occaisions he drew the "Latin ire" ... first on the popfly that Visquel caught from Bautista  (not sure why ?)  The second from Escobar for cutting in front of him. That's the fastest I've seen Escobar come in on a groundball all year . It seemed that Escobar was trying to take back the shortstop territory which has been slowly eroded or infringed upon by Lawrie's great range . Escobar in the past (pre-Lawrie) has stayed back on similar grounders and has made the play with his great arm compensating for his deeper positioning . Escobar wants to be the top shortstop in baseball and probably has noticed that these plays that a shortstop makes with some difficulty, but still makes,  are being made by his thirdbaseman, thus reducing the shine on his arm, defense and cache . On more than several occasions, Escobar has shot challenging glances Lawrie's way on similar groundballs as if saying, "that's my play, butt out, you're treading on my toes". "How can I be King of my Kingdom if you're always invading my Kingdom ?".   Lawrie's ego and flat out, all out, "raging bull in a china shop" approach, like a new hire trying to impress the boss in a union shop, maybe wearing thin .   I haven't seen the Lawrie-Bautista kibbutzing as much lately, but I suppose they each have to play their own games, so long as they continue to play as a team .         

CeeBee - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 12:52 PM EDT (#257992) #
Lawrie will ruffle more than a few feathers and probably has already done so. His comments about Alvarez not getting ahead in the count probably didn't help when Lawrie himself had a couple of brain farts in that same game. With Brett WYSIWYG and I'm guessing that his team mates and coaches have already figured that out.
James W - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 01:10 PM EDT (#257996) #
Every play you're describing is Lawrie's ball. On any play that the third baseman can get to (and the throw will go to first or second), it's his ball.
Chuck - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 01:19 PM EDT (#257997) #

On two occaisions he drew the "Latin ire" ... first on the popfly that Visquel caught from Bautista  (not sure why ?)

If you're referring to the high popup that Lawrie was intending to catch, but that Vizquel ended up catching, I saw the opposite of ire. I saw Vizquel and Lawrie both smiling and laughing.

Escobar has shot challenging glances Lawrie's way on similar groundballs as if saying...

Is it really wise to presume to know what the players are thinking, especially from fleeting facial expressions? Your analysis could well be biased by your own projections.

uglyone - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 01:20 PM EDT (#257998) #
"tough night for Lawrie defensively. On two occaisions he drew the "Latin ire" ... first on the popfly that Visquel caught from Bautista (not sure why ?) The second from Escobar for cutting in front of him."

it's funny because despite those mishaps, he also managed to make two running beauties ranging to his right into foul territory to nail speedy runners with sweet across the body lasers to first in the first couple of innings. Plays that look routine for him but not many 3B make.
jjdynomite - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 01:25 PM EDT (#257999) #
Totally... that Vizquel pop-up was the veteran calling off his junior. They had a laugh about it afterwards. Not sure there was any "ire" there. In fact, I'm not sure if Lawrie was primed to catch that ball without attempting one of his now de rigeur spectacular diving plays. Vizquel was.
CeeBee - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 03:25 PM EDT (#258012) #
The wind was blowing that popup all over the place and Vizquel barely caught it. Lawrie had no chance so it was a good thing Vizquel kept after it even though it appeared that Lawrie was calling it.
jgadfly - Wednesday, June 06 2012 @ 04:10 PM EDT (#258020) #

"If you're referring to the high popup that Lawrie was intending to catch, but that Vizquel ended up catching, I saw the opposite of ire. I saw Vizquel and Lawrie both smiling and laughing".      ... Chuck, I was referring to that same high popout and I too, saw what you saw with Lawrie & Visquel but if you have access to the replay check out the look that Bautista gave Lawrie and draw your own conclusions ... 

"Is it really wise to presume to know what the players are thinking, especially from fleeting facial expressions? Your analysis could well be biased by your own projections."     Chuck,  I agree with you that perhaps it is not "wise to presume to know ..." and that my "analysis could well be biased by your (my) own projections."   I hope that I'm wrong about my presumptions, perceptions and analysis and how things are working out on the playing field ...but I am seeing some skiffs of smoke  which I hope will be blown away by a long winning streak.

China fan - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 11:52 AM EDT (#258065) #
Not a single comment by any Bauxites on that amazing two-hit shutout by Morrow last night? How blasé we have become! The draft ended yesterday -- is it still the only thing we can talk about?

Morrow now leads the entire major leagues in shutouts. Lots of room for chatter on last night's game, yet the Bauxites are quiet. Is Morrow a potential Cy Young contender if he keeps this up? Or an all-star at least? What about Cooper and his gaudy .366 average: is it a mirage, or could he stick? What about Encarnacion's injury -- is this a long-term concern? What about the bench -- how long will Gomes and McCoy remain on the team before there's an attempt to upgrade with Guerrero, Lind, Sierra, Snider? Come on guys, there must be something we can discuss here!
China fan - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 11:58 AM EDT (#258066) #
Oh, and the Jays are only a game out of a playoff spot. Is this the year to make a run? Should they be trading for a reliable pitcher to upgrade from Drabek or Alvarez?

Assuming that the Orioles fade, and assuming that the other divisions remain weak (both of which are reasonable assumptions), the Jays only need to finish ahead of ONE of the Red Sox, Rays or Yankees. Surely that is achievable this year? Could there be a better year for the Jays to make a mid-season acquisition to push for the playoffs?
ayjackson - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 12:13 PM EDT (#258067) #

Are the White Sox our whipping boys?

I like what I'm seeing from Cooper.  It's not just that he's getting hits, it's his general approach at the plate.  He has a better sense of the zone than anybody not named Bautista.

zeppelinkm - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 12:17 PM EDT (#258068) #
I don't know... KJ controls the strike zone well too. But I agree with the premise of your post. Cooper knows the strike zone, and has a good approach at the plate. I like watching him take his AB's.
Beyonder - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 12:20 PM EDT (#258069) #
Alvarez I think you stick with unless he completely implodes. Drabek I think you stick with unless you can package him out for a solid number three type.

Another point entirely, but booking back on the Santos/Molina deal, it really looks as though AA did a great job of selling high on Molina. He's having a very tough year (combined ERA of 5.23). If you were going to give up one of our top pitching prospect, looks like he was the one.
uglyone - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 12:23 PM EDT (#258070) #
MLB 2008 Draft 1st Round College 1B Class

#7 Y.Alonso
#11 J.Smoak
#13 B.Wallace
#17 D.Cooper
#18 I.Davis


MLB Career Statistics

1) D.Cooper: 124pa, 7.3bb%, 14.5k%, .283babip, .268avg, .323obp, .464slg, .787ops, 109ops+, .335woba, 110wRC+
2) Y.Alonso: 347pa, 9.5bb%, 20.2k%, .342babip, .279avg, .349obp, .407slg, .756ops, 110ops+, .333woba, 113wRC+
3) I.Davis: 944pa, 11.2bb%, 23.8k%, .302babip, .248avg, .333obp, .422slg, .755ops, 107ops+, .328wwoba, 105wRC+
4) J.Smoak: 1108pa, 10.6bb%, 22.1k%, .263babip, .228avg, .310obp, .386slg, .696ops, 94ops+, .307woba, 91wRC+
5) B.Wallace: 551pa, 8.2bb%, 26.1k%, .343babip, .253avg, .330obp, .359slg, .689ops, 91ops+, .304woba, 90wRC+


AAA Career Statistics

1) I.Davis: 42pa, 21.4bb%, 11.9k%, .385babip, .364avg, .500obp, .636slg, 1.136ops, .489woba, 210wRC+ (IL)
2) D.Cooper: 730pa, 12.2bb%, 8.5k%, .361babip, .347avg, .423obp, .525slg, .949ops, .410woba, 137wRC+ (PCL)
3) Y.Alonso: 854pa, 9.7bb%, 15.9k%, .332babip, .296avg, .364obp, .478slg, .842ops, .368woba, 128wRC+ (IL)
4) J.Smoak: 477pa, 16.1bb%, 18.0k%, .300babip, .253avg, .379obp, .414slg, .794ops, .365woba, 115wRC+ (PCL)
5) B.Wallace: 1197pa, 6.9bb%, 20.2k%, .350babip, .299avg, .360obp, .482slg, .842ops, .363woba, 113wRC+ (PCL)


So all of these guys have been considered elite prospects at some point.

Well, all of them except one. Guess who?
BalzacChieftain - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 12:24 PM EDT (#258071) #

Great outing from Morrow last night, and the defense, as usual, was shifted to perfection.  It seemed there were a lot of balls hit fairly hard that were right at the defense.

I agree with others re Cooper's approach. He's working counts and making good contact. I imagine he will soon be pitched a little bit differently because of his short-term success, but if he maintains the approach he's shown, his success could be sustainable. If anything, his patience is needed in the lineup when the team has guys like Arencibia, Gomes, and Lawrie hacking at everything they see.

In terms of playoff hopes and divisional competition, the Red Sox are going to have Ellsbury and Crawford healthy at some point, and the Rays will get Longoria back. If they stay within striking distance, they'll be tough to compete with for a wild card spot later in the season. 

China fan - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 12:36 PM EDT (#258073) #
You mean the Carl Crawford with the OPS of .694 last year? Will he make a huge difference to the Sox? (Unless he reverts to his 2010 numbers.)

Ellsbury and Longoria could help to improve the Sox and Rays, but the Jays could improve too. There's certainly scope for improvement from a number of the Jays hitters.
Flex - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 12:36 PM EDT (#258074) #
Morrow was brilliant last night. I think for some people there's something about him that isn't yet "trustworthy" — his implosion against Texas just fuels the lingering sense that he's part mirage, and it's all going to come apart at some point. We have a vivid recent memory of what a true ace looks like, and it's someone that that sort of thing doesn't happen to. We measure Morrow against that and find him somehow wanting.

But the balance is slowly tipping. He's entering his prime. Anthopoulos saw something at the end of last year that made him comfortable with extending the contract, and I think by the end of this year we'll look at Brandon Morrow and be relaxed with the notion that he's an ace.
neurolaw - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 12:38 PM EDT (#258075) #
I am surprised that no one posted too Chinafan!

But here are my thoughts:

1. Brandon Morrow leads the league in shutouts. I did not expect that. His evolution as a pitcher has required a lot of patience from both the management and the fans but the pitcher that we are seeing now is well worth it. He is not a number 1 yet but man he is getting there.

2. The Jays do need to upgrade the pitching staff. That is their biggest need. Personally I think Greinke would really stabilize the top of the rotation and it would allow Romero to slot into 3rd spot where his true talent lies. But I don't think Greinke wants to come to Toronto. Also how much would the Jays have to give up in order to acquire him considering he is a free agent in 2011?

3. I am not sure if the Jays need another bat. You can argue they do (and I would agree) but you can also argue that the offense scores enough runs to win plenty of ball games. Bautista looks like he is nearly back to his old self and EE has been mashing the ball and to be honest that is a great 3-4 production. The way I look at it is if the Jays got another bat that would be really good but if they did not I don't think it would be the difference maker this season.

4. The bullpen needs to be upgraded. But I had a couple of thoughts here of how it could be done internally. If the Jays are still hanging around all summer I would move Alvarez to the pen, and bring up Stroman. If Santos can make it back then I think having Alvarez, Stroman and Santos in the late innings would be a great way to close out ballgames.

What do you guys think?



hypobole - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 12:42 PM EDT (#258076) #
2012
Davis: .253/.311/.470
Thames: .242/.288/.365

Rajai's arm and glove are not much, if any better than Thames, but at least he has the wheels to get to balls that would probably have go for extra bases with Thames in left. He won't keep up his power surge, but if he could only lay off those down and away breaking pitches... nah that ain't gonna happen. Jays will ride the Rajai wave for a while at least, though.
Matthew E - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 12:48 PM EDT (#258077) #
Is Morrow a potential Cy Young contender if he keeps this up?

Well, of course he is.

...if he keeps this up.
John Northey - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 12:52 PM EDT (#258078) #
Morrow's contract made me a bit nervous at the time - he has yet to be a 100+ ERA+ pitcher for a full season as a starter - but now it is really looking like the Jays will make out like bandits.  A solid #2, maybe #1 guy signed for 3 years (2013-2015) at $8 / $8 / $10 with the 3rd year being a club option ($1 mil buyout). 

Morrow now has a 145 ERA+, his BB/9 is sub-3 (his best ever), his K/9 is at 7.8 which is his worst ever.  His HR/9 is at 0.8 which is solid. 

This years staff now has ERA+'s of 145-112 (Alvarez)-105 (Romero)-97 (Hutchison)-91 (Drabek).  Just one game has been started by anyone else so far and all but Hutch have 11 or 12 starts (Hutch at 9).  This is a much, much, much better situation than we've seen here in a few years. 

Top 5 starters (in games started) by ERA+ over the past few years...
2011: 147-91-91-80-71
2010: 115-112-99-93-85
2009: 159-103-84-83-80 (Halladay)
2008: 152-125-118-104-97 (Halladay-Marcum-Litsch-Burnett-McGowan)

Forgot how good that starting staff was in '08.  A team ERA+ of 122 but an OPS+ of just 96.  86 wins, 6th in AL for attendance but still 7 1/2 games+ out from June 14th on, 9 games out of the wild card (just 3 behind what would've been the 2nd wild card had it been in place then).
John Northey - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 01:11 PM EDT (#258080) #
Right now the Jays are 8th in runs allowed, 3rd in runs scored in the AL. 

Go to starting though and the Jays are 3rd in ERA at 3.91, close to 4th place Oakland but not close to 5th or 2nd place.

The pen though... ugh.  14th - dead last - in ERA at 4.39. Only Milwaukee and the Mets are worse (the Mets by a large margin are dead last with 3 ex-Jays in their pen Batista, Francisco, and Rauch).

What has killed the pen? I think we all know of Cordero's struggles, how Igarashi sucked, Santos did poorly, Crawford showed hope briefly before crashing, and how vets Villanueva and Frasor have had their issues this season.  Sure does say that spending millions on a pen is not always a winning strategy.  The pen has been an anchor on the Jays, not a life preserver.  Igarashi did well in AAA but wasn't given much of a chance (2 games vs a hot Texas team), Chad Beck has done well in AAA ERA wise but his supporting stats do not give me hope.  I suspect this year we have to hope the vets put it together and hold the fort.  I think the Jays might need to look at calling up Cecil and trying him in the pen as we need more support out there and I don't know who else might be helpful at this point.  Hopefully Santos is good when he gets better.
krose - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 01:40 PM EDT (#258082) #
Excellent article on Morrow's accomplishments this year over at mlb.com. Here is the link address. http://mlb.mlb.com/index.jsp
uglyone - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 02:02 PM EDT (#258086) #
Sometimes you want to doubt the power of FIP and xFIP, and Morrow the last couple of years was one of the main reasons why. An extreme outlier who consistently put up elite peripherals but somehow always ended up with a lousy ERA.

But even Morrow is a slave to the FIPpy numbers in the end, it seems:

10/11: 3.42fip/3.51xfip x .318babip x 37.9gb% x 9.0hr/fb% = 4.62era
2012: 3.44fip/3.81xfip x .223babip x 41.0gb% x 8.3hr/fb% = 2.90era

So is it just a matter of BABIP luck that has knocked near 2 runs off of Morrow's ERA this year despite putting up very similar component numbers as in years past?

Or has Morrow actually become more of a "pitcher" and lowered the quality of contact allowed by keeping hitters more off balance?

I want to lean towards the latter explanation, because it certainly "feels" right, but then again the FIPheads have been predicting that Morrow's ERA would regress towards that FIP in the end for a while now, and it's hard to argue that they were wrong.
92-93 - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 02:48 PM EDT (#258091) #
Morrow's success can likely be attributed to his turnaround in pitching from the stretch. Last year opponents had an .811 OPS with a runner on, and a .632 OPS from the windup. This year he's actually been better with runners on (.571) than he has been with the bases empty (.586).
Chuck - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 02:56 PM EDT (#258092) #

Morrow's splits between bases-empty situations and men-on situations have historically been large and the basis of his underachieving.

Because he has pitched his poorest in the highest leverage situations, his ERAs have always exceeded his FIP. His ERA figured to only ever come in line with his FIP once he addressed his inability to pitch well with men on base. And in 2012 so far, he has.

bases-empty OPS/men-on OPS

2010: 662/802 
2011: 632/811
2012: 586/571

As per uglyone's FIP and xFIP numbers above, the FanGraphs' number crunching would suggest he is basically the same guy he's always been. Where he used to suffer bad luck, he is now enjoying good luck.

But is that the complete story? Or has he made legitimate changes that do allow him to pitch better with men on base? Is there a reason to believe that his men-on OPS will not balloon into the 800s as it has in the past? And if it does regress from 571, as it figures to, where will it land? What is his "true" ability?

Chuck - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 02:57 PM EDT (#258093) #
Nice scoop 92-93. I guess I shouldn't have written a tome.
China fan - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 04:13 PM EDT (#258100) #
Travis Snider has just tweeted that he's making his debut with the Dunedin Blue Jays tonight. The Jays are obviously being a lot more cautious with him this time, compared to earlier in the season when he was tossed back into the Vegas lineup after a couple weeks on the DL. We'll be watching closely to see how he does in the Florida league. Guerrero's numbers for Dunedin might provide a bit of a benchmark for Snider's rehab starts down there.
uglyone - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 04:25 PM EDT (#258102) #
Not sure it's all about "patience" or "caution" in this case.

There's a logjam in Vegas right now.

RF Sierra
LF Thames
1B Lind
DH Guerrero

someone has to be promoted or else they'll be sitting someone they don't want to sit.

China fan - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 04:28 PM EDT (#258103) #
In other news: the bullpen's rotating door is continuing to revolve. Coello optioned to Vegas, and Beck has been promoted. Again.
Gerry - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 04:31 PM EDT (#258104) #

Snider has played 3 or 4 games in extended over the last week.  He had 5 hits in 13 at-bats, one a double.  Extended spring games finished yesterday so he had to join one of the full season teams to get playing time.

Jake Marisnick had three at-bats listed in extended and because he is at the bottom of the list, after Snider, I assume he played yesterday or the day before too.  He might be back with Dunedin soon as well.

92-93 - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 06:39 PM EDT (#258110) #
AA's seemingly unnecessary bullpen shuffles continue. I wonder what the reasoning behind the Beck-Coello switch was.

Igarashi, FWIW, has been called up by the Yankees. Still have no idea why he wasn't optioned down to Vegas.
sam - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 08:29 PM EDT (#258118) #
I was going to post this after Alvarez's last start, but I think a large part of why Alvarez has struggled in recent starts and from what I've seen here tonight, it looks like he's changed his arm slot ever so slightly--throwing from a slightly elevated slot than before. He's not getting the same movement as before or sink. He's created a bit more of a "boring"-type angle and I think it's allowed him to get on top of the slider a bit more and create some more bite and two-planeness with that pitch, but the fastball doesn't seem to have same movement.
Hodgie - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 08:59 PM EDT (#258119) #
If what happens in Vegas really does stay in Vegas, one wonders what David Cooper did in his time there that he believes it best that he not return. SSS acknowledgements and all but he sure looks like a big leaguer at the plate at the moment.
uglyone - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 09:05 PM EDT (#258120) #
Fangraphs' baserunning metrics rank us as the best in the league, and that 2nd inning there is a good example of why.
Beyonder - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 11:10 PM EDT (#258123) #
If that wasn't the last straw with Cordero, it must be pretty darn close.
Chuck - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 11:12 PM EDT (#258124) #

No Janssen in a tie game? What a pedestrian move.

BlueJayWay - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 11:18 PM EDT (#258126) #
Okay.  With this Jays team I want to see

-Cordero gone
-Snider up and playing LF
-Cordero executed
-stop with the constant squeezing with a runner at third
-Vlad in the lineup
-Cordero cut
-Santos back, and Cordero marooned on Easter Island
-swing a trade for a starter

I think this team could be a playoff team.  Maybe.

Original Ryan - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 11:36 PM EDT (#258127) #
I'd be quite happy if Farrell would finally understand that saving your best reliever for a save situation that might never come is a really bad idea. Janssen should've been in the game there, pure and simple. I blame Farrell more than Cordero right now.

Lose on a walk-off with your best reliever on the mound? It happens sometimes and I can accept that. But lose in that situation with a guy who has been inconsistent for most of the year and when your best reliever hasn't even pitched in the series? That's unacceptable.

If more proof of the silliness of the save stat was needed, here it is on a silver platter.
Thomas - Thursday, June 07 2012 @ 11:52 PM EDT (#258128) #
Well said.

And the save stat isn't the best measure of effective relief pitching, but so what? It may be an extreme example, but lots of stats aren't the most precise measure of what they are intended to convey. However, what's particularly silly is how the stat, or more precisely in this case the mere possibility of a player accumulating this stat, dictates a manager's in-game decisions to the detriment of the team's chances of winning.
Paul D - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 12:06 AM EDT (#258129) #
I don't even think it's so much that Jansen wasn't brought in, it's more, why bring in your worst reliever?  Why have a 7 man bullpen if you'll only use 5 guys in it?
Sherrystar - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 12:08 AM EDT (#258130) #
Someone here needs to jump on the ban the save campaign and make the power that be realize its a totally useless stat.
Original Ryan - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 12:19 AM EDT (#258131) #
It's strange -- Farrell determined that Cordero could no longer be trusted with three run leads in the 9th inning, but tonight he concluded that Coco was a perfectly acceptable choice in a situation where the game was literally on the line with every pitch.
Hodgie - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 12:33 AM EDT (#258132) #
I can't believe that Farrell also went 1-11 with RISP and committed that error in the first to allow the first Chicago run.
92-93 - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 12:57 AM EDT (#258133) #
When the players make mental errors, we rip them for it.
sam - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 01:06 AM EDT (#258134) #
I didn't get to see the end of the game, but I did notice in the box score a wild pitch in the inning. Again, in those situations any baseball person will tell you that unless that ball is in the dugout or the stands, it has to be blocked. Too often does Arencibia let you down defensively in those situations.
92-93 - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 01:16 AM EDT (#258135) #
It was Arencibia's 2nd poor attempt at blocking the ball of the night.
ayjackson - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 07:50 AM EDT (#258139) #
I don't like using my best reliever in that situation against the worst hitters on the opposing team when you know someone's going to have to get their best hitters out to win that game.
jjdynomite - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 08:05 AM EDT (#258140) #
... but why put in the WORST reliever on the team, then? (Oh yeah, he was a save machine last season... and makes $4.5 million).

Would've been much more confident to see Perez or Villanueva, hell, even Beck in. When's Santos coming back again?!
Gerry - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 08:57 AM EDT (#258143) #

To take the heat off Cordero for a minute, I was disappointed with Omar Vizquel last night.  He batted early in the game with the bases loaded and no-one out and he struckout.  Mike McCoy took the spotlight off Vizquel with his hit/O-Dog error.  Then in the ninth with a runner on third he had another terrible at-bat.  Was he trying to bunt or trying to fake the fielders?  I don't know but it looked like he didn't either, another terrible at-bat.

Vizquel is basically a slap hitter at this point in his career.  I would have preferred that Gomes bat for Vizquel rather than McCoy.

Mike Green - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 09:08 AM EDT (#258144) #

Was Janssen warming in the top of the ninth?  I imagine that he was.  If so, the approach that makes sense to me, given that Janssen had not thrown in a few days, is to have him go for the 9th (and 10th, if necessary) regardless of whether the club takes the lead in the 9th.  Frankly, if the team scored 4 runs in the top of the ninth, it probably would make sense for him to pitch anyways.

BalzacChieftain - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 09:08 AM EDT (#258145) #

Cordero has pitched pretty well in the last few weeks. However, with 2 outs I was crossing my fingers they would bring in Perez (who was warming) to turn around Hudson. His career splits aren't a whole lot different, but I think the Jays would have had more of an advantage by putting a better pitcher on the mound.

In terms of Vizquel, his 2 at bats last night that Gerry is referring to were atrocious. If that would have been Thames or Lind, I can only imagine the vitriol...On the radio broadcast, Ashby called out the Jays' failure in executing the squeeze this year and the situations where the play has been called.

Chuck - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 09:15 AM EDT (#258146) #

Was Janssen warming in the top of the ninth? 

Both Janssen and Cordero were warming up. Buck actually stated Farrell's obvious intention: it would be Janssen were the Jays to score in the 9th and Cordero otherwise.

Paul D - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 09:16 AM EDT (#258147) #
To take the heat off Cordero for a minute, I was disappointed with Omar Vizquel last night. He batted early in the game with the bases loaded and no-one out and he struckout. Mike McCoy took the spotlight off Vizquel with his hit/O-Dog error. Then in the ninth with a runner on third he had another terrible at-bat. Was he trying to bunt or trying to fake the fielders? I don't know but it looked like he didn't either, another terrible at-bat. Vizquel is basically a slap hitter at this point in his career. I would have preferred that Gomes bat for Vizquel rather than McCoy. Agreed - and this was a good example of the failures of the current roster construction. Either use your entire bullpen, in which case you don't need Cordero in the 9th, or have one less guy in the bullpen, and a better option to bat than Vizquel. Even then, couldn't Davis have batted? He could put down the bunt, move to left, and McCoy goes to second.
BalzacChieftain - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 09:17 AM EDT (#258148) #
It sucks when Buck knows exactly what Farrell is thinking.
Chuck - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 09:22 AM EDT (#258149) #

to turn around Hudson

Hudson's game-winning hit notwithstanding, what on earth does the question have to be to get the answer "let's pick up a seemingly washed up second baseman who has never played third base and make him our starting third baseman".

Morel's OPS+ is 16, so plan B is Orlando Hudson?

The O-Dog looked much less than comfortable at third base last night.

BalzacChieftain - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 09:25 AM EDT (#258151) #

The O-Dog looked much less than comfortable at third base last night.

I was amused by Bautista's line drive double in the 9th that nearly decapitated him.

Hodgie - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 09:58 AM EDT (#258152) #
My only quibble with the "slave to the save" rhetoric is that it just hasn't been the case lately. Going back to Janssen's first save on May 9th, he has made 11 appearances as the team's closer, all in the 9th and 10 innings. In those appearances, he has been brought into the game in the following situations:
  • Down 1 run (1)
  • Tied (2)*
  • Up 1 run (1)
  • Up 3 runs (3)
  • Up 4 runs (4)^
* 2 inning stint against Texas.

^ May 28 vs Baltimore did not start the inning, two runners on

That is roughly 50% usage in non-save situations. Hardly innovative but certainly not typical either. Then again, why ruin a good narrative with facts.

uglyone - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 10:29 AM EDT (#258158) #
I was very critical of farrell last year, but this year i've been very happy with his decisions.....especially the ones concerning runners on the basepaths and defensive positioning, both in which h's shown himself to be as good as most any manager in baseball.

but he still has a couple of annoying tendencies, both of which have hurt us this year on multiple occasions.....including last night.

1) he keeps treating omar vizquel as a legit mlb hitter, and more specifically as a very good bunter....neither of which are true of the 45yr old at this point. instead of treating him like a last resort offensive option who should ideally be replaced in any critical offensive situation, he continues to use him as if he'sa legit offensive option...even though in all the situations that farrell has called on him to bunt, he's only beenn successful once (though admittedly that one time was an absolute beauty.) he's got to stop treating vizquel like a legit offensve option.

2) he keeps pulling relievers for no good reason. frasor was on 5 days rest and threw only 11 pitches in the 8th. there was no reason to pull him for cordero with the bottom of the order coming up. now frasor hasn't been great this year but he's been better than cordero and pulling him seemed to be just wasteful at that pint, especially with extras looming. it almost seems like farrell goes out of his way to find a reliever that will fail. and in this game it was frustrating thatt with a well rested bullpen, we lose the game by pitching one of our worst relievers, while the sox win by pitching 2 of their best relievers in support of their best SP.
greenfrog - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 11:42 AM EDT (#258162) #
I don't understand why the Jays keep trying the squeeze play. First, it's a low percentage play (if I'm not mistaken). Second, it has become a predictable play, because the Jays attempt it so often. Third, the Jays have a demonstrated track record of futility in executing it - why keep throwing good money after bad, so to speak?
92-93 - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 12:03 PM EDT (#258164) #
According to Wilner, it's because Omar Vizquel is one of the greatest bunters ever.
joeblow - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 12:38 PM EDT (#258169) #
Vizquel is a huge negative with the bat. Bring up Hech.

But I'm more concerned about Alvarez. That home run pitch was brutal. Coming after the JP passed ball, it was almost like he made the pitch to spite the catcher. The argument in the dugout was curious and I wish we had a lip reader here. I'm not calling for it but I won't be surprised if Alvarez is sent down at some point this season.
budgell - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 01:44 PM EDT (#258175) #

The argument in the dugout was curious and I wish we had a lip reader here

Missed the last few innings of the game, can someone elaborate on the argument?  Between JP and Alvarez?  Anyone care to speculate as to cause?

92-93 - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 01:52 PM EDT (#258177) #
It was pretty heated, and it looked like Alvarez wanted no part in what JP had to say. JP had to stop him from walking away and pull him back to continue the conversation. At some point Omar stuck his nose in to calm things down and gave Hendo a loving pat.
jjdynomite - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 02:27 PM EDT (#258189) #
According to Zaun during one of those Campbell/Zaun mid-game updates, it was because Alvarez was unhappy with JP's pitch calling (particularly, it must be assumed, leading up to and including the gopher ball Alvarez offered up to Rios). Zaun then commented that a pitcher should ultimately be accountable to his own pitches/location. Ah, the catching fraternity.
Thomas - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 03:27 PM EDT (#258203) #
That is roughly 50% usage in non-save situations. Hardly innovative but certainly not typical either. Then again, why ruin a good narrative with facts.

Well, the "facts" are that Farrell chose not to use Janssen in a tie game in a non-save situation, after Janssen had thrown 22 pitches in the previous six days, and chose to use Cordero instead. The only logical conclusion one can draw from this fact, as has been clearly stated, is that Farrell chose to do this because he knew that, in order to win the game, the Jays would have to have a save situation and he wanted to use Janssen in that situation, as opposed to when the game was tied. As Janssen's recent usage demonstrates, and Mike Green pointed out, there is no reason to think Janssen couldn't have thrown at least two good innings.

The fact that Farrell has used Janssen in non-save situations to give him work and keep him somewhat fresh - or even used him in a non-save situation in an instance where it is clear there would never be a save situation in that particular game - is besides the point.

Magpie - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 06:11 PM EDT (#258219) #
I'd love to pile on, but Cordero's actually been pitching rather well for the last month. Including last night, he's made 15 appearances since his disastrous May 8 outing against Oakland and allowed 3 runs in 12 IP (2.25 ERA.) Opponents have hit .233/.313/.256, he's stranded 5 of 6 inherited runners, etc etc. It happens.
Mike Green - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 06:26 PM EDT (#258221) #
I don't agree, Magpie.  Cordero has been a below average reliever for a few years.  It has been masked by a very low HR/FB rate until this year, and it seems clear to me that he isn't going to do that again.  His ERA will come down some more, but he's a 4.5 ERA/FIP/xFIP reliever at this point in his career.  He needs to be put in low leverage relief, and left there.
China fan - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 06:33 PM EDT (#258222) #
I tend to agree with Magpie. In fact, Cordero has been almost exclusively used in low-leverage situations for the past few weeks. The problem shouldn't be blamed entirely on Cordero -- the problem is the overall lack of depth in the Jays bullpen. Aside from Janssen, there really aren't any reliable relievers. All of them have had blow-ups and meltdowns. Santos is sorely missed. There isn't enough depth in the bullpen to ensure that Cordero is kept exclusively in low-leverage situations, and there's a severe shortage of lockdown 8th-inning set-up guys. So blow-ups like last night are inevitable. I think AA was aware of this, and he was trying to solve this problem when he acquired so many relievers in the off-season, but he didn't manage to find enough of the right guys.
92-93 - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 06:40 PM EDT (#258223) #
All this Cordero defense is really ignoring the crux of the issue - Janssen was fully rested and didn't pitch the entire series, and therefore the Jays lost the game without their best reliever on the mound. Personally I never would have pulled Oliver after one batter, and I would have gone back to Frasor for the 9th if I was so intent on holding back Janssen for a save.

And this notion that Cordero is being used in low-leverage situations since being removed from the closer role is incorrect. The first game he appeared in was a 2-1 lead in the 7th inning, and it hasn't changed much since. He's being used as your typical 8th inning setup man, a role he doesn't deserve.
Hodgie - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 06:42 PM EDT (#258224) #
Please Thomas. Considering Janssen's recent usage, Cordero's recent performance, and the fact that is was the bottom of Chicago's order due up it is far from the only conclusion that can be drawn. Here's one, maybe Farrell thought Cordero could handle the bottom of the lineup, freeing up Janssen to face the top 6 of the order like he did in the March 26th game against Texas? And really, getting work? I must have missed the press conference where that nugget was shared. I would think it strange that a guy that was throwing almost every other day over that time frame would need extra work. But then if something doesn't fit the narrative it is apparently besides the point.
Hodgie - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 06:44 PM EDT (#258225) #
And for what it is worth, I think Janssen should have been pitching but I don't believe the decision had anything to do with being a slave to the save.
China fan - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 06:51 PM EDT (#258226) #
In the past 14 games, after May 12 (until last night), Cordero has only twice been put into hold situations. In most cases, he was put into games when the Jays were up or down by several runs, or where they were already losing. So it's accurate to say that he's been mostly used in low-leverage situations in the past 14 games, until last night.
92-93 - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 07:14 PM EDT (#258228) #
First of all, I enjoy how you play with arbitrary endpoints to remove Cordero's first hold opportunity (after being removed as closer) on May 12th. Secondly, in the 14 games you mentioned there's been ONE game the Jays had a hold situation that Cordero wasn't put into, and he had pitched the night before.

Here's what Cordero's most recent appearances have looked like back to May 20th, pitching in every hold situation the Jays have had:

Last night - tie game, 9th inning
June 5th - 8th inning up 9-5
June 3rd - 8th inning up 5-1
June 2nd - 8th inning down 5-3 with 2 men on base
May 30th - 8th inning up 4-1, Hold
May 29th - 8th inning up 8-4 with 2 men on base, Hold
May 28th - 9th inning up 6-0
May 26th - 8th inning, tie game
May 23rd - 8th inning, tie game
May 21st - 8th inning up 6-2
May 20th - 9th inning down 1 with 2 men on base

Any attempt to paint Cordero as anything but Farrell's 8th inning, high leverage set up man is wrong.
China fan - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 09:11 PM EDT (#258231) #
Not sure why you think 10 games is a better sample than 14 games. But it still proves my point. In the majority of games that he entered, the Jays were ahead by multiple runs, or were losing. Not exactly high-leverage "set-up guy" situations.
China fan - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 09:21 PM EDT (#258233) #
As long as the Jays have a generally weak bullpen, I don't mind it if Cordero enters the game when the Jays are ahead by 3 or 4 runs in the late innings. It's not a very risky situation. And in those low-leverage situations, and in most other situations in the past 14 games, Cordero has done okay. He's far from the ideal reliever, but until last night he had been okay since May 12.
92-93 - Friday, June 08 2012 @ 11:42 PM EDT (#258238) #
It does nothing to prove your point. As I explained, Cordero came into every hold situation but one from the time he was removed from the closer role, and pitched as the 8th inning set up man would the entire time. When the limited high-leverage situations presented themselves to John Farrell, he went to Cordero.
Thomas - Saturday, June 09 2012 @ 12:31 AM EDT (#258244) #
Please Thomas. Considering Janssen's recent usage, Cordero's recent performance, and the fact that is was the bottom of Chicago's order due up it is far from the only conclusion that can be drawn. Here's one, maybe Farrell thought Cordero could handle the bottom of the lineup, freeing up Janssen to face the top 6 of the order like he did in the March 26th game against Texas? And really, getting work? I must have missed the press conference where that nugget was shared. I would think it strange that a guy that was throwing almost every other day over that time frame would need extra work. But then if something doesn't fit the narrative it is apparently besides the point.

I honestly can't tell what your Janssen's "recent usage" comment refers to. Is Janssen being overworked - despite the fact he has thrown just 22 pitches this month - and thus needs rest? Or is he being underworked - in which case you are arguing that Farrell's failure to use him justifies his continued failure to use him?

Secondly, Farrell doesn't explain every decision about why he used which reliever in a post-game press conference. If you want to believe that the fact i can't point to a quote to suggest that he may have used Janssen on May 21 to protect a four-run lead when Janssen hadn't pitched in four days means that Farrell couldn't possibly have used him to keep him fresh and must be a creative bullpen manager...well, I can't stop you. I didn't think the idea that managers sometimes use relievers in non-defined role circumstances to give them work if they haven't pitched in several days was controversial.

And Farrell pulled the exact same trick in tonight's game. But I guess if this doesn't fit your narrative, apparently it's beside the point.

Hodgie - Saturday, June 09 2012 @ 11:47 AM EDT (#258257) #
Not at all Thomas. My reference to Janssen's recent usage was alluding to how he has been used since assuming the closer's role. Maybe I misinterpreted your comments, but you appeared to dismiss any non-save usage of Janssen as a case of getting him some work and such usage was thus besides the point. I never contended that some of that usage could not have been just that, but there were certainly other circumstances where that wasn't the case. Twice he has been brought in to protect a four run lead despite having either pitched the day before or two days before. He has also been summoned into multiple tied games and saw action down a run in the ninth despite not needing work. At no point have I tried to justify why Farrell hasn't used Janssen in the last two games, I just choose not to ignore the prior month and state that I know, with absolute certainty why it was that way. For all I know Farrell is a slave to the save but the last month, the last two games not withstanding, sure seem to indicate that maybe that isn't completely true.
John Northey - Saturday, June 09 2012 @ 12:13 PM EDT (#258258) #
If only there was a measure of how high pressure a situation was... oh wait, there is. Leverage Index shows how high pressure a situation is - over 1 is high, under 1 is low, 1 is average.

Cordero...
Last 10: 3 over 2, 1 over 1, 1 at 1, 5 under (one at .98).
Average Leverage: 1.48 during which he threw 7 IP 9 H 2 BB 4 K 3.86 ERA
The 5 before that: 0.19 average leverage (as low pressure as it gets) during which he threw 4 1/3 IP 1 H 1 BB 4 K
First 13 games: 2.20 average leverage 8.76 ERA

Clearly Farrell had a brief 5 game purgatory for Cordero after those horrid first 13 games, then put him back into high pressure (but not super-high) situations.

There is also a stat called 'win probability added' IE: how much did he shift the team towards a win. In high leverage situations (2.5+) he helped once, was negative 5 times. Between 1 and 2.5 though he is 10-1 for helping shift the team closer to a win. In low pressure (1 or less) he is 10-2.

Pretty clear when to use Cordero - medium to low pressure situations he thrives, high pressure (like on the 7th and 8th) he cracks.

Now, Baseball-Reference has 1.5 listed as 'high leverage', .7 to 1.5 as 'medium' and under that 'low'.

Who has the most high? (IE: most trusted by Farrell)
Cordero at 12, Oliver 11, Frasor 10, Janssen 8, Perez 6, Santos 4, Villanueva 3, 1 each for Beck, Crawford, and Igarashi.

Most low? (IE: least trusted by Farrell)
Perez 15, Villanueva 13, Cordero 9, Oliver/Frasor/Janssen 8, Crawford 6, Carreno 3, Santos 2, Igarashi/Chavez/Coello 1 each.

So Cordero is clearly the #1 non-closer on the staff (as far as Farrell is concerned), Oliver next then Frasor. Perez and Villanueva are used when no other option is available.
China fan - Saturday, June 09 2012 @ 12:54 PM EDT (#258259) #
Thank you for the research, John. I think this settles the question. In the past 15 games, Cordero has pitched in only 4 high-leverage situations. Which is what I was saying.
Thomas - Saturday, June 09 2012 @ 01:40 PM EDT (#258260) #
you appeared to dismiss any non-save usage of Janssen as a case of getting him some work and such usage was thus besides the point.

If I gave that impression, I didn't mean to. The point isn't whether Farrell uses Janssen sometimes in save situations in non "getting work" situations. Or, at least, that's not what I'm concerned with. I'm aware Farrell hasn't managed the bullpen strictly in that manner (which basically no manager does anyway).

Being a slave to the save, as far as I was concerned, is short-hand for sub-optimal deployment of the team's best reliever, seemingly influenced by the desire for that reliever to accumulate saves. When criticizing Farrell for his bullpen management over the past two games, that's what we (or I) am criticizing. I never claimed (or intended to convey) that Farrell has never used janssen in a non-save non-work situation. However, he doesn't get much credit in my book for passing that low bar, even acknowledging the pressures and expectations of the job.

Hodgie - Saturday, June 09 2012 @ 02:20 PM EDT (#258261) #
Fair enough Thomas. And for my part I would like to believe that Farrell played the odds that Cordero could get through the bottom of the lineup in the hopes that Janssen would be available for the more difficult top of the lineup but I obviously don't know. There is a strong argument to be made that it isn't the right decision regardless and it could very well still be sub-optimal. I had just observed enough changes in his usage of the closer in the last month to believe that the decisions of the last two games may have been predicated on something other than the same old refrain.
92-93 - Saturday, June 09 2012 @ 02:52 PM EDT (#258262) #
No, nothing John wrote proves what you said.

"Not exactly high-leverage "set-up guy" situations."

"In fact, Cordero has been almost exclusively used in low-leverage situations for the past few weeks."

John wrote that Cordero was most definitely Farrell's go to reliever. The fact that the Jays haven't had that many high leverage situations in the last 2 weeks is irrelevant. Both of the quotes from above are inaccurate.
China fan - Saturday, June 09 2012 @ 07:23 PM EDT (#258278) #
Yes, I said "almost exclusively" when I should have said "in 11 of 15 situations." Big difference.
China fan - Saturday, June 09 2012 @ 07:25 PM EDT (#258280) #
"....Cordero is clearly the #1 non-closer on the staff (as far as Farrell is concerned)...."

This statement refers to the entire 2012 season so far. As you know, I was referring to the past 15 games.
Thomas - Saturday, June 09 2012 @ 09:00 PM EDT (#258283) #
And for my part I would like to believe that Farrell played the odds that Cordero could get through the bottom of the lineup in the hopes that Janssen would be available for the more difficult top of the lineup but I obviously don't know.

You were right in that I should have acknowledged that was a possibility in the first game, even if I didn't think that was Farrell's reasoning or primary motivation, particularly given Janssen's lack of work would have probably enabled him to pitch two innings. The performance wasn't as bad Friday, but I don't think that possibility is applicable to the decision to not use Janssen again then.

And all of this should be bracketed by the fact that we have to be aware that we are evaluating these decisions on the information available to us and there may be some other reason we aren't aware of, excluding things like the idea of defined roles for pitchers for pitchers, that could have factored into Farrell's decisions in both games.

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