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We're agreed, are we not, that the first 41 games of the season didn't count - that the team (and the players) rolled up some impressive numbers against the inferior competition in the Al Central and West...

So how did everybody do in the last 121 games? Let's have a look. Players are sorted, as always when it's up to me, by Runs Created per 27 outs:

             AB   R    H   TB  2B  3B  HR RBI  BB  SO  SB CS  SH SF HBP GDP BAVG  OBP  SLG  RC  RC/27
Ruiz    115  25   36   73  7   0  10  17  10  35   1  1   0  1  4    6 .313 .385 .635  25  8.06
Lind    435  68  130  246 32   0  28  79  39  80   1  1   0  4  5   11 .299 .360 .566  86  7.09
Overbay    330  44   89  151 27   1  11  45  57  79   0  0   0  1  0    6 .270 .376 .458  59  6.23
Rolen    343  54  103  155 26   1   8  52  33  45   3  4   0  7  5    4 .300 .363 .452  57  5.93
Scutaro    419  64  118  164 25   0   7  40  55  56  11  3   3  5  3    7 .282 .365 .391  64  5.26
Snider    145  22   35   63  8   1   6  17  22  54   0  1   0  1  3    3 .241 .351 .434  23  5.19
Hill    505  73  133  239 31   0  25  74  31  71   4  1   1  2  4    9 .263 .310 .473  72  4.90
Encarnacion 154  25   37   68  5   1   8  23  13  29   1  0   0  3  3    2 .240 .306 .442  22  4.58
Inglett    89  11  25   31   4   1   0   6   8  21   3  1   1  0  1    0 .281 .347 .348  12  4.56
Rios    266  29   70  113  16   0   9  41  17  48  16  3   0  3  3    8 .263 .311 .425  34  4.42
Bautista    263  39   57  108   9   3  12  34  41  65   1  0   3  2  3    7 .217 .327 .411  36  4.39
Wells    460  57  120  181  27   2  10  45  33  69  11  4   0  4  1   11 .261 .309 .393  54  4.03
Chavez    130   9   34   48   8   0   2  13   6  21   1  1   2  0  0    2 .262 .294 .369  13  3.51
McDonald    134  15   35   54   7   0   4  13   1  16   0  2   1  1  2    1 .261 .275 .403  14  3.49
Phillips    18   1   5    8   3  0   0   2   0   4   0  0   0  0  0    1 .278 .278 .444   2  3.43
Millar    184  19   36   60   9   0   5  16  27  39   0  0   0  0  1    5 .196 .302 .326  18  3.18
Barajas    316  29   62  118   8   0  16  49  14  60   1  0   1  3  0    4 .196 .228 .373  26  2.61
Barrett    18   3   3   6   0   0   1   2   1   5   0  0   0  0  0    0 .167 .211 .333   1  2.21
Adams    20   2    4    4   0   0   0   0   1   1   0  0   0  0  0    0 .200 .238 .200   1  1.59
Dellucci    25   2    1    2   1   0   0   2   3   7   0  0   0  0  1    2 .040 .172 .080   0  0.33
And the pitchers:

              G  GS  GF  CG   W  L  SV BSv Hld    IP    H    R  ER  BB  SO  HR HBP  ERA    BF  BAVG  OBP  SLG
Halladay    23  23   0   8   9  9              171.0  171  59  53  27 151  17   3  2.79  694  .261 .290 .388
Romero    26  26   0   0  11  9              157.0  173  84  81  75 128  17   9  4.64  690  .288 .374 .432
Tallet    27  19   1   0   5  8              118.1  136  76  73  51  89  13   5  5.55  533  .289 .360 .448
Richmond    19  16   1   0   4  9               91.2  103  69  66  42  79  21   0  6.48  410  .281 .354 .527
Cecil    15  14   1   0   5  4               73.1   99  54  51  34  54  15   2  6.26  342  .326 .395 .559
Rzepczynski  11  11   0   0   2  4               61.1   51  27  25  30  60   7   1  3.67  261  .225 .317 .366
Purcey    4   4   0   0   1  1               22.1   26  13  13  12  13   2   0  5.24  103  .292 .376 .416
Mills    2   2   0   0   0  1                7.2   14  12  12   6   9   4   0 14.09   42  .400 .476 .800
Ray    1   1   0   0   0  1                4.1    6   5   4   1   4   1   0  8.31   21  .300 .333 .550
Camp    46   0  12   0   2  5   1   0   4   64.2  57  28  24  22  51   5   4  3.34  267  .238 .312 .364
League    51   0  13   0   2  5   0   1   8   56.2   56  31  29  13  63   7   6  4.61  239  .259 .319 .426
Carlson    52   0   9   0   0  4   0   1   7   46.2   50  29  27  15  39   5   1  5.21  204  .273 .324 .448
Frasor    45   0  31   0   3  3  10   2   2   43.2   34  16  15  15  47   4   2  3.09  178  .215 .288 .310
Janssen    21   5   5   0   2  4   1   0   2   40.0   59  29  26  14  24   5   2  5.85  192  .341 .393 .538
Downs    30   0  14   0   1  3   4   4   7   27.1   33  13  12  11  21   3   1  3.95  124  .300 .363 .473
Accardo    26   0   5   0   0  0   1   0   4   24.2   23   8   7  17  18   2   2  2.55  107  .267 .393 .372
Hayhurst    15   0   5   0   0  0   0   0   0   22.2   23   7   7   9  13   2   2  2.78   97  .274 .351 .417
Roenicke    13   0   3   0   0  0   0   0   1   17.2   19  15  14  12  19   2   1  7.13   84  .271 .381 .386
Ryan    18   0   5   0   0  1   0   0   2   14.0   14   8   8  11   7   3   0  5.14   63  .280 .403 .540
Wolfe    12   0   8   0   1  2   0   1   0   12.1   22  14  13   7   8   5   1  9.49   65  .400 .469 .727

A few related observations, why not....

It's nothing short of astonishing that the team went 48-73 while scoring and allowing roughly the same amount of runs (591-597). That's very hard to do.

One hitter of consequence was significantly better in the second portion of the year. That would be Travis Snider, of course, who was simply awful over the first quarter. Still, despite the low BAVG and the stupendous number of strikeouts, he was a little better than league average when he came back. McDonald and Chavez were also better in the second part, but neither had enough plate appearances over the first quarter for it to mean anything. And neither was much good anyway.

Three hitters performed at basically the same level in both parts of the season: Lyle Overbay, Alex Rios, and Vernon Wells. Overbay's RC/27 was 6.09 in the first part of the year, 6.23 in the second. The optimistic point of view in mid-May was that while Lind and Hill and Scutaro were certain to cool off, Rios and Wells were certain to heat up. Rios and Wells did no such thing, of course - both tailed off slightly from their depressing getaways - Rios started out at 4.66 RC/27 and dropped off to 4.42 the rest of the way; Wells went from 4.34 to 4.03.

If Rod Barajas goes elsewhere... who cares?

Randy Ruiz, obviously, isn't really that good. He'll be 32 years old in a couple of weeks, and he didn't hit this well in his 11 years in the minors. Plus he's blocked by Adam Lind,  Lyle Overbay, and Travis Snider. But all of those guys are LH batters, so Ruiz may be able to claim some platoon at bats. But a regular outfield of Lind, Wells, and Snider is out of the question - it would possibly be the worst defensive outfield in the major leagues.

I thought the offense would score 800 runs. They didn't - they scored 798.

On the mound, two pitchers performed at roughly the same level in both parts of the season: Roy Halladay, thanks to an extremely impressive burst in the final month, and Brandon League. Halladay's ERAs were 2.78 and 2.79, League's were 4.50 and 4.61 with generally similar peripherals in both parts of the season (League also sharply reduced his BBs allowed in the second part.)

The team went into the season with two more or less established starting pitchers and a whole bunch of rookies. While this was obviously a situation fraught with The Peril, in every crisis looms an opportunity. I reasoned that if just one of the kids stepped up, it would be enough - barely - to keep the staff above water. And one of the kids, Ricky Romero, did step up and do a solid job in the rotation pretty much all season long. Alas, one of the two established starters went out for the year in the second week of the season, which pretty much cancelled out the good effect.

And pretty well all the rookies ran out of gas. Or something. After the middle of August, Romero went 3-4, 5.59; Cecil went 2-3, 8.22; Richmond went 2-5, 8.73 (Richmond also missed six weeks in the middle of the year.)

And the bullpen, with the exceptions of Frasor and Camp, pretty much  went to hell.

So...what to do with this bunch?

Well, they scored 74 fewer runs than the Red Sox. And they allowed 35 more. Do you want to find a way to make up the 109 runs difference? Or do you want to give up? Boston and New York have money and brains. In this millennium, the Rays slipped ahead of both of them once; the Blue Jays beat out Boston once.

Well, I figure you still have to try.
Your 2009 Blue Jays | 32 comments | Create New Account
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TamRa - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 01:51 PM EDT (#207068) #
We're agreed, are we not, that the first 41 games of the season didn't count - that the team (and the players) rolled up some impressive numbers against the inferior competition in the Al Central and West...

I'm not sure why those games count any less because they are bunched up instead of spread over the course of the season. The Yanks and Red Sox played those teams just as often as we did.

John Northey - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 02:06 PM EDT (#207069) #
It is interesting to see that no one really jumps out at you from pre or post the 'good times' among those likely to stick in 2010.  I still have hope as, again, the Jays have to get lucky one of these years.  If they went as far above their runs for/against record as they seem to keep going below then you can add 16 wins fairly quickly to their record (ie: from 75 to 91 wins).  Not asking much, just some luck in 1 run games and the like. 

In 2010 we'll (hopefully) have Halladay mixed with Romero, Marcum, and 2 of a cast of many in the rotation (Cecil, Rzep, McGowan, Mills, Litsch, ...).  The pen has to be stronger without Ryan around and adding in at least one of the kids for long relief.  The offense will be missing a key part in Scutaro (injury will cut effectiveness if re-signs, if doesn't re-sign then replacement will almost certainly play worse than Scutaro did this year) but also will have a stronger Snider, Lind will regress most likely but Wells should rebound some.  Catcher was an offensive black hole this year, so it can't get worse (one hopes).  Millar is gone (one really hopes) which is a major plus. We do lose the 1/2 year of Rolen though which hurts a lot.

The more I look at it the more likely an 85+ win season looks for 2010 and if the Jays can add a solid 3B (or get Encarnacion to play at his potential) and find a solid SS and a 1/2 decent catcher (90 OPS+ between SS/CA would make me happy) then this team really could crack 90 wins.

Yes, I'm an optimist :)

Matthew E - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 02:15 PM EDT (#207071) #

So...what to do with this bunch?

Blow it up.

Don't resign anybody. Trade everybody that anybody wants, for prospects, and release the rest. (Including Wells.) If you don't have a 25-man roster at the end of this process, sign spare parts for no more than 1.5 million a year each to fill the gaps. And change managers. I don't want to recognize anybody's name next year.

Why not? What's the downside? The new guys might actually rise to the occasion, which is something the current bunch never did.


TamRa - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 02:41 PM EDT (#207073) #
Well, they scored 74 fewer runs than the Red Sox. And they allowed 35 more. Do you want to find a way to make up the 109 runs difference? Or do you want to give up? Boston and New York have money and brains. In this millennium, the Rays slipped ahead of both of them once; the Blue Jays beat out Boston once.

Given that the 2008 squad gave up 171 fewer runs than the 2009 team did, I don't think that's an impossible task at all.

1. Doc stays Doc
2. Marcum returns to being Marcum or something reasonably close to it
((which by the way he only had 25 starts in 2008)
3. Romero equals Burnett (105 in 2008 to 102 in 2009)
4. Zep equals Listch (both were at 119 albeit Zep in fewer starts)
5. McGowan was a 98 in 2008, can he or someone else get close to that in 2010? There are a lot of alternatives.

Frasor was better in 2009 than Ryan was in 2008;
Downs returns to being Downs;
League and Carlson would have to go back to something close to what they did in 2008 which is a big wild card although there's reason for hope;
Camp (who I don't trust still) was better in 2009 than Frasor was as the fifth-most-busy guy in 2008;
Tallet goes back to being a full time reliever of 2008 quality;

then there's Accardo and others.

You could quite posibly make up 110 runs JUST on the pitching side of the issue.

(Yes, Romero might regress but Listch will be coming back, Cecil might as easily progress as Romero regress, so forth and so on)

Offensively -
If Wells simply reverted to his even numbered year rate (which is far from an impossibility) it's a big step.
Lind might regress but we can't assume so.
Hill will probably see 10-12 homers turn into doubles but his OPS+ will probably stay in the same neighborhood;
if Scoot returned he'll revert probably but only to about average as a hitter; EE should revert to something like the 105 guy he was over the previous three years and could easily break out and have a best-ever year at any time (he ended up at 95 as a Blue Jay and hit 8 homers in 40ish games (September caveat applies);
Snider showed progress and logically should improve some;
Who can say about Overbay but an O-tista (Or OveRuizy) platoon would theoretically produce strong offense.

That leaves catcher and one more hitter. Figgins or Bay or whoever for the hitter....good luck getting good offense out of catcher unless you can somehow presuade the dodgers to give up martin and pray for a rebound in his power.

Yes, the offense could be better - or it could be worse (dramatic reversals from Lind and Hill, no offense at all from SS, no recovery from Wells and EE, Snider stalls)

What would I do?

I'd rase the payroll to $110 - I'd do everything I could to sign Bay (not a huge fanboy but apparently the team loves him) and Figgins. I'd see if the Indians would take EE and a pitcher like Purcey or Perez for Shoppach, I'd offer Scoot arbitration and hope the heel forced him to accept; I'd try to puck up young fast and cheap bench players like Hu rather than resign guys like McDonald. I'd see if Bautista would resign for a reasonable price or non-tender him and then try to resign him afterwards to somethig like $2 mil at most (and before September I didn't even want him back but he was impressive)

My lineup would be
Figgins - 3B
Scutaro - SS
Bay - LF
Lind - DH
Hill - 2B
Snider - RF
Wells - CF
Overbay - 1B
Shoppach - C

Oh, and I'd fire Cito and hire someone who wasn't married to putting Wells too high in the order. I think he does better out of the "pressure" spots. Right now I'm thinking jump on Freddi Gonzalez if the Marlins ditch him but I'd be okay with Butter having the job too.

Yes the outfield defense will suck. There's nothing for it.

But yeah - not that Boston will stand still or anything - but given the disparity in the pitching between 2008 and 2009, I'm not pessimistic we can significantly close that gap.

the question is, will the Jays - for once in this millinium, actually win as many games as their run diffirential says they should?

Mike Green - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 02:57 PM EDT (#207074) #

So...what to do with this bunch?

Blow it up.

What the anarchists term "creative destruction".  In the case of the 2009 Jays, it has a lot of long as the owners sell the team to someone who really cares.

Speaking of this, can someone please explain the marketing of the Jays outside the GTA to me.  In the old days, the Jays were on the radio numerous places outside of the GTA, including the prairies. Now, there aint much at all.  I would have thought the club would have more incentive now to market itself outside the GTA due to the exclusivity of internet rights in Canada and the presence of Sportsnet elsewhere.  Further, is there no way that the Vancouver Canadians affiliation couldn't be obtained by the Jays?  It would actually be worth something to them, and it's worth absolutely nothing to the As.

katman - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 03:07 PM EDT (#207077) #
I'm (mostly) with Matthew E. Blow it up. This arrangement doesn't work, and this philosophy of endless long-shot mediocrity doesn't work. All it gets you in the AL East is the Toronto Maple Leafs of baseball. And I stopped watching or caring about the Leafs years ago.

Fire Cito. Let Barajas go. Let Scutaro go. Etc. Shop Doc, even Hill and Lind and Frasor and Downs, and see. Keep Chavez, as a cheaper option with better D and - as the table shows - better O (in a small sample). At the very least, he's a solid, cheap backup.

The difference between Matthew and myself is, I don't release people unless there are credible prospects in the organization to fill the slot, who need a shot. Would it be better to play Coats in CF, given that you'd pick up some defense while losing offense? Probably not statistically, and if you've released Wells, not financially. So I do not release Vernon - at least, not this year. I DO bench him once a viable, ready-to-go long-term prospect shows up for CF, via development or trade. And if that prospect does well in the bigs, Wells is released. Barring significant improvement, of course. Which, given age etc., I do not expect to see.

How Anthopoulos deals with all this stuff will go a long way toward shaping my opinion of him. Which, right now, is neutral but low confidence.
Magpie - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 03:19 PM EDT (#207079) #
I'd see if Bautista would resign for a reasonable price

He's such a weird player, I'd almost like to keep him around just to see how he surprises me next time. The backup third-baseman is also the team's best defensive outfielder? Easily, at all three spots? The guy with the .235 BAVG gets on base quite a bit more often than Aaron Hill (not to mention Vernon Wells.) The guy who hits 1 home run in April, 1 in June, 1 in July, and none at all in May and August hits 10 - ten? - homers in September?

He's an amusement ride!
TimberLee - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 03:44 PM EDT (#207084) #

This is great fun, trying to figure how the Jays might do in 2010, but shouldn't we be reasonable and assume that Halladay gets traded over the winter and start from there? Of course it's more difficult because we don't know what the team can get for him, but it doesn't seem worth putting much thought into next year until we know what happens there.

  Texas and the Dodgers look like possibilities to me - Holland, Teagarden, Martin, Hu....

Magpie - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 03:57 PM EDT (#207087) #
Given that the 2008 squad gave up 171 fewer runs than the 2009 team did...

Yeah. That's a lot of runs. They went from having the best pitching in the major leagues to having the 22nd best (10th in the AL.)
Chuck - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 04:02 PM EDT (#207089) #
The backup third-baseman is also the team's best defensive outfielder?

Odd, eh? And everyone here was wondering, when he was acquired, if he'd even play a passable left field in a platoon role. Who saw this coming?

His 100 OPS+ and his versatility in this day of 4-man benches are going to result in several suitors should the Jays elect to forego arbitration.
Magpie - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 04:12 PM EDT (#207091) #
shouldn't we be reasonable and assume that Halladay gets traded over the winter

We do not have a large enough number to tally the many reasons I should never be a general manager - what, me explain what I'm doing to corporate executives? me supervise a large group of people? me listen to advice? - but it's possible that one of those reasons would be that I'm temperamentally incapable of writing off a season. Never mind writing off five of them, as some of you seem to think best. Maybe you're right, I don't know - I just can't go there. All I can do is try to figure what needs to be done in order to win next time.

It's how my mind works!

That said, why would I trade Halladay this winter? Oh, if the team is 35-45 next July, I'll certainly consider it. Very seriously indeed. I don't expect there'll be any need for a public auction, either - I imagine GMs will be calling in with offers.

But what if the team is 45-35? Even this past season, after the 0-9 road trip and everything else that had gone  wrong, the team had a 43-41 record when they finished up their first trip to New York.

The Halladay-Will-Be-Traded stories broke the very next day.

Man, if you ever want to see your ballplayers give up on a season, just make them believe  that management already has.
FisherCat - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 04:13 PM EDT (#207092) #

As the media and many Bauxites have often pointed out, it starts with Halladay & trickles down from there.  If you hang onto him for 2010, then you need to really get creative to fill the offensive / #2 starter holes that the roster has.  Unfortunately you can't really do this by "buying" the pieces in free agency.  This is because you most likely only have Doc for 2010 and then he bolts as an FA himself.  Then what are you gonna do with the 4 or 5 year contracts you just wrote up for the Bay's & Figgins' of the world?  You can't just go Marlins and have a fire sale for 2011!

Soooo, if Halladay stays then you have to evaluate which prospects are your most expendable bargaining chips.  Use these chips to get high-end guys that are becoming too expensive for teams similar to the Jays and are near playing for their 1st FA contract (yes I'm talking about you Prince Fielder).  Then mix and match from your positional strengths for weaknesses @ other positions.  Don't worry about the middle relief, but see if you can get a young closer (ala the Rockies did for Street last offseason).  These types of moves get you into the $90mil range!

But if these moves prove to be too difficult to cull together in one offseason, OR Doc says "thanks, but no thanks".  Then it's time to cut ties with any & all guys that aren't in the 3-5 year plan and stock the AA & AAA teams with near-ready MLB talent!

Mike Green - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 04:21 PM EDT (#207093) #
No one in the organization fully committed to winning in 2009.  That started with the owners.  After the first 41 games, that position was really quite bizarre.  If you start off 27-14, and Hill, Lind and Scutaro all appear to have taken steps forward, do you really believe that your chances will be any better in 2010 because you have Shaun Marcum?  I love Marcum, but that position which was taken all the way up and down the organization just doesn't make sense, except if you're not really concerned about winning primarily but about matching expenses to revenues.

As for Bautista, he'd actually been a decent corner OF according to UZR prior to 2009.  The Pirates had put him in centerfield for a prolonged period one year; that worked out about as well as curry powder in borscht.

#2JBrumfield - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 04:24 PM EDT (#207094) #

Speaking of this, can someone please explain the marketing of the Jays outside the GTA to me.  In the old days, the Jays were on the radio numerous places outside of the GTA, including the prairies. Now, there aint much at all.  I would have thought the club would have more incentive now to market itself outside the GTA due to the exclusivity of internet rights in Canada and the presence of Sportsnet elsewhere.  Further, is there no way that the Vancouver Canadians affiliation couldn't be obtained by the Jays?  It would actually be worth something to them, and it's worth absolutely nothing to the As.

Mike, these cogent conclusions are too damn logical and make way too much sense!  I think legislation should be introduced that makes it mandatory for Blue Jays games on the radio throughout the country and should be a condition to obtain a CRTC licence.  The worst part is the few affiliates still left don't even come close to airing all 162 games, opting for weekends or weekdays only in some cases.

The Jays should have at least one Canadian minor league club somwhere and Vancouver's as good as any place because Nat Bailey Stadium is an awesome place.  There have been rumblings the C's want to return to Triple A but they'd have to upgrade the stadium to meet AAA standards but I think Nat Bailey is a heritage landmark.  Maybe the Jays will consider Vancouver an alternative once their deal with Las Vegas runs out after 2010.  Sure, it's a long flight but it's not much worse than Vegas.  Ottawa would be good too.

John Northey - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 05:27 PM EDT (#207100) #
Eh, put a AAA team in Montreal, AA in Ottawa and A in Vancouver if you really want to go nuts :)

I'd love a minor league team in southern Ontario somewhere but doubt it is coming anytime soon.  Once the visa issue in the US cleared up ML teams stopped wanting to put minor league teams up here.  Attendance was not great during the late 80's/90's period when the minors exploded here and I doubt it ever would be.  A couple of low A summer teams would do fine but AAA/AA teams are not likely to do well.  Teams with no affiliation do well as fans like to cheer on teams that are actually fighting for something.  The 'quality' of play isn't as important as the fighting for a title of some kind, at least imo.  I know I'd find AAA ball fairly dull as the team is just a holding pen for the majors - give me A ball or AA instead where the guys will likely be there for the full season.
Impossibles - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 05:52 PM EDT (#207104) #

You want to know why Jays games aren't  broadcast throughout Canada?  Ratings ratings ratings.

More people will listen to shania twain beatbox yankee doodle dandy over and over again rather than listen to the Bluejays.  Radio companies are out to maximize their listener base and minimize their costs, and the way they do that is by appealing to the lowest common denominator.

I blame capitalism.

ayjackson - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 06:06 PM EDT (#207105) #

Should put a AAA team in Winnipeg.  They've been averaging 7-8k in attendance for the Indy Northern League.  They sell out 32 luxury boxes.  They'd have to play the first few weeks in Rogers or Dunedin, but that isn't a big problem.  They have multiple flights per day to key airports such as Chicago, Denver, Toronto and Minneapolis (all hubs).


Mike Green - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 09:00 PM EDT (#207115) #
There are pretty obviously a lot of Jay fans willing to make the drive to Seattle from BC.  I am sure that those fans and quite a few others would like the opportunity to listen to games if they happen to be driving, or to listen to Gerry and Alan instead of the TV crew sometimes.
ayjackson - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 10:56 PM EDT (#207129) #
Winnipeg doesn't carry the Jays games on the radio, but that baseball mecca of Winkler, Manitoba will interrupt Conway Twitty for most of the games.  Unfortunately, if I'm travelling north of the city, I usually lose the reception.
sduguid - Tuesday, October 06 2009 @ 11:13 PM EDT (#207130) #
Mike Green, you're correct on that count.  In Victoria, there is almost never a way to get a game on the radio.  There is a very static filled station in Vancouver that will play one every few weeks but that's it.

My main complaint is that the content just isn't available to me.

No radio.
Any of the games that folks in Ontario watch on Rogers Preview are not available out here, as we're served by Shaw.

Even though these games are not available to me, they are blacked out on MLB.TV

I'm sure people are tired of my semi-annual complaints about the blackout but it just doesn't make sense that the games are blacked out for me when I'm so far from Toronto.  It also greatly hinders my ability to watch on newer technologies such as a mobile device.

brent - Wednesday, October 07 2009 @ 01:13 AM EDT (#207132) #

I have a 30 team blackout. Stop complaining.

92-93 - Wednesday, October 07 2009 @ 01:21 AM EDT (#207133) #
It's funny to read about all these blackouts when I can hear the Blue Jays while driving in my car in Teaneck, NJ (10m over the bridge into Manhattan).
Mylegacy - Wednesday, October 07 2009 @ 02:15 AM EDT (#207134) #
BB: Tell me Mylegacy - given your many years and grey hairs whatever should our baby Blue Jays do?
ML: BB - I'm glad you asked. Personally, I'd be happy if they did nothing but use the pieces littering the dressing room benches at the end of the last game and integrate them as follows:

Keep Sir Halladay. Surely, he is the noblest of them all.

The return to full health and renewed form by several of: Marcum, McGowan, Janssen, Mills, Ray and Accardo will - with the other incumbents on hand give us a more than adequate set of bowlers - er - pitchers.

As far as batsmen are concerned: Lind and Hill are for the ages. A full year of Ruiz (even if just as the right handed bat to Overbay's left handed one) and Snider no longer a brash 21 but a strapping 22 would be welcome additions. Wells is due - PLEASE - let Wells be due. I promise to eat my new black Tilly Winter Hat, and it's Life Long Guarantee, IF the silly pri*k doesn't SIGNIFICANTLY improve his results! EE is at least an adequate defensive 3rd and given his increasing understand of AL pitching - I think he has a chance to at least somewhat impress. Dopriak might be an interesting in house addition. Sanchez - the little Angel - he of the 305/363/428 and 17 error stats at AAA might also be a player of interest should Jmac and Scutaro decide grass is greener south of the border. As to Barajas and Chavez - they are what they are - and personally I see no better match available by either trade or rental.

The above team - with ANY pitching stability could give us the chance to be a contender. As to Cito - bless his little World Series rings - personally - he could stay or go - I'd lose neither sleep or be distressed either way. So be it.

In closing - fear not my little ones. Spring will come and with it another dawn and hope will spring - like it has done since 1977 - from our manly chests - and we will ride it forward - until the lazy pri*ks dash it for us by  early June. Sigh. 

I  may be the only one left with a Baby Blue heart but I promise whatever unfolds I'll remain faithful. Trust me my dears, trust me...
Mike Green - Wednesday, October 07 2009 @ 09:22 AM EDT (#207144) #
SDuguid, you're right to be irritated. Victoria in the summer with a ballgame on the radio would be pretty close to paradise. Somehow I doubt that a widespread love of Shania Twain or hip hop is what stands in the way of this dream.
MatO - Wednesday, October 07 2009 @ 10:16 AM EDT (#207147) #

AA was on the FAN with McCown last night.  I've heard him many times before and he has a voice that sounds like a 14 year old boy going through puberty.  Anyways, he said he's already prepared a plan for the future and presented it to Beeston.  It will be presented to Rogers and the direction of the team in the future should be known by the end of the week.  He said the plan will drive the budget and not the other way round.  Although he did not come right out and say it, I got the impression he was in favour of re-tooling (I wouldn't say blow it up) rather than trying to make a big splash in the off-season in free agency and going for it next year.  Again, just my impression.  I'm sure you can hear the interview on the FAN website.

Richard S.S. - Wednesday, October 07 2009 @ 11:42 AM EDT (#207158) #

If you have listened to the Alex Anthopoulos interview on the 6th, you can draw some conclusions.  Add in the upcoming Paul Beeston and Pat Gillick interviews and you can draw some more.  And won't that be facinating.

If the Rogers Center (AKA Skydome) is run with better efficiency and to fuller occupancy year round, it should be able to fund the Blue Jays, entirely with monies earned by it.  It should be able to totally fund Dome operations and staff.  It should be able to provide a profit to Rogers Corp., in time, as well.  It should be able to Buy and support a CFL team in the dome (the Toronto ???)Why do you think the emphasis on running a facility is the prerequisite to the new Presidential hire?  Done right, this could be a license to print money!  I can see it's possible, so can Rogers, they'll never sell now.

There are two main options for this off-season.  One option and it's myriad permutations involves trading Roy Halladay.  The second and only other option and it's myriad permutations involves keeping Roy Halladay.  Everything else is semantics.

Unless Vernon Wells is traded, in a package, with Roy Halladay, he will be with us for a long time.  Whether or not he is overpaid is immaterial, the GM has to deal with it and so can you.


VBF - Wednesday, October 07 2009 @ 11:55 AM EDT (#207160) #

Mike Green is absolutely right. I thought it was very strange how the Jays play a video before each game showing clips of Jays mixed in with famous Canadian locations, and end it off by saying "Canada's Team". So obviously they are aware that the Jays should be marketed as Canada's Team, yet all meaningful opportunity to do this isn't carried out.

Rogers owns the Jays so you'd think that they'd use the television and radio network they also own to not only broadcast all 162 games, but Spring Training games and make these broadcasts available to everyone in Canada. They have full control over this and no doubt the results would be worthwhile. They refused CBC's bid this year to broadcast 10 or so games. Why not drop the price for the TV rights and get your product on televisions that don't even have cable? Is there anything more national than CBC?

This year, half the crowd at each Jays/Mariners game in Seattle were Jays fans giving their team a home team advantage. It was a weekday series so you can bet that these people all used up their vacation time to watch the team. Don't you think it would make sense to try and capitalize on this fandom and make some money off of it, while giving these people the product they can't seem to get? Organize bus trips to see the Jays, play exhibition games at BC Place, open up Jays Shop stores in Canadian malls. It's absolutely inexcusable to see Beeston complaining about losing GM as a sponsor, or having to fire 60 marketing people, when they're making no effort to make money off the rabid fan bases outside of Toronto. A two game exhibition series at BC Place between the Jays and M's would draw big crowds and big money.

Then to see that Quebec, Winnipeg, Edmonton, Calgary, Victoria (Victoria Seals are bringing in a couple thousand people to their little ballpark each game), and even Okotoks (Also drawing a couple thousand each game) are all having more success with minor league baseball than many U.S. teams, just cries out for the Jays to get involved. Become a major sponsor, bring these teams their own Flashback Fridays with Jays Alumni, Jays related promotional nights. There are so many ways to brand this team across Canada, and so many baseball fans they could please, yet they just don't. It's absolutely mind boggling.

To put this in perspective, the New Hampshire Fishercats had a Jonathan Papelbon bobblehead night this year. Why do the Red Sox, a team very financially stable still feel the need to market themselves outside of the Boston area with a team that isn't even their affiliate?

ramone - Wednesday, October 07 2009 @ 12:52 PM EDT (#207168) #

This is from Jeff Blair's chat today:

[Comment From The Duke]
"How concerned should Jays fans be about Travis Snider's slide this season?"

Jeff Blair:  "The Duke,
If Cito's back, be very concerned. If he's back and Dwayne Murphy's the hitting coach, don't be concerned at all. I just don't think Snider and Cito mesh. Matter of fact, I know they don't

Mike Green - Wednesday, October 07 2009 @ 01:39 PM EDT (#207177) #
There are some excellent ideas there, VBF. 

I might add that I see less of the Jays in the community here than I did in the early 80s, and a lot less of them here than the Red Sox are in Boston. 

Dave Till - Thursday, October 08 2009 @ 08:11 AM EDT (#207227) #
One thing worth mentioning about the 2009 Jays is the large number of extra inning games they played - 20, which is the largest total in the American League since 2005. The next-highest totals were 16 (Seattle) and 14 (Minnesota). The Jays lost more extra-inning games - 13 - than any of their divisional rivals played.

When one out of every eight games goes longer than expected, that's got to play havoc with bullpen management, player fatigue, etc.

If the Jays had gone 13-7 in extra-inning games rather than 7-13, they would have finished at .500 this year.

John Northey - Thursday, October 08 2009 @ 01:55 PM EDT (#207253) #
Canada wide marketing has died off for the Jays from what I have seen.  Back in the 70's when I was a kid (yes, I'm old) I remember getting a Blue Jays sports bag full of stuff including a cap that I still have through Cub Scouts.  There used to be games in Vancouver the odd spring, and promotional tours of the players through southern Ontario.  In 1987 Jesse Barfield came up to Kitchener for a talk and stuff at Sportsworld (now closed) which was great.

Today I hear of some signings the day of games in local GTA car dealerships and the like but that's about it.  As mentioned, they should be playing spring games out west or in Montreal or in Ottawa or somewhere that is fairly close to opening day locations but in Canada.  This year they start off in Texas, so nowhere is close but Winnipeg is the same time zone thus might not be a bad idea.  Especially if the Twins would consent to a game there (assuming they are willing to risk bad weather).  Given the weather risk, a Saturday Vancouver game with a day off on the Sunday to travel to Texas could work, or a Saturday game in Montreal in an attempt to revive some baseball spirit there.

Another idea is to see if ex-Jays would be interested in doing a travel show across the country mid-summer - playing local teams as a goodwill thing which would raise Jay awareness across the country.  I'm certain more than 10 or 20 ex players would love to play again for a couple of weeks, even if just 3 inning games where the rules are made up as you go (which these old timer games tend to end up as).  See if guys like Fergie Jenkins would be interested in doing guest appearances too (he still looks like he could pitch).

Probably an assortment of reasons these ideas won't work, but it is fun thinking of them.
vw_fan17 - Thursday, October 08 2009 @ 04:05 PM EDT (#207257) #
In 1987 Jesse Barfield came up to Kitchener for a talk and stuff at Sportsworld (now closed) which was great.

Wow, that just caught me right out of the blue.. I left town in '04, and either it was forgotten, or my family just never mentioned that it's gone.. I totally did a double take, and couldn't believe it. The old Pioneer mini-golf/go-karting place and then Sportsworld were a fixture of K-W for the 25 years I lived there.. Hard to believe.
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