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Big series? 

I suppose. But it's still just late July. Lots of baseball yet to be played.


A remark by greenfrog in the last Game Thread caught my attention. In its entirety...

One question worth considering is: how rare/special is the opportunity the Blue Jays currently have to win the division and advance deep into the postseason? The last time the team had a similar shot at winning the division was a decade ago. If this is a chance that may not come around again for a while, then it might be worth making an extra push to add an impact player or two at the trade deadline.

I cast my mind back to 2015, and my first thought was this - was Anthopoulos really thinking about winning the division? Were they even close? Hadn't they been in a better position the year before? Hadn't they let that deadline go by with no activity at all to speak of. (Indeed, they had.) I had always figured Anthopoulos was focused on other things besides winning the division in late July 2015. The first thing on his mind had to be his own future in the game. New management was coming to town. Anthopoulos was about two months away from becoming Gord Ash. And he had to be concerned about the age of his roster. Mark Buehrle was two months away from the end of his contract (and his career), R.A. Dickey was already 40 years old, and Jose Bautista was two months short of turning 35 (and in the midst of his last great season, as it turned out.). It was getting pretty close to Now-or-Never time. Roll them dice!

But I thought I should take a look, just to be sure. SO down the rabbit hole I went.

The modern trade deadline, July 31, goes back to the 1986 season (it had been June 15 for decades before.) We are ten days away, and how is how your Toronto Blue Jays have stood ten days shy of the deadline each and every year:

Year  Record Position GBL

1986  50-44  5th  8.5 
1987  54-38  2nd  3.0 
1988  47-48  6th  9.5 
1989  46-49  4th  8.0 

1990  50-43  2nd  0.5 
1991  55-37  1st
1992  56-36  1st
1993  52-43  2nd  0.5 
1994  43-50  4th  13.5 
1995  32-44  5th  11.0 
1996  43-54  4th  16.0 
1997  45-49  3rd  12.5 
1998  50-50  3rd  22.0 
1999  51-45  3rd  6.0 

2000  52-45  2nd  0.5 
2001  46-51  3rd  10.5 
2002  42-54  4th  18.5 
2003  51-48  3rd  11.0 
2004  40-53  5th  18.5 
2005  47-47  4th  5.0 
2006  53-42  3rd  5.5 
2007  46-50  3rd  11.0 
2008  48-50  4th  9.5 
2009  46-47  4th  11.0 

2010  48-46  4th  11.0 
2011  49-49  4th  11.0 
2012  46-47  5th  11.0 
2013  45-51  5th  12.5 
2014  51-48  2nd  3.0 
2015  47-47  3rd  4.5 
2016  54-42  3rd  1.0 
2017  44-51  5th  9.0 
2018  44-52  4th  23.5 
2019  38-62  4th  27.5 

2020 ---------
2021  48-43  3rd  7.0 
2022  50-43  3rd  14.5 
2023  54-43  3rd  5.5 
2024  45-54  5th  15.5 
2025  58-41  1st

First place? It's unusual enough for the Blue Jays to be in second place this late in the season. It's happened just twice since the championship years. Once was 2014, when the Jays were three games back of the Orioles on this date. They would win six in a row to close out the month and were in second place, 1.5 games back, by the end of July. But they didn't do much at the deadline on that occasion (they traded Liam Hendriks and Erik Kratz to the Royals for Danny Valencia) and they played like a Very Disappointed Group afterward, losing 16 of their next 22 to fall right out of the race.

The other time was 2000, Jim Fregosi's second (and final) year in the dugout. On this date, the Jays were just half a game behind the Yankees. Well, sort of - they were four games back in the loss column, having managed to play 97 games to that point (the Yankees had only played 90.) But the Jays were obviously in contention, and Gord Ash went to work. The 2000 team had a league average offense, with a couple of obvious holes n the lineup. In the last ten days before the deadline, both right fielder Raul Mondesi and second baseman Homer Bush would suffer season-ending injuries. The bigger problem was the pitching, which, once you got past David Wells, was pretty lousy. 

So Ash went out and got himself a pair of starting pitchers. He traded pitcher Darwin Cubillan and a minor league shortstop named Michael Young to Texas for Esteban Loaiza. He traded minor league second baseman Brent Abernathy to Tampa Bay for Steve Trachsel and LH reliever Mark Guthrie. A few days later, he picked up Dave Martinez from Texas to replace Mondesi in right field. Utility man Craig Grebeck took over as the everyday second baseman, just as he had the year before when the team discovered Tony Fernandez could no longer play in the middle of the infield.

But in those last ten days before the deadline, the team went 3-7, to fall 4.5 games off the pace. They had a decent August (15-11), but the Yankees had a better one. And then the Jays simply stopped hitting in September. Loaiza and Trachsel did stabilize the pitching staff, and Martinez and Grebeck played as well as anyone could have wished. But it wasn't enough, and the opportunity was there. The Yankees would win the division with an 87-74 record.

Anyway, greenfrog's central point - the Blue Jays haven't often been competing for the division as the deadline approaches certainly stands up. It's life in the AL East.

Matchups!

Mon 21 July - Rodon (10-6, 3.08) vs Gausman (6-7, 4.19)
Tue 22 July - Schittler (1-0, 5.06) vs Scherzer (1-0, 4.70)
Wed 23 July - Fried (11-3, 2.43) vs Bassitt (10-4, 3.89)
New York at Toronto, July 21-23 | 41 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
Glevin - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 05:21 PM EDT (#464026) #
Santander still weeks away from swinging a bat which is basically out for year.
99BlueJaysWay - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 05:51 PM EDT (#464027) #
I’m hoping for 2 wins. That would give the Jays the season series in the event of a tie.
pooks137 - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 06:36 PM EDT (#464028) #
The modern trade deadline, July 31, goes back to the 1986 season (it had been June 15 for decades before.)

TIL about the pre-1986 June 15th trade deadline, a full six weeks before the modern version.

Combined with the fact that the modern season starts much earlier than the 1980s seasons did, that would equate to a deadline almost two months ahead of the current iteration.

Not sure if the August waiver trading period existed in the 80s as it did in the modern game up until relatively recently. Which would at least allow a little bit more emergency flexibility for injuries and poor performance.

Magpie - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 07:05 PM EDT (#464029) #
that would equate to a deadline almost two months ahead of the current iteration.

Indeed. For example, at the deadline in 1976, the Orioles and Yankees made an enormous trade. The Yankees got Ken Holtzman and Doyle Alexander (a pending free agent) along with LH reliever Grant Jackson and backup catcher Elrod Hendricks. Holtzman and Alexander went straight into the rotation. The Orioles got quality LH starter Rudy May; they also got LH reliever Tippy Martinez, backup catcher Rick Dempsey (who became the regular in Baltimore) and a couple of pitching prospects, one of whom turned out to be Scott McGregor.

An enormous deal. And both teams still had more than 100 games left to play.
pooks137 - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 07:14 PM EDT (#464030) #
I've been banging on the long reliever drum all season long. Or the lack thereof.

TBH, I'd forgotten about Robinson Pina still being on the roster. But I'm still disappointed he's been dispatched.

The Jays are once again running without a multi-inning reliever for mop up duty and early exits for the starters.

I hope they at least keep Pina stretched out in Buffalo for some very deep SP depth. He's a waste as yet another middling middle reliever or some sort of 2-inning hybrid like they sort of did with Schultz.
greenfrog - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 07:14 PM EDT (#464031) #
Excellent pitching by Gausman to Grisham, Judge and Chisholm T1. He changed speeds and location effectively. 10 pitches, three up, three down (2 Ks). Doesn’t get much better than that.
92-93 - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 07:17 PM EDT (#464032) #
All-righty lineup tonight against the southpaw Rodon, except Loperfido who has handled lefties well the last couple of years in the minors. I guess they'll give Kirky off tomorrow vs. the righty.

Fisher and Nance are probably down tonight, but the rest of the bullpen should be available. Every member of the Yankees pen has thrown at least 27 pitches over the last 3 days, and their closer has thrown 20 & 18 the last couple of days. Both clubs will be looking to get into the bullpen early, so it's important to have quality ABs.
greenfrog - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 07:22 PM EDT (#464033) #
Rodon was sharp in the first inning. 7 pitches to get three outs.
SK in NJ - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 07:51 PM EDT (#464034) #
Santander doesn't appear close to coming back. I think you have to add a bat at the deadline, even if it's just a platoon one.
greenfrog - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 08:14 PM EDT (#464035) #
Suarez would look pretty good in the middle of this Blue Jays lineup…
Gerry - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 08:41 PM EDT (#464036) #
I have yet to see a team this season who plays defense as good as the Jays do.
Marc Hulet - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 08:45 PM EDT (#464037) #
There's been a bit of a New York friendly strike zone so far.

Great AB by Schneider... he had a month's worth of Ernie Clement's ABs in one plate appearance against Rodon.
Magpie - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 09:16 PM EDT (#464038) #
Did I hear that right? It sounded like Siddall, describing Peraza reacting to Straw busting it up the line, said "Holy F**k!"

I must have misheard it!
Magpie - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 09:16 PM EDT (#464039) #
Or is it Caleb? I get the two of them mixed up all the time.
Katie - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 09:20 PM EDT (#464040) #
It was Caleb.

And I heard it, too.
92-93 - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 09:21 PM EDT (#464041) #
Why was Gausman pulled from this game?
Magpie - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 09:27 PM EDT (#464042) #
Why was Gausman pulled from this game?

Schneider insists on taking care of his veteran starters.
greenfrog - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 09:30 PM EDT (#464043) #
Boston lost 3-2 to Philly in 10 innings. So a chance for Toronto to create some additional separation from the teams chasing them for the division lead.
99BlueJaysWay - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 09:55 PM EDT (#464044) #
Great win! So many great contributions! I cannot believe this team!
James W - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 10:01 PM EDT (#464045) #
Not only did Boston lose, but they possibly found the dumbest way to lose a game: a walk-off catcher's interference.
Hodgie - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 10:02 PM EDT (#464046) #
Looks like the Allstar break did Hoffman a world of good.
Glevin - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 10:14 PM EDT (#464047) #
Hoffman looking like his April self. Huge win. Keep rolling over those Yankees!
pooks137 - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 10:14 PM EDT (#464048) #
Was reading on MLBTR that the Dodgers pitched Lou Trivino 3 nights in a row against the Brewers then DFAed him today. Ouch.

I checked as well. All 3 appearances were proper 4-5 batters faced, 15-20 pitch outings. No single digit pitch one out Houdini call upons.

Trivino is 33 and had a 3.76 ERA with the Dodgers upon dismissal.

The broadcast has made such a big deal that the Jays won't let any of their relievers pitch 3 days in a row.

While it doesn't seem advisable, how many teams in the league hold to the Jays hard & fast rule vs those that will go their pen thrice when needed?
scottt - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 10:35 PM EDT (#464049) #
Apparently the Jays have approached the Orioles about Soto and Dominguez.
John Northey - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 11:05 PM EDT (#464050) #
Yankee fans must be going nuts about now. This is so much fun. A lot like '85 when the Jays had to beat the Yankees for the division. A lot of differences, but the joy and fun is there. Everyone contributing, even Jimenez which shocked me.
hypobole - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 11:13 PM EDT (#464051) #
Jays win 11 in a row at home for the 1st time ever, breaking their 40 year old Exhibition Stadium record.
hypobole - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 11:41 PM EDT (#464052) #
The 3 games in a row I remember was Ken Giles coming back from injury which promptly landed him on the IL again shortly before the trade deadline in 2019. Montoyo.
Magpie - Monday, July 21 2025 @ 11:51 PM EDT (#464053) #
While it doesn't seem advisable, how many teams in the league hold to the Jays hard & fast rule vs those that will go their pen thrice when needed?

I've actually looked into this twice over the decades! Wayback in 2007, I began to suspect that John Gibbons was reluctant to use a reliever three games in a row. And by the standards pf 2007, it was true - he'd done so just 6 times all year. Meanwhile Joe Maddon has used someone three games in a row 23 times, a bunch of others four games in a row and twice he had Shawn Camp pitch in five straight ganes.

Fifteen years later, when I happened to be looking again, it had almost vanished from the entire league, which used a reliever three games in a row just 19 times. Fifteen teams, more than a thousand games.

That was in 2022, and I can't imagine it's grown more common since.
greenfrog - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 08:45 AM EDT (#464054) #
The 2025 Blue Jays team on July 22 (great record; modest run differential) is an interesting contrast with the 2015 Blue Jays team on July 22 (.500 record; strong run differential).

Yes, the 2025 team has been good for quite a while. (Incidentally, on June 6, I mentioned that "the MLB team is looking pretty good" and "the present and the future are starting to look bright again"; I think many of us felt that way at the time. The team has since gone 26-12, a .684 winning percentage). But it still might be a good idea to power up with a couple of impact additions to put the team over the top this year. As Magpie confirmed with historical data, these opportunities to have a dominant season don't come around for Toronto very often.
mathesond - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 09:04 AM EDT (#464055) #
Apropos of nothing, Defector had an interesting column yesterday about phantom players - players that had been called up to the majors but never got into a game. old friend Brian Jeroloman is name-checked. It's paywalled, but I believe non-subscribers are allowed 3 free articles.
Ryan Day - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 09:22 AM EDT (#464056) #
Why was Gausman pulled from this game?

The Yankees top of the order was due up in the 8th. Normally I'm a fan of letting starters pitch longer, but also can't blame Schneider for not wanting to see if Gausman was starting to get tired vs Judge et al with only a 3-run lead.
SK in NJ - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 09:47 AM EDT (#464058) #
Seems to be some rumblings on social media about Gregory Soto. I could see the Jays acquiring him. They are probably looking for a 2nd high leverage LH reliever to take some pressure away from Little, and Soto has a similar profile. Dominguez wouldn't be a bad option either, but I think you try to aim a little higher to add a 1A closer to pair with Hoffman. If the Jays could pull off something like Bednar plus Soto, then the pen starts to look playoff ready, especially if Garcia can get healthy as well.
dalimon5 - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 10:16 AM EDT (#464059) #
Seems like most (fans and pundits) are expecting this FO to acquire either:

A) 1-2 very good RP arms to pair with Hoffman and 1 ace or very strong #2 SP like Ryan to head the rotation with Gausman

or

B) 1-2 very good RP arms to pair with Hoffman and 1 impact power bat like Suarez to put behind Vlad

Short of that I expect most to be disappointed with the deadline acquisitions. My dream is Kwan and Smith from Cleveland and Duran from Minnesota. I'd trade out Yesavage, Nimalla Tiedemann, Stephen, Roden and Schneider for that.
hypobole - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 10:18 AM EDT (#464060) #
The 2015 team is still viewed as a huge success in Toronto, because it was. The deadline moves turned it into a juggernaut.

But it's also a bit of a cautionary tale. A good part of the success by fans standards is rooted in the fact the Jays hadn't even made the playoffs in 22 years. That juggernaut ended up winning 5 playoff games and never even made the World Series. Would that team be considered a success and so fondly remembered in New York or LA?



dalimon5 - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 10:26 AM EDT (#464061) #
Speaking of LA I just read that their closer was injured. So year, basically they will trade for the top relief arm or two and then the rest of the contenders will fight for whatever remains.

Bad news for Toronto.
scottt - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 10:44 AM EDT (#464062) #
Soto is great against left bats but just average against right bats. He'd be a huge improvement as second lefty. Dominguez is deadly against right bats, but bad against left bats. Useful, but in small doses.

The Jays already have Rodriguez.
dalimon5 - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 10:50 AM EDT (#464063) #
Breaking: Jays interested in Keller.

I think I'm just going to stop looking for updates and just follow Passan.
Marc Hulet - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 10:59 AM EDT (#464064) #
Trade deadline and winter meetings are especially the times to ignore anyone but the legit journalists. Most rumors are fake or blown out of proportion.

There really aren't a lot of big names truly available. Mostly it's only impending FAs and impact names from that group are few.

The Jays will likely focus on the pen and depth.
scottt - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 11:12 AM EDT (#464065) #
Those Yankees games are just like the postseason. Maximum pressure. Guys who do the job here are good enough.
earlweaverfan - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 11:49 AM EDT (#464066) #
Hypobole, I agree about the cautionary tale. Even when the near-term odds seem the best (relatively) that they’ve been in recent memory, the absolute odds can often still be against us. But the only downside of going “all-in” is if you so badly mortgage your future for the subsequent years, that you end up feeling that the price you paid wasn’t worth the short-term opportunity you bet on. Of course, I would regret having our team uncompetitive in years 26 to 28, but I feel the demonstrated willingness of Rogers to pony up for free agents could mitigate that risk.

And if we do make the World Series this year - yes, a big if - the ancillary benefits are prolific. Free agents (and their agents) will take us more seriously. Many of these will sign up to be a part of the mystical brand. Total viewership will continue to grow nationwide. Our draft picks, like this year, will all sign with us to enlist with this amazing success story. In a city where hockey still reigns supreme, baseball could rise to the top of the public interest league tables once again.

After we won the NBA for just one year, even though our star was just a one-year rental, I heard very few regrets. Even if we had not made those finals, so many people I know were so excited to be a part of the wave which that signing created.

One more thing; for years I have hoped that the Jays would recruit the best available hitting coaches. For years, I have also wondered when someone would invent a coaching machine that accurately mimics each distinctive pitch type of each opposing pitcher. This year we have both these assets and I am very hopeful that this helps explain how our bottom 5+ hitters are performing so surprisingly well. Even more, I am convinced that, while these capabilities may not guarantee our future teams maintain a high ceiling, they should reinforce our current high floor for as long as the jays emphasize coachable players.


earlweaverfan - Tuesday, July 22 2025 @ 11:54 AM EDT (#464067) #
Scottt, what have you heard about Coulombe as a possible lefty acquisition?
New York at Toronto, July 21-23 | 41 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.