Batter's Box Interactive Magazine - 28 June 2007: What's the New Mary Jane?

28 June 2007: What's the New Mary Jane?

A few odds, a few ends. Consider the mighty Red Sox.

Boston still holds a comfortable 9 game lead in the AL East. Curiously, they haven't won a series against an AL team since May. They've lost 9 of their last 11 games against AL opposition. As is their custom, they fattened up against the NL (10-5 in June). They've got a nice seven game homestand coming up against two of the AL's weaker teams (Texas and Tampa) - what if they continue to stumble?

Yankees fans are bewildered and distraught - Miguel Cairo as the starting first baseman will do that to people. Something not altogether unlike Panic is wafting through the breeze. My recommendation is to Enjoy the Moment. For one thing, it may not last. This team is better than 36-39...

Yesterday's winning pitchers included Greg Maddux (340), Tom Glavine (297), and John Smoltz (202). Damn, that's lot of wins. It was the first time the three had ever picked up a win on the same day. Between the three of them, they pitched 18 innings, allowing just 1 run.

Ricciardi was asked what happens to Adam Lind when Reed Johnson returns. His response was basically "wait and see" because who knows - maybe someone else will have been injured in the meantime. He acknowledged that Lind has struggled a bit in his first prolonged exposure to major league pitching. But, in his player's defence: a) it's a tough league, most players need some time to adjust; b) Lind has hit everywhere he's gone, and Ricciardi is positive he'll be a good hitter in the major leagues; c) over a full season his numbers work out to something like 18 homers and 70 RBIs, so he hasn't exactly been a black hole.

He was also asked if there had been any thought given to Chacin returning as a reliever. Evidently not - the assumption is that Chacin will take over the fifth spot "unless Josh takes off and runs with it."

Posted by Magpie on Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 12:16 PM EDT.

28 June 2007: What's the New Mary Jane? | 29 comments | Create New Account

The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.

Mike Green - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 12:53 PM EDT (#170784) #

Despite not hitting well, Lind has done a number of other positive things this season. His defence has been fine and getting better. He was mostly a first baseman in college, so it may simply be a matter of advancing up the learning curve. His baserunning is solid. He has gotten down the bunt and delivered the useful sacrifice fly off LOOGies. It all points to a long and successful career. Short term pain for the club (with Lind's weak bat over the first half) leading to long-term gain.

jeff mcl - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 01:23 PM EDT (#170789) #

Congrats Big Hurt!

Matt S - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 01:27 PM EDT (#170790) #

If a player had hit his 500th homerun against the Jays to put his team up 4-0 in the first inning, I'd find it hard to stand up and cheer for him. It would be the right thing to do, but I might be too grouchy to do it. Kudos to the Twins fans.

AWeb - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 01:52 PM EDT (#170795) #

Adding my congrats to Thomas! It looked for a while there he might get passed by a few guys before he made it, but he's turned it around and is now providing what we were hoping he would : .277/.434/.492 in June before today's HR is right in line with last year's numbers, with some extra walks to offset less slugging. And here I am stuck at work, missing it after making a point to see his ABs for the last few days.

danjulien - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 02:29 PM EDT (#170802) #

Congrats Big Hurt!

This is a great game for frustrating pitchers...Silva had a really bad inning but now looks to just be mowing them down...while Burnett...is dominating one batter and not the next, seems quite aggressive today, I'm happy to see he's not nibbling.

I'm trying out a live blog of the game too over at BVTN...I won't link it so as to not advertise but give me comments...

braden - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 03:10 PM EDT (#170806) #

Teams really seem to run at will against the Jays, don't they? It's getting quite frustrating. I'd love to see the Jays employ a catcher with at least an average ability to kill baserunners......

AWeb - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 03:17 PM EDT (#170807) #

On top of slowing down the running game, how about not making 8 errors over 4 games (plus a couple of passed balls), mostly on throws? With Stairs getting a lot more playing time than expected, perhaps he's wearing out a bit?

gottywhat - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 06:14 PM EDT (#170815) #

Yah agreed, certainly not worried about Lind's ability to hit, he seems to be following aaron hills progression, lots of sucess on his initial call up, then struggle next year with more playing time, then "figure it out" (hopefully!) the next year.

Teams really seem to run at will against the Jays, don't they? It's getting quite frustrating. I'd love to see the Jays employ a catcher with at least an average ability to kill baserunners.....

Sal Fasano seemed to be pretty adept at it, hard to justify it considering his ability to wield the lumber though...

BigTimeRoyalsFan - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 07:16 PM EDT (#170818) #

Sal Fasano seemed to be pretty adept at it, hard to justify it considering his ability to wield the lumber though...

Yet, for some reason, JP can justify keeping Phillips on the bench instead of Fasano? How?!?! JP has a tendency to have a crush on a player and see him in a different light than anybody else (i.e. Russ Adams, who he still believes will be a major leaguer one day, despite having done nothing to prove it at any level) Why he would keep Phillips over Fasano I will never understand. And before any tells me it has anything to do with offence, PLEASE. Phillips can't hit for garbage. His career #s are a little more generous, because they take into account the years he was receiving full playing time, which will help anyone's swing. As a backup, there's no reason to assume he is any better than Sal, and I can almost assure you that Sal is superior defensively, and might actually help out a little against teams like Minnesota and their base stealing parades. Not to mention, over their careers, Sal has a higher OPS vs LHP, which in my mind is the only time you should bother starting using the backup catcher anyways (unless of course Jason's career line of .246/.309/.360 vs RHP impresses you)

gottywhat - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 08:06 PM EDT (#170821) #

Well here's how I see it, they put Sal to AAA to mentor Thigpen, for preciesely his defence, as Thigpen is more stick than leather.  Also I think that front office beleived that the runing game could be held in check by both the pitchers and catchers, not just 100% catcher (quicker to the plate, slide step etc.).  The numbers last year were ugly and they had Bengie Molina, who isn't a compete stiff.  So maybe that's why the decided to leave Sal in Triple A.  But point well taken, Sal would help against those pesky teams like the Devil Rays and Twins.

Magpie - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 08:18 PM EDT (#170824) #

Here are the catcher stats going into today's game:

Catcher      ERA Innings    ER  SB CS PKOF 
Phillips     3.89 330.2    148  40  2  1
Zaun         3.95 234.2    103  20  2  0
Fasano       5.91 120.1     79  11  3  0
Thigpen      2.25   4        1   0  0  0

These are pretty small sample sizes, of course. Fasano, for example, caught five games during the 9 game losing streak, and the staff surrendered 43 runs in those games alone. I like Fasano myself - how can you not? - he's a smart guy, and will probably be coaching somewhere for the next twenty years.

It's my understanding that Gibbons is the main Phillips booster, and for what it's worth, he hits at least as well as Fasano and seems to work just fine with the pitchers. This year is his reward for soldiering on dutifully in AAA last year, Fasano's fate this year.

BigTimeRoyalsFan - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 08:45 PM EDT (#170828) #

As you say magpie, those sample sizes are way too small to mean anything. A more thorough breakdown of who caught who would have to be done before we can say that Phillips "calls a better game". The thing I take out of the table is the reason I'd prefer Fasano was the backup - runners are successful 95% of the time stealing on Jason and only 79% on Sal. To be fair, one can say that the sample size is too small for those purposes as well.

gottywhat - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 08:49 PM EDT (#170829) #

a side thought, just thinking about the Jay's outfielders and such, imagine if the Alex Rios/Paul Maholm deal had gone through?

Mike Green - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 10:31 PM EDT (#170831) #

I do think that the word has gotten out that Phillips can be run on pretty much at will. Jason Bartlett becomes Tim Raines. Torii Hunter becomes Eric Davis. While one does not have to throw out 35% of baserunners to be successful, there is, I think, a tipping point. When thieves steal succesfully more than 90% of the time, widespread looting becomes more or less inevitable. When you combine that with an OPS under .600 and no speed on the basepaths and chasing foul balls or choppers in front of the plate, you have to place a huge degree of trust in "intangibles" to justify a spot for him.

tstaddon - Thursday, June 28 2007 @ 11:01 PM EDT (#170833) #

Couldn't agree more, Mike. And anyone who says that throwing out 2 of 42 would-be base-stealers can't be judged on the grounds of a small sample size is absolutely bonkers. Worse, I bet at least twice this season Phillips has thrown the ball away, allowing a runner to advance to third -- which basically means he may as well not bother throwing to second at all.

Obviously several of our pitchers are still too deliberate to the plate, but 2/42 is ridiculous. Cleveland considered moving Victor Martinez off the plate because of numbers like that. So, please, if you're going to offer that defense while hitting .211, maybe you ought to be doing it for Syracuse instead of the big club.

Craig B - Friday, June 29 2007 @ 09:58 AM EDT (#170852) #

Let's not forget Phillips's questionable game-calling. At least one game was blown this year because Phillips kept repeatedly calling for pitches out of the zone.

I can't believe that any other player with a similar recent record of performance would still be with the ballclub.

King Rat - Friday, June 29 2007 @ 01:30 PM EDT (#170869) #

The aspect of the whole backup catcher situation that I don't understand is Thigpen. It seems crazy to me to write him off as a catching prospect without ever trying him there, given that he spent all of his time in the minors as a catcher. So given that I can't see what Phillips brings to the team at all beyond his goggles, I really don't understand why the team won't give Thigpen a few chances behind the plate to either confirm or reject their belief that he's going to have to move.

Also, while I realize that he couldn't hit and only looked good defensively in relation to Phillips, I miss Sal Fasano.

Thomas - Friday, June 29 2007 @ 01:55 PM EDT (#170871) #

In addition to the stolen base numbers and game calling, Phillips gives up a number of passed balls and, from what I remember, has displayed no discernable skill at blocking the plate, something I recall Fasano doing expertly at least once while he was here. There's no evident justification for Phillips over Fasano, especially as Fasano's not as bad of a hitter as he showed during his stint up here. His OPS at Syracuse is about 70 points higher than Phillips' was last year. If Gibbons is the main reason for keeping him on the roster, JP needs to tell him to manage the team he's given, not the team he wants to have.

Mike Green - Friday, June 29 2007 @ 02:22 PM EDT (#170872) #

The issue has arisen before. Believe it or not, it is arguable that Ken Huckaby delivered more value two years ago than Phillips is now.

Ron - Friday, June 29 2007 @ 02:38 PM EDT (#170874) #

I would like to know what the Jays plans are for Thigpen. If I was in charge of the Jays, I wouldn't let him rot on the bench. If the Jays view him as a catcher, he should be backing up Zaun right now or starting at AAA. If the plan for Thigpen is move to 2B, he should be starting at 2B down at AAA. Having him glued to the bench right now doesn't make any sense.

ayjackson - Friday, June 29 2007 @ 02:52 PM EDT (#170875) #

Ron - Friday, June 29 2007 @ 03:19 PM EDT (#170877) #

Well right now, Thigpen is the platoon partner for Stairs at first base and appears to be slated to start three of the next six games. For a team that still has designs at the playoffs, Thigpen is right where he should be. They can worry about his future after the allstar break, when we're a bit healthier.

If the Jays are still trying to make the playoffs, why is Jason Phillips still on the 25 man roster? I can't imagine Thigpen being any worse than Phillips behind the plate (and he would be batter at the plate). The Jays are dropping the ball in Thigpen's development. If you want to platoon him at 1B, he should also be getting playing time as the backup catcher.

Another option is moving Hill to SS and Thigpen to 2B right now, while releasing Clayton.

williams_5 - Friday, June 29 2007 @ 03:53 PM EDT (#170878) #

Speaking of Boston, how bout that Julio Lugo? I was among the many that thought the Jays should have opened the purse strings a bit more to put him at short stop. Lo and behold, his .190/.256/.283 line is much worse than that of Royce Clayton, which is obviously saying a lot. The Jays dodged a costly bullet on that one.

Mike Green - Friday, June 29 2007 @ 04:17 PM EDT (#170879) #

Lugo is an excellent bet to improve substantially in the second half. His batting average is below the Mendoza line courtesy of an execrable .209 BABIP. Some of that is due to a below par line drive rate, but some of it is just horrific luck. He has some pop and good speed (20-0 SB/CS). I would be very surprised if his BABIP is below .270 over the remainder of the year. His prospects would be much more worrisome if he had deterioration in his W/K/XBH rates, but he is basically at his career norms in those respects.

The Red Sox have smartly moved him down in the order, and that will help reduce the pressure. Many people said similar things about Pedroia (who had similar issues) last year.

CeeBee - Friday, June 29 2007 @ 06:34 PM EDT (#170884) #

If the Jays won't give Thigpen time behind the plate I'd like to see Sal back up instead of Phillips. I don't mind Thigpen platooning at first till Overbay comes back because having a 3rd catcher with versatility isn't such a bad thing, especially with the small bench teams like to carry. As for the future, I fail to see how giving Thigpen the backup catching job at least after Overbay comes back could be any worse than having Phillips on the roster.

williams_5 - Friday, June 29 2007 @ 09:04 PM EDT (#170887) #

That's an interesting point about Lugo. I obviously didn't look too much beyond his main stat line, as I'm admittedly pretty unfamiliar with those peripherals. In my original post, I was actually going to make a crack about paying an extra 7 million per year to get some stolen bases, but I guess there's a good case to be made that Lugo hasn't lost it quite yet. So yeah, it's probably too early to label his contract an albatross, but it'll be interesting to see how those averages look at the end of the season and in the next couple of years.

Smithers - Friday, June 29 2007 @ 10:23 PM EDT (#170890) #

Well, it couldn't have happened to a better person - proving again that the more things change the more they stay the same, our old friend Shea Hillenbrand has been designated for assignment by the Angels. Surprise, surprise, it comes after Shea complained about a lack of playing time because younger, better players were more productive and taking away his at bats. Maybe the Padres could find room for him alongside Milton Bradley?

FranklyScarlet - Saturday, June 30 2007 @ 09:31 AM EDT (#170894) #

13th Round : Jon Talley

http://go.sosd.com/servlet/nrp?cmd=sty&cid=RIM&pgn=1&ino=1179943&cat=North%20County&lno=1

Rob - Saturday, June 30 2007 @ 12:41 PM EDT (#170896) #

If Gibbons is the main reason for keeping him on the roster, JP needs to tell him to manage the team he's given, not the team he wants to have.

According to Jason Phillips' page at the Baseball Cube and John Gibbons' MLB.com bio, they only played together in Norfolk in 2001. Must have been some 19 games.

28 June 2007: What's the New Mary Jane? | 29 comments | Create New Account

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