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They say it's hard to lose a doubleheader, that a split is the most likely outcome. Don't tell that to the Jays, both Buffalo and New Hampshire lost both ends on Wednesday. Lansing saved the day while Dunedin had a day off.


Buffalo lost the first game of a doubleheader 2-1 with Brett Oberholtzer pitching a complete game and taking the loss. Oberholtzer has started nine games and has not conceded more than three earned runs in any of them. He sports a nice 2.40 ERA yet there is little buzz about his performance. On the negative side he has only gone six innings in three of those starts, although the Jays seem to be limiting him to 90 pitches. Brett has just 33 strikeouts in 48.2 innings, not a great advertisement for the major leagues. He does limit hits, just 41 in the 48.2 innings. Jarrett Grube pitched in game two and gave up four runs in 4.1 innings. Grube has a six plus ERA and a 1.50 WHIP. He is the starter on the shortest leash in Buffalo and at 35 he could be the one to go if a starter gets promoted from AA.

The catcher offensive battle continues. In the nightcap Raffy Lopez went 2-3 with a double and a home run. Dwight Smith keeps picking up hits, one in each game to keep his average at .308. Rowdy Telez is the opposite, he was 0-5 over the two games. Roemon Fields is cooling off, he too was 0-5.

New Hampshire

The Fisher Cats and Erie also played a doubleheader and each team had nine hits over two games. New Hampshire lost both games, 3-2 and 5-1. Glenn Sparkman started game one and gave up three runs, including two home runs, in 3.2 innings. This is essentially spring training for Sparkman. He should get six starts in his 30 days, the first three we can count as spring training and we need to look closely at the second three starts. They will tell more about Sparkman's future prospects with the Jays. Conner Greene pitched into the sixth inning in game two and was charged with four runs. However he left the game with one run in and the bases loaded. Tim Mayza relieved Greene but did not provide any relief, he surrendered a grand slam. Greene was not blameless, he had to use 92 pitches in his five plus innings, fair to say he was somewhat wild. Of note, former Jay Jairo Labourt has a 1.89 ERA pitching out of the bullpen with Erie.

Richard Urena went 0-3 in game two to end his hitting streak at 11 games. It was not a hugely impressive streak as he had just one hit in eight of those games. None of the hitters had great days, just nine hits over two games is evidence of that. Harold Ramirez had three hits over the two games to lead the hitters. Ramirez had a poor April but is now hitting around .270 in May and June. Ramirez does not walk much, does not strikeout much and doesn't have much power. Ramirez has to improve on his current showing as a .270 singles hitter to make it.


Dunedin had the day off which combined with yesterdays rain-out gives them a rare two days off in a row.


Lansing were outhit 14-13 but won 7-5. In other words it was a typical Lansing game in 2017. Every Lugnut hitter had a hit and four of them had two. There are absolutely no prizes for guessing who two of them were. The other two were JB Woodman and Ridge Smith. Woodman has had two very good games in a row. Woodman's troubles with the K have been well documented here. We should note that in his last three games Woodman has just two K's. I am pretty sure its a small sample size but we will keep watching in case we are wrong.

Andy Ravel tried to get through five innings but had to leave an out short. Ravel dodged and weaved giving up 12 hits and three walks in 4.2 IP. Three relievers went 4.1 innings and only conceded two hits, Ravel had tired them out. Dan Lietz is pitching well but he is 23 and in his second go around in Lansing.

Three Stars

Third Star - Raffy Lopez

Second Star - Bo Bichette

First Star - Brett Oberholtzer


Doubleheader Woes | 45 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
cybercavalier - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 09:53 AM EDT (#343102) #
Grube is the starter on the shortest leash in Buffalo and at 35 he could be the one to go if a starter gets promoted from AA.

The Jays sold Copeland's contract to South Korea. Talking about making full use of resources, can the Jays again sell Grube's contract to an indy league if he cannot get another affiliated minor league contract? There, Grube finishes his 2017 baseball season.
Super Bluto - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 09:54 AM EDT (#343103) #
Was thinking of a road trip to Lansing for the end of this month to see Bo and Vladdy Jr. What are the chances that they will still be there?
PeterG - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 11:05 AM EDT (#343115) #
Harrell will be joining Buffalo soon as he has had 2 rehab starts at Dunedin. Bolsinger will be there also if he accepts the outright. I think they should consider promoting Rowley. Bisons don't need Santos. He is organizational filler.
John Northey - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 11:21 AM EDT (#343120) #
Tellez is really slumping. 1 for his last 26 and just 2 HR since his opening day 2 HR game. Overall down to 209/293/333 - a line that would be hard to accept out of a gold glove shortstop.

It isn't like Buffalo is a nightmare to hit in either as teammate Roemon Fields shows with his 355/415/486 line.
Lugnut Fan - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 11:32 AM EDT (#343122) #
Bluto, I'm an engineer, so statistically I can not say it is a 100% chance, but I would put it in the 85% to 90% range they are still in Lansing. They are young kids in their first full season of pro-ball. I think they spend the entire season in Lansing.
PeterG - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 11:41 AM EDT (#343123) #
If Tellez finishes the season like this, Jays will probably not add him to 40 man as no-one would take him......I don't think they will add McGuire, Perdomo or Romano either. They will have to add Fields if he hits over.300, Greene, Jansen, Pentecost, Rowley (if he keeps it up) and Murphy.
uglyone - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 11:47 AM EDT (#343125) #
Rowdy's line vRHP is still solid, though not great. But lefties are killing him.
Gerry - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 12:12 PM EDT (#343129) #
The Vancouver and Bluefield rosters will be set this weekend. The draft is next week and Lansing have about ten games left in the first half. If there is going to be roster shuffling it could be in the next ten days.

If Bichette and/or Vladdy are to get promoted it could be either in ten days time or in early August to give them a taste of high A.

I can't handicap what the Jays are likely to do but I would expect that both players will get at least a taste of Dunedin before the end of the year.
uglyone - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 12:14 PM EDT (#343130) #
I know they are young but i'm not sure there are many examples of legit prospects hitting this well at a level and still staying there for more than a half season.
bpoz - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 12:15 PM EDT (#343131) #
Tellez's BBs and Ks are good overall. He still has over 200 ABs left this year. His power should reappear too.

Some of the added prospects like Alford and Greene have to help the team next year or they are short handed regarding depth and call ups. Pompey has to contribute also.

Of course everything will be dictated by the 2018 goal. Contend or rebuild seriously. Or both but half way.
#2JBrumfield - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 12:49 PM EDT (#343133) #
Some roster moves in Lansing.

Patrick Murphy and Andres Sotillo are on the DL. Yennsy Diaz and Matt Morgan have been called up from Extended.
PeterG - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 01:45 PM EDT (#343137) #
Woodman has 2 more hits so far today to make it 6 in the series. Vlad has 2 doubles off the wall. Ridge Smith may be another catcher to watch as he is hitting as well, adding 2 so far today .
PeterG - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 02:10 PM EDT (#343139) #
2 more rbi for Vlad with his 3rd hit of the day. Bo now has 2 hits also.
#2JBrumfield - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 04:29 PM EDT (#343148) #
Stories for your careful consideration today include comments from player development director Gil Kim about three Buffalo Bisons and another on half of the Lansing Lugnuts All-Star contingent.
CeeBee - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 05:12 PM EDT (#343152) #
Nice blog #2JB. Bookmarked it and intend to visit regularly.
jerjapan - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 05:46 PM EDT (#343155) #
Gotta disagree with you strongly PeterG,  Tellez could finish the year like this and still be added to the 40 man.  He only turned 22 in March and is a top ten prospect in a solid system ... he gets protected.  In fact, I think they could add any of Perdomo, McGuire and Romano.  McGuire is defensively ready for the bigs now by all accounts, Perdomo wasn't added last year but is one year closer to the bigs, and Romano is having a great  year.  Injuries took a big chunk of development time away from him, which is why he's in A ball, but unless he implodes after a promotion (he's definitely due) he's on the 40 man.  Perdomo is the ifiest IMO, but guys that tall sometimes struggle to find their control, and that's definitely his issue.  He has legit upside, and someone could take a look at him as a LOOGY.

We don't really have a roster crunch -my guess is that Smith Jr., Valdez, Cecilliani, Schultz, Sparkman, Ramirez, Beliveau, Campos, Dermody and maybe Goins will be off the 40 man.   Schultz, Sparkman and Pompey (who will be protected) are on the injured list, so not on the 40 man. 

Grilli, Howell, Smith, Barney, Coghlan, Liriano and Estrada are FAs. 

Greene, Jansen, Pentecost, Tellez are definite adds.  That leaves TEN spots, if my off the cuff accounting is right.  Bubble guys are Murphy, Fields, McGuire, Perdomo, Romano, Rowley, Rios,and J-Leb are the other names I worry about.  

We will resign or need one or two SPs, one backup IF and hopefully an OF.  Possibly a reliever or two. 

So four of my bubble guys are protected, four exposed. 

It's nice to have spots on the 40 man for the Dominic Leone's of the world, but it's even nicer to have org depth.

PeterG - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 06:06 PM EDT (#343157) #
Well we will have to agree to disagree Jerjapan. Although I think there may a bit more of a roster crunch than you think, with silly 25 man rosters I don't think there is a team that could carry a 1B that is not hitting for a full season. However, if he picks it up in the 2nd half, certainly he would be added in that case. Patrick Murphy is exactly the kind of player who is taken in Rule 5...a pitcher with high upside potential who can take garbage innings for a year. If his 2nd half is as good as his first, he will be almost certainly be added. He has been the best starter at either A level and with less experience due to past injuries. Of course all is based on what has transpired so far this season and things could and probably will change by September. I disagree with at least half of your other choices as well, but I will be more comfortable stating a case in September than I am now. FWIW, I feel that Goins,(definitely), will be protected with Smith and Sparkman as probables. In addition to Murphy, Fields and Rowley are slam dunks IF current performance continues.

I will also opine that if major league rosters are not increased from 25, there will be less players selected in Rule 5 overall.
jerjapan - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 06:34 PM EDT (#343159) #
For sure it's just speculating right now (although I'm happy to have someone to speculate with) ... September will tell.  But I think Goins takes a hit as an arb-eligible, out of options utility guy having a not so great season. 

Fields and Rowley are playing well right now and I'm interested in both guys, but they need to keep it up to be slam dunks.  Neither has had a consistent run like this before, and they are darn old to be prospects (although I do get their respective back stories) - to me, they are more like the Dominic Leone's of the world - fringe 40 man guys that a team adds if they have space.  I put Murphy in the same group as Rios, Romano, Rowley and Perdomo.  Last year it was Borucki the FO liked, and on these fringey pitchers I think the org has the inside scoop, so I don't feel too strongly on anyone in particular.  

FWIW, I wasn't trying to list choices, just candidates.  My only choice we disagree on is Tellez. 

I've already laid out my case against Sparkman elsewhere, but why do you think Smith is a probable?  He wasn't added last year, was downright mediocre in 2015/16, and is cooling off in AAA.  Even if he hits his ceiling, he's a one tool LF. 

I agree with you that it'd be great to have a 26 man roster. 

PeterG - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 06:50 PM EDT (#343161) #
I think that Smith gives us some OF depth which is needed. I would like to see him given some regular major league time so that we can better assess. Fields is exactly the speed type player the Jays desperately need. If he can hit over .240 at the major league level he can be a starter imo. I see Goins as a certainty. Just look at the current situation with injuries. Being arb eligible will not make any difference as I see no budget crunch next year. A player with his experience who can play several positions is needed. I don't want to go too far with this as his value as been debated many times before.

Two players that you did not mention that I think could be jettisoned from the 40 are Chris Smith and Harold Ramirez. I know that you like Chris but at this point, I think Murphy Smith is more likely to be added than Chris is to be kept.

Our biggest disagreements seem to be Tellez and Patrick Murphy. I expect I am in the minority, saying what I did about Tellez, but really....can a team keep him on a roster for a year if he is hitting like he is now. I just don't think so. I hope that he improves and is kept but am merely pointing out that it should not necessarily be assumed that he will be added to the 40.

Since you like to discuss these things, we should perhaps touch on Tim Mayza. As of now, he would not be an add but a stronger 2nd half would make him a real 40 man possibility. HIs problem so far this season has been too many gopher balls. If he can cut that back, he may still be worth keeping, more so than perhaps some others with less high end potential.

I see Jordan Romano and Angel Perdomo as possible trade chips.
lexomatic - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 07:08 PM EDT (#343163) #
 I think Tellez is a risk to be taken for a few reasons.
1-teams have been punting offense at 1b
2- with a big platoon split tellez has a potential use in a platoon. As a lefty he gets a chance to play enough to learn while not embarrassing himself.
The big question is if any of the rebuilding teams lack 1b options or prospects
I think the OF is thin enough that Smith Jr gets protected.

PeterG - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 07:18 PM EDT (#343164) #
Good points on Tellez. I don't think that my opinion is necessarily the same as that of the FO. I simply think that what would have been considered 100% before the start of the season is now less so. It is also possible that if Smoak holds up all year and is under control for 2 more years, that there may be less need to protect Tellez. Or maybe he becomes a trade chip. Again, this only applies if his stats are similar in August to what they are now. Hopefully, they are not.
jerjapan - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 07:40 PM EDT (#343165) #
I do have Ramirez on my cut list, he's a lesser Dwight Smith right now IMO.  Chris Smith has the big arm of the two Smith's, and he's younger, but Murphy has been lights out since becoming a full-time reliever last year.  With Fields I agree with you, he fills an org need, but Goins is the opposite in that respect.   if you buy that his D is declining, J-Leb and Berti offer the same versatility.  Berti's injury makes him a longshot, but I see Leblebijian as a legit utility guy under team control and with options.  Options are so significant for the bottom five or so guys on the roster.  (I do agree with you that Goins has some legit value though). 

I also like Patrick Murphy, FWIW - he's just a ways off.  I like Mayza too, he has a big arm and had lots of buzz from the FO this Spring, but relief specialists are so fungible, I could see his down season costing him a spot right now. 

I was worried last year when we left Perdomo and Rios off, and was proven wrong on that front.  IMO, the last five or so spots are pretty interchangeable - not much separates your Mayzas (mid round draft pick), Sparkmans (rule v) Leones (waiver claim) and Beliveaus (minor league FA). 

Trading some of the fringe guys makes sense, but it's most likely going to be a Mark Lowe / Cliff Pennington type acquisition.

PeterG - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 07:40 PM EDT (#343166) #
Another point that I should have made with regard to Dwight Smith is that he has and will have option years, a valuable asset these days. If Fields added, after the season, he would have 3 option years. I think he would be a good 4th OF if he cannot be a regular.
uglyone - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 09:08 PM EDT (#343169) #
tellez is a top prospect. he's young for his level this year.

he's not being exposed no matter what he does this year.
bpoz - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 09:13 PM EDT (#343171) #
I wonder if Tellez is hitting into a lot of double plays.
PeterG - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 09:52 PM EDT (#343173) #
It's also possible that trades are in the other direction and young assets are acquired. Perdomo pitched well tonight and his stock is on the rise while Murphy Smith did the opposite. Rios pitched 3 good innings tonight.

Being so definite on Tellez could be foolish Ugly. He is now hitting .204 with little power...OPS in low 600's. I hope he picks it up but if he loses more ground from here the 40 man is no longer a guarantee. If there is space, I would include him by all means, but if there is a crunch..................I still doubt any team would take him if the stats in August are the same or worse than they are now.

Chris Smith and Mayza are 2 big arms that are not really succeeding. If a choice, I would take Mayza as I see a higher ceiling and he is left handed.
cybercavalier - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 09:55 PM EDT (#343174) #
What happens to Jose Tabata? Has he played a game in 2017 Triple-A season?
hypobole - Thursday, June 08 2017 @ 10:19 PM EDT (#343175) #
Tabata hasn't played this year - on the DL.

Rowdy has 4 GIDP's bpoz.

What has really changed this year with Rowdy is his batted ball profile. The past 3 seasons, he pulled about 50% more balls than he hit oppo. This year he's about 10% more opposite field than pull.

If I was guessing, I'd say it's by design to beat/prevent shifts. If a swing change is involved, it would go a long way in explaining the issues he's having.
lexomatic - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 01:43 AM EDT (#343177) #
A  change in swing would be interesting based on what I've read about jays policy to not fix what isn't broken. So who's idea would it be?
Glevin - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 04:15 AM EDT (#343178) #
Tellez will be protected. You don't give up on a 22 YO in AAA with excellent numbers previously. I'm a little more down on him this year because with his defensive profile, he needs to be an elite hitter to make an impact in the majors, but he has the ability and the time to get there.
hypobole - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 08:49 AM EDT (#343179) #
So maybe it isn't a swing change, maybe it's timing, waiting to hit offspeed and not being able to catch up to FB's.

Anyone else have a theory?
PeterG - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 10:22 AM EDT (#343183) #
What implications might it have, if any, should the Jays select a left hand hitting college 1B in the first round of the draft as the BA mock is suggesting? Bear in mind that Smoak is under control through 2019.
hypobole - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 10:29 AM EDT (#343184) #
Smoak would have no bearing on the draft whatsoever.
PeterG - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 10:33 AM EDT (#343185) #
Actually he might in an indirect manner,.. If Jays were to draft someone they expect to be here by the time Smoak's contract is up, it could easily affect the status of a player caught in between.
PeterG - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 10:38 AM EDT (#343186) #
It is Tellez who is directly affected. IF the Jays select another college left handed hitting 1B who might arrive in 2 1/2 years, it could mean they are at least considering bailing on Tellez. It is unwise not to at least consider all possibilities.

Personally, I hope they do not select a 1b in round 1.
uglyone - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 10:41 AM EDT (#343187) #
people say we have no prospects ready to help then say prospects are getting squeezed out after 2 months in AAA. you gotta relax a bit.
PeterG - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 10:45 AM EDT (#343188) #
I am in the camp that the prospect pool is quite good and underrated in some circles. You only need so many players to handle one position Ugly.
uglyone - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 11:04 AM EDT (#343190) #
kid just got to AAA, and ahead of schedule. the fact that we have a 30yr old 1B with 2 good months on his resume and a 34yr old mediocre DH doesn't mean he's squeezee out.
hypobole - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 11:18 AM EDT (#343191) #
What a team has in its system should have little bearing on who they draft.
PeterG - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 11:23 AM EDT (#343192) #
You are correct Ugly that it does not mean that but it could.. I am only saying that it is now within the realm of possibility whereas 2 months ago it was not.

If I had to bet, I would go with Rowdy being added to the 40 but I would not be shocked it if it is otherwise. That's what has changed imo.

IF the Jays do draft Sheets or Fairchild (both left handed hitting 1b), that would reinforce the thought that the Jays are at least considering bailing on Tellez.

I don't see how anyone can reasonably argue that the possibility does not exist.

PeterG - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 11:26 AM EDT (#343193) #
Maybe it shouldn't hypobole, but I would argue that it does.
SK in NJ - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 11:29 AM EDT (#343194) #
Teams don't typically draft based on MLB or farm system needs. Most of the time it's perceived BPA, and other times it could be related to slot value and things like that. Smoak or any other player on the big league roster or minor league system will have no impact on how they draft.

That's not to suggest that it never happens, as Romero over Tulo is an example that hits close to home. It's just not a good strategy.
PeterG - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 08:39 PM EDT (#343208) #
Chris Rowley pitching another gem for NH. He has given up 1 run on 2 hits through 6. I hope this post isn't jinxing him as I think he is going to stay in for the 7th.

I am wondering if he might be able to bypass Buffalo and help in the TO pen right now or soon if Grilli continues to fail. At the very least he should be in Buffalo but they have extra pitchers as it is right now with Harrell and Boldinger recently added.
bpoz - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 08:45 PM EDT (#343209) #
I am in total agreement with you PeterG. C Rowley has succeeded plenty for big league consideration.

Numbers are not everything. I am sure that the FO are investigating what they have in C Rowley.
PeterG - Friday, June 09 2017 @ 09:34 PM EDT (#343212) #
From what I have heard and read, his make up is almost off the charts. He is exactly the kind of player we want on the big league team.
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