Batter's Box Interactive Magazine - Jays Close to Extension With Rios

Or so says Ken Rosenthal who has scooped all the local writers.

Looks like 6 years, $65 million with a $15 million option for 2015. The deal apparently kicks in after this season and would cover the 2009-2014 seasons covering Rios' last two arbitration years and 4 years of free agency. He's 27 right now (February birthday) so the deal is for his age 28-33 seasons.

Last month I thought that 5 years for $50 million would be fair. This seems to be in that range, but a year longer (and two if it happens to be a player option).

It's a year or two longer than I would have liked, and we don't know if Ricciardi gave another player a no-trade or opt out options, but overall it's hard not to like the team's best position player locked up. You're certainly never going to be able to get a free agent like him for that price.

Posted by Pistol on Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 08:49 AM EDT.

Jays Close to Extension With Rios | 55 comments | Create New Account

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christaylor - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 10:37 AM EDT (#181411) #

Great news. I have a feeling that this is going to save us from really suffering from the Wells deal (he can always shift to LF).

Jimbag - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 10:38 AM EDT (#181412) #

Sounds like a fair deal to me - with Wells and Rios locked up long term and Snider making very good progress, the Jays OF looks well stocked for the future. And if Lind can fulfill his early promise, things just look that much better.

SK in NJ - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 11:01 AM EDT (#181413) #

Great move. With a team lacking impact talent, holding on to the few they have is a great step forward.

Hopefully Lind and Snider both pan out. That would give the Jays a great set of bats moving forward.

CaramonLS - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 11:01 AM EDT (#181414) #

Rios as a RF the next 2 years = mediocre deal. Rios as a CF for the next 4 after that = Good deal.

Pistol - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 11:19 AM EDT (#181415) #

Sure he has a little more value in CF than RF, but he's a highly productive RF. This had him as the second best AL RF last year and he's a top notch defensive OF as well. He was 8th overall in Win shares among all OFs and 3rd behind Vlad (who DHs a fair amount) and Magglio.

Mike Green - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 11:36 AM EDT (#181417) #

To add to what Pistol said, Rios has been losing a little bit of range each year as he fills out. That is totally normal. His overall value over the next 6 years, either as a slightly below average defensive centerfielder or as an above average defensive rightfielder, would be pretty comparable.

CaramonLS - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 11:37 AM EDT (#181418) #

...And a lot of guys in the AL had big down years.

Rios should consistently be a #10 RF in MLB in terms of offensive production, but as decent as that is, I prefer to have my corner slots filled with a Left handed power bat. There is actually a good chance that Rios could be the least productive RF in the AL East as early as next year.

rtcaino - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 12:17 PM EDT (#181419) #

"...And a lot of guys in the AL had big down years.

Rios should consistently be a #10 RF in MLB in terms of offensive production, but as decent as that is, I prefer to have my corner slots filled with a Left handed power bat. There is actually a good chance that Rios could be the least productive RF in the AL East as early as next year."

Ya between him and Vern you aren't exactly mashing righties.

AR (2007) .283/.334/.468/.802

VW (2007) .226/.280/.387/.667

VW (Career) .275/.317/.467/.784

Shane - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 12:55 PM EDT (#181424) #

Rios as a RF the next 2 years = mediocre deal. Rios as a CF for the next 4 after that = Good deal.

Right. So in theory Rios to center and Wells to RF/LF?? So then Wells can be be grossly overpaid as a corner outfielder. What's the difference?

Jdog - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 01:01 PM EDT (#181425) #

There is actually a good chance that Rios could be the least productive RF in the AL East as early as next year.

There is also a chance that he is the most productive RF in the entire American league as soon as this year.

CaramonLS - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 01:08 PM EDT (#181426) #

There is also a chance that he is the most productive RF in the entire American league as soon as this year.

Wager? There is ZERO chance he is the top RF in the AL this year.

CaramonLS - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 01:16 PM EDT (#181427) #

Right. So in theory Rios to center and Wells to RF/LF??

Rios will likely be better in CF defensively as early as next season, and probably 2-3 years at the very most. You want the better defender in the tougher position.

So then Wells can be be grossly overpaid as a corner outfielder. What's the difference?

True, it wont make much difference as there is still a combined salary of roughly 28 million per year between the two positions - but you might as well get the most out of the sunk cost you've invested in. Perhaps the person who offered said contract should take this as a lesson.

Ryan Day - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 01:37 PM EDT (#181429) #

There is ZERO chance he is the top RF in the AL this year.

Really? Who's the main competition - Ordonez, who had an exceptional career year, and Guerrero, who DHs a bunch of the time. Markakis was about even. Perhaps I'm missing someone, but it looks like Rios would figure to be at least among the top five, and the quirks of fate combined with the fact he should be hitting his prime years suggest there's a pretty reasonable - at least non-zero - chance he's the best in the league.

Pistol - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 01:54 PM EDT (#181432) #

I prefer to have my corner slots filled with a Left handed power bat

How many of these exist in baseball? Brad Hawpe and Corey Hart were the only two with a Slg% over .500 last season (and Hawpe is Coors inflated).

SheldonL - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 02:18 PM EDT (#181433) #

Vernon Wells is by far among the top 3 defensive centerfielders in the AL. His 3 gold gloves prove that. Yes, there's concern about how he'll age, but he's an exceptional athlete and he reads balls off the bat better than other centerfielders. His range is so spectacular that he makes hard catches look easy.

As for Rios, at his floor, he'll produce .295 avg, 25 homers, 40 doubles. His range like Wells is exceptional and his arm's a canon... there are plenty of potential doubles that are reduced to singles thanks to that arm. He still has trouble reading balls off the bat but he'll only improve.

Right now, the sky's the limit really for Rios. He's got the speed to steal a ton of bases(but stealing is more mental than speed). He's got the power to be among the league leaders in homers(his body has yet to fill out). Finally, he's got a good stroke that can make him challenge for a batting title.

I'm not saying he's going to become a triple threat but I think that he'll do very well and we'll get equal value for the $65 mil that we're spending.

Moreover, don't look at the exorbitant Wells contract... look at the $126+65= $191/13years. That's well worth the impact that these two outfielders have on our team.

PS: on a side note, I was quite displeased with the Nathan contract, the twins chose to invest $47 mil into a closer when they've already got a pretty good one in Neshek waiting in the wings. If they were smart, they should've dealt Nathan for another young starter and invested in Liriano instead! My heart cries out for the small market Twins... remember, there was a time when we were small market... can you imagine the 2002 Jays signing B.J Ryan to a $47mil deal!?

seeyou - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 02:27 PM EDT (#181435) #

Rotoworld is reporting that Reed Johnson has signed a one-year deal with the Cubbies.

Good to see Reed land on his feet so quickly in a what should be a good situation for him (I've always thought he was more suited to an NL style of play, and he should get solid ABs platooning with Pie in CF).

Shane - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 02:50 PM EDT (#181436) #

Perhaps the person who offered said contract should take this as a lesson.

Absolutely.

zeppelinkm - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 02:52 PM EDT (#181437) #

1) Vernon Wells is definitely, no longer "by far" one of the top 3 defensive CF'ers in the AL. His 3 gold gloves do not prove that. They prove that during those years, he was viewed by the voters as one of the best. His first 2 I think were deserved, the 3rd, certainly not.

2) CameronLS is right. Vernon and Rios should flip flop positions. Vernon has not looked nearly as good these past 2 seasons as he did the 5 before them. Rios will be better then Vernon in CF this year then Vernon would be, and if not, certainly would be the year after. Vernon, then, subsequently, would probably still be above average RF so it would be a net gain to the TO offence. And with Stairs and Stewart taking turns patrolling LF............

3) Finally, as much as I like Vernon, and I like him a fair deal, his floor, as you said Sheldon, is not .270 with 25 HR's and 36 doubles. For Vernon's floor I refer you to last year (.245/.304/.402). I know he was injured, but if you're talking worst case scenarios (which a 'floor performance' would be), the worst case for Vernon would be that shoulder injury doesn't quite go away and he is like he was last year.

But finally, I think Rios still has improvement left in him offensively for sure and probably defensively as well too. He's worth the signing, and certainly I think, a viable candidate to be one of the top 3 overall RF's in baseball next year with some modest improvement (which I'd rather refer to as growth in his case!) to a couple areas of his game.

Overall, anyway you slice it, great deal, me thinks.

Anders - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 03:06 PM EDT (#181438) #

There is actually a good chance that Rios could be the least productive RF in the AL East as early as next year.

Really? Win Shares had Rios as the 8th best outfielder in the AL last year. He falls a bit if you look at offensive contributions only, but I would certainly take him over Markakis, Drew, Abreu and whoever replaces Rocco Baldelli in Tampa heading forward.

greenfrog - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 03:15 PM EDT (#181439) #

I like the deal as outlined, but I'm waiting to see if it includes another opt-out clause, which IMO would significantly devalue the contract (from a team perspective).

Amazing that Vernon's contract is close to double what Rios is getting. You could make a pretty compelling argument that Rios is already the more valuable player.

I just wish our farm system were deeper. We need more talented youth to complement the team's nucleus of Wells, Rios, Halladay and co. But I'm happy nonetheless.

greenfrog - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 03:16 PM EDT (#181440) #

seeyou - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 03:18 PM EDT (#181442) #

At his position, even if he hits at his floor - ie. .270 with 25 homers, 36 doubles - he's still above average for a centerfielder. His arm is not Ichiro's but it's still pretty strong. Then, there's his potential - ie. .310avg, 35 homers, 50 doubles - that combined with his exceptional defense make him a potential MVP candidate.

I think Wells' floor is defined by his performance last year: .245 with 16 homers and 36 doubles. The figure you gave for his floor is about what I'd hope would be his average performance over the life of this contract, with some seasons closer to his 2006, but some also closer to his 2007, especially as he ages.

seeyou - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 03:24 PM EDT (#181443) #

I see Zeppelin was a little faster on the uptake in making that point, I concur with what he said.

Shane - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 03:45 PM EDT (#181445) #

Considering the age & health of Wells and Rolen - they are what they are or were... Rios and Hill will be here a long while doing what they do...Snider coming up in 09'ish....Whoever's at shortstop and catcher are likely to be pretty moderate offensive producers...I really think the Blue Jays are going to need some major offensive talent at one or both of 1B and DH in the years to come. No Catalanotto's and Geronimo Berroa's. And whoever's going to fill those spots, he/they are not currently in this organization. I disregard Overbay, and still wish they'd never targeted him for trade, because once they did, obviously Ricciardi's going to want to sign him longterm considering the talent he gave up to get him. Unless hes' putting up 50 plus doubles year in year out, I hope they swallow hard and upgrade there at some point. Adam Dunn would be nice.

John Northey - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 04:22 PM EDT (#181447) #

To me the big issue is the amount invested in an area of potential strength. In the outfield we have our top two hitting prospects charging hard for the majors (Lind & Snider). It is also the easiest position to find someone half decent for outside of first base (see Stairs, Johnson being let go, Stewart begging for a job).

The big concerns going forward (past 2010) are third base, shortstop, first base, and catcher. We have a couple of prospects for catcher thus not a major fear at this point, plus there is bound to be a few Zaun like guys available for a song due to injury issues and the variation in defensive viewpoints. Shortstop looks very, very ugly for a long time coming (are there any prospects?) while third has a couple of guys in the low minors who might be decent in time for the end of the Rolen era. First will probably get the least qualified defensive guy from the outfield battle if both Lind and Snider make it.

So, $30+ million for two outfield slots plus a rotation of Halladay ($15+ in 2011 - I figure the Jays will sign him up again) and the kids (McGowan, Marcum, Litsch will be reaching arbitration by 2011). That leaves very little (based on how the Jays are being run at the moment) to afford a free agent for the big ugly area, shortstop (unless you feel McDonald/Eckstein is a good combo).

Still, Rios will be worth more than $10-15 million a year if he can keep in the 800-900 OPS range with solid defense. The key now is for the Jays to find top quality shortstop prospects by hook or crook. Sigh. If only JP listened to his crew back when eh?

Mike Green - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 04:34 PM EDT (#181449) #

The odds are very high that at least one of Lind or Snider will be at first base or DH within a few years.

Shane - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 04:53 PM EDT (#181451) #

greenfrog - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 05:05 PM EDT (#181453) #

All valid points. We do have a few glaring (and seemingly perpetual) positional needs. I could see Snider or Lind at 1B in a couple of years, assuming Snider isn't too short. Do you need to be a certain height to play an effective 1B?

However, I think pitching is an equally pressing need going forward. At the moment, we have some good young bullpen arms; I could see a 2010 relief corps that includes Ryan, Accardo, League, Cecil, Downs, and maybe Magnusson. But the rotation is pretty hazy. Will Halladay continue to be an elite starter? Who will replace AJ? Can McGowan, Marcum and Litsch sustain their initial success? Apart from Purcey (who is still unproven, despite his AFL showing), are there any potential front-of-the-rotation starters in the minors?

timpinder - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 05:32 PM EDT (#181455) #

The future at shortstop certainly does look bleak. The Jays are fine at C (Arencibia, Collins, Thigpen, Diaz, Jeroloman), 3B post-Rolen (Ahrens, Fuenmayor, Tolisano), and 1B/DH (Lind, Chavez could be converted, Kreuzer might surprise).

The time is this off-season to lock up a SS for 4-years or more and hope that Jackson pans out as a 23 year old in 2013. If Burnett opts out, and a bonus would be if Thomas doesn't get his option, the Jays will have $20 million per year off the books. Furcal, Renteria and Cabrera could be free agents this year. Furcal, who'll be 30 years old, probably will be available since the Dodgers have a nice SS prospect in the wings. In the meantime, the Jays need to target shortstops in the draft.

As for Lind, he'd make a fine 1B/DH. In the minors he's averaged a .317 AVG, .378 OBP, .506 SLG (.884 OPS). In 2006, between AA and the Majors, he hit 26 homers and 39 doubles in just 517 at-bats, and had an OPS near 1.000. Dude can hit. After originally demolishing ML pitching, he struggled before starting to figure it out near the end of the year. I think that's normal, especially for a 23 year old. Check out Baseball-Reference splits and compare to Lind to Hill. They followed almost the exact same pattern, except that Hill was given the opportunity to battle through it while Lind will learn to adjust in AAA. If Lind is here, he'll hit. I expect him to prove himself in AAA this year and continue to hit over .300 and slug over .500. The fact that he hits left-handed is a nice bonus.

timpinder - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 05:40 PM EDT (#181458) #

I'm really not worried about the pitching either. I know the Jays should have taken Tulowitski, but don't dismiss Romero. He could be a good #3 starter as early as next year. He has the makeup and the stuff, and could rebound from an off-year, which was also injury plagued. Janssen will likely be a bullpen arm post-surgery, and I could see a rotation of Halladay, McGowan, Purcey, Marcum, Romero panning out, with Litsch still there and Cecil pounding on the door. I remember everyone used to talk about the how terrible the Yankee's system was and then Cano and Wang came out of nowhere.

The Jays have nobody at SS, but it's not that bad everywhere else, and I'm still a Romero believer.

Where's MyLegacy when you need him? It's gloomy in here.

Anders - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 06:17 PM EDT (#181463) #

Adam Lind? For my money and time, he's not going to amount anything resembling someone you should consider settiling with if you're trying to create a top flight American League club. Snider, yes sir you betcha, Lind, no way. He looks like a, how do they say, a 'chit' to me. Am I way off base here?

Everybody's favourite game - Guess that Player!
Player A: AA/22 - .310/.354/.543
Player B: AA/23 - .301/.404/.513

Player A: AAA/22+23 - .335/.403/.519
Player B: AAA/24 - .290/.359/.515

Which player would you rather have? The number of PAs dont quite match up (Player B had about 150 more each sample) but both players played in the Eastern League and International League in the last couple of years, with relatively comparable results. Obviously this doesn't 'prove' anything, but Player A is Adam Lind and Player B is Curtis Granderson, who was one of the best 10 hitting outfielders in baseball last year.

Anders - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 06:26 PM EDT (#181464) #

Miguel Cabrera is about to get paid.

8 years, 152.3 million.

Pistol - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 06:28 PM EDT (#181466) #

Bye-bye Sal Fasano.

westcoast dude - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 06:29 PM EDT (#181467) #

Kudos to Jason Jackson for his 2-out RBI triple in the ninth inning, yesterday, to go with his walk. When was the last time we could use the words "triple" and "shortstop" in the same sentence? His early promise seems intact and what is more important, he can feel good about his game and have fun, too. Scott Rolen's fickle finger of fate is Buck Coats' opportunity.

Hard to get excited about the Rios contract until it's finalized, but I give both sides full marks. Blue Jays are a Class Act.

Shane - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 09:23 PM EDT (#181481) #

Obviously this doesn't 'prove' anything, but Player A is Adam Lind and Player B is Curtis Granderson, who was one of the best 10 hitting outfielders in baseball last year.

Hmmm. Those were PECOTA comp's back in 2006, yes.

melondough - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 10:50 PM EDT (#181485) #

Found it....ESPN reports Marcum and Burnett may not head north with the team and they both are behind in their recoveries. My guess is that they will make their scheduled starts on time but may not go to Phily for the exhibition.

http://sports.espn.go.com/fantasy/baseball/flb/story?page=roberts032508

The report also says that Ryan's sore elbow is a bad sign.

John Northey - Tuesday, March 25 2008 @ 11:37 PM EDT (#181489) #

Oy. Only good thing about the injuries right now is that they all get some spring time to heal.

Bad thing is April will be a killer. Normally there are a lot of days off in April but this year just 3 days, the 1st, 7th and 28th. 3 games vs NYY, 5 vs Boston, 4 vs Detroit, 3 against an improving (and always a pain in the butt) Tampa team, 3 vs Oakland (who knows what they'll be this year), 5 vs Texas, 2 Baltimore, 3 vs KC. So a total of 12 against serious playoff contenders, 6 against tough young teams, 5 against a team that normally drives your pitching staff nuts (Texas) and 5 against the also-rans. Not a good month to be missing your closer of '06, your setup man from '07, and possibly 2 of your '08 starters and your third baseman.

Might as well check the rest of the schedule...

May isn't any better with just one off-day and a west coast trip at the end without a day off before heading out. If the Jays are over 500 and within 5 games after May I think we should be very happy.

June? Finally a chance to make up ground with 4 off-days and 3 vs Baltimore, 4 vs Seattle (I suspect they'll collapse this year), 3 vs Pittsburgh, 3 vs Cincinnati, plus 6 more vs the NL Central contending Cubs & Brewers (ie: 500 teams).

July has the All-Star break (4 days for the Jays) plus 3 other days off to help the team stay in shape. Seattle, Tampa, Baltimore take up 18 of the games while NYY and LAA get 6 games. Another month to gain ground.

August things get tough again with just one day off and 12 games vs NYY and Boston plus 7 vs Cleveland & Detroit. This month could hurt big time.

September has 3 off-days (including Labour Day for some reason) with 9 vs Boston/NY and 16 vs also rans ChiSox, Baltimore, Tampa Bay, and Minnesota (6 are Baltimore games). Good chance to end strong after a tough August.

Jdog - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 12:00 AM EDT (#181491) #

ok John,

curious as to which one is the young up and comer and which isn't (KC or Oakland). Pretty sure Tampa is the other of the 2

Seamus - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 12:21 AM EDT (#181493) #

That's the first time I've heard about Marcum still being affected by his leg injury...

timpinder - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 12:43 AM EDT (#181494) #

Well, I hope that report is wrong. Janssen, Burnett and Marcum all out to start the season? I can't see it happening though. I'd take Burnett with just a fastball, second rate changeup and wild curveball over Banks. Funny there hasn't even been a whisper about Marcum until this ESPN source writes about how he heard a rumour.

Anders - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 12:50 PM EDT (#181503) #

It's one thing for Ken Rosenthal to scoop the Jays beat writers - he's one of the best in the business. It's another thing for a guy who writes about fantasy baseball who know one has ever heard of to cite 'rumours' and say that two Jays pitchers aren't coming North. Colour me skeptical.

mendocino - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 05:39 PM EDT (#181517) #

Some minor league house cleaning

Toronto Blue Jays
Signed: OF Chad Mottola
Released: RHP Gary Lee, RHP Adam Rogers, RHP Russ Savickas, RHP Aaron Tressler, RHP Orlando Trias, LHP Ryan Ketchner, LHP Chris Reddout, 2B Carlo Cota, OF Ben Zeskind
Optioned to Triple-A: LHP Bill Murphy

jlowenstein - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 05:57 PM EDT (#181519) #

Colour me skeptical.

Do you really want to be the one who bets against a last minute announcement from JP to the effect of "Marcum and Burnett to start season on DL?" Ah... it just wouldn't be spring without the constant possibility of a JP 'injury-gate' situation to rile up Jays fans and reporters alike. That said, I expect both to make their expected starts.

timpinder - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 06:44 PM EDT (#181522) #

There's a nice up to date preview of the Jays at ESPN, and it looks promising. I think that Thomas' numbers will be a little worse and Rolen's numbers will be better, but other than that I'd agree with the predictions, more or less. On the pitching side, I don't see Marcum finishing with an ERA that's better than both Burnett and McGowan, but I guess we'll see.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/preview08/team?team=tor

HollywoodHartman - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 07:37 PM EDT (#181523) #

Wilner has the scoop, and get off the ledge boys because it was just a misunderstanding.

" When we were all scrumming J.P. Monday night in Sarasota to get the latest on Scott Rolen�s finger surgery, the G.M. mentioned that Burnett and Marcum wouldn�t accompany the team to Philadelphia for those last two pre-season games Friday night and Saturday. The ESPN reporter (none of us knew who he was) heard J.P. say they weren�t going to be �coming north to Philly� and must have assumed that the fingernail thing and last year�s Marcum knee surgery were going to hold them back, which couldn�t be further from the truth."

ANationalAcrobat - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 07:50 PM EDT (#181524) #

That's excellent news, HH.

Litsch is throwing a gem through 3 against the Reds: no hits allowed, one strikeout, no walks, and 7 of 8 outs by the groundball. Hill and Scutaro have made errors. The Reds' lineup is without Dunn or Brandon Philips.

ANationalAcrobat - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 08:19 PM EDT (#181525) #

Were it not for those 2 errors early in the game, Litsch would be doing something pretty special right now. Through 5, he's at 12 groundouts, 2 flyouts, and 1 strikeout.

HollywoodHartman - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 08:27 PM EDT (#181526) #

Jesse also hit Jerry Hairston Jr. with a pitch.

In that ESPN link Timpinder posted a bunch of writers predict the Jays record. All have them finishing in third.

Stark, Kurkjian, Olney, Law, and Phillips have them winning 84, 86, 90(!), 86 and 88 wins respectively.

Jeff Passan also named McGowan as his dark horse candidate for the Cy.

timpinder - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 09:20 PM EDT (#181527) #

Those ESPN writers will be proven wrong (except Olney was pretty close). Wells is stinging the ball and is back. Overbay is back. Rolen is (was) back and won't be out long, and Thomas just hit a homerun. Eckstein is finally hitting and Rios should turn it on soon. This team is being underestimated. I haven't been this optimistic in a decade and a half. It seems everyone is remembering the offense of 2007 and not 2006. Overbay, Wells and Rolen are just as likely, if not more likely, to repeat 2006 as they are 2007.

I can't wail until Monday.

Thomas - Wednesday, March 26 2008 @ 10:49 PM EDT (#181529) #

There are a few familiar faces among those released by other teams as clubs got around to doing some minor league house-cleaning. Two of the more familiar are Vince Perkins (former Blue Jay prospect and Canadian who was lost on waivers to Milwaukee and subsequently got injured; cut by the White Sox) and Dave Gassner (included along with Stewart in the Kielty deal, made 2 MLB appearances for the Twins; cut by the Reds). Jovial Matt LeCroy also may have played his last game in the bigs, as he was released by the Oakland A's. There are a few names of interest among those released by other teams, but I'd first want to see how the existing players in the system fit and where further organizational depth may be needed.

scottt - Thursday, March 27 2008 @ 07:32 AM EDT (#181533) #

Starting lineup yesterday was:

Eckstein
Stewart
Rios
Wells
Thomas
Overbay
Hill
Scutaro
Zaun

I like that much better than the previous lineups. I wonder if we'll see Stairs in the 2 slot. Overbay 2nd and Stairs 6th would work too.

VBF - Thursday, March 27 2008 @ 08:34 AM EDT (#181535) #

Last year Overbay was pretty mediocre hitting in the second spot last year. In fact, I recall an article where he was quoted as saying something along the lines of "hitting second really changed my approach and was a big deal". I'd be inclined to put Overbay where he is most comfortable, at least to start the season.

Also, definitely not a fan of batting Vernon in the cleanup. I'd like to see Thomas there, Overbay behind him and Wells following. You can also avoid some double plays if you have Vernon hitting in front of Hill.

timpinder - Thursday, March 27 2008 @ 11:07 AM EDT (#181542) #

I don't mind Wells hitting cleanup against lefties. Against righties though, if Gibbons must have Eckstein-Rios-Wells at the top of the order, I'd bat Stairs cleanup. It breaks up the lefties and moves Frank to the 5th spot until he proves he's can still bop:

Eckstein
Rios
Wells
Stairs
Thomas
Overbay
Hill
Zaun
Scutaro

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